Torture effectiveness

WARNING: Although the idea for this subject was initially stimulated by current events, the purpose of this thread is NOT to debate the morality of torture, NOT to insert political or philosophical doctrines, NOT to sneak in ideology of any kind. Its sole purpose is to discover whether torture in any or all of its forms can be relied upon to extract accurate information. Anyone who cannot stay within those guidelines should probably not participate.

Is torture of any kind a reliable way to extract accurate information? I have found it hard to get authoratative answers to that question. Most discussions focus on morality, legality, or political/military issues and either don't address the question or offer conflicting opinions.

I'm interested in getting other informed views on the subject.

Brightnorm

In the event I am subjected to Country/Western music I would tell you whatever you wanted to hear to make it stop.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Others here might say the same for Led Zepplin. Or Carmen DC Talk Bach whatever.
I am not the least bit convinced it gets {Accurate} Info. Info? yes Accurate? Not always maybe sometimes? Not real likely anyone overly "UP" on that would post to admit they were involved. IMHO
Topper /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Interesting. The official "line," of course, is that information received under that kind of duress may not be all that reliable -- look at the 1930s show trials in which Stalin's "enemies" fessed up to things they didn't do (they were plotting with Trotsky or something) -- they'd been broken or they were protecting their children, etc. On the other hand, look at three countries with very volatile histories in the past few decades: Vietnam, Yugoslavia, and now Iraq. A lot of people don't realize that Japan occupied Vietnam for a very long time. Why didn't they have the problems the U.S. did, later? Look at how "peaceful" Yugoslavia was under Tito. Why didn't Saddam Hussein have a rough time presiding over Kurds, Shiites, and Sunnis? We all know why. Brutality. Czech commandos parachuted into their own country, after being trained in Britain, and assassinated the highest ranking Nazi to be thus killed during the war, Himmler's understudy, Heydrich. It wasn't long before every commando was ferreted out by the Gestapo from the cellar (or crypt) he was hiding in, dimed out by his fellow Czechs, certainly not in sympathy for the German cause...

So, what is the answer? Do we aspire to be better than that, or only when it might save innocent lives, or when in Rome...

I suspect no small amount of people of any civilized western nation simply would rather not know what's being done in their name, but want that security no matter the cost.

Not a subject dear to my heart, but I'm getting fed up with the talking heads and other media hand-wringers calling the recent stuff in Iraq "torture". Extreme discomfort, instilled fear and humiliation are long accepted and useful methods of interrogation. Broken bones, mangled genitals and destroyed teeth and eyes are torture.

Skillful use of coercive and patient methods of interrogation can yield reasonably reliable information. Hard, fast physical torture generally doesn't.

During my time in the military, I underwent some of the same things in E and E (escape and evasion) and survival training the the poor Iraqi detainees are experiencing. I assue you, some of the techniques, including threatened drowning (which is much easier done and just as effective by placing a t-shirt over the mouth and nose and pouring water on it) are very effective, but you do get to walk away from them.

Not in the same league as cutting a guys head of with what was obviously a dull knife.

Let the fun begin.

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BIGIRON said:
...Not in the same league as cutting a guys head of with what was obviously a dull knife...

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I don't want to hijack my own thread but I saw that video and, horrible though it was it just didn't ring true. How can you decapitate a man without blood spurting all over? When Berg's head (if it even was his head) was held up there was no blood whatsoever, not a drop. My feelings of anger and disgust were mixed with disbelief.

Sorry for this digression,
BN

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Closed.