KL4 bezel + E1e body........Makes sense?

A buddy of mine will be giving me a KL4 bezel he doesn't need. I can use it either as a spare for my newly purchased L4, or I can mate it to an E1e. SureFire stated that it can be done, even though there is no reference to this on their website. But the rep had no information for me concerning lumen output or runtime. Will the one 123 battery in an E1e have enough oomph to start the Luxeon in the bezel? If so, how bright will it be, and how long will it run? I am sure that with this new project of mine, "I am pushing the envelope." Never hurts to try, though!

You're a lucky friend, aren't ya?? Does your buddy need another friend? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif Answer is yes, it will work. Do a search on CPF for TW4, it was a combo coined by Tactical Warehouse, until SF asked them to stop selling it that way. IIRC you get about 1 hour runtime, with the output being brighter than the KL1. Don't try it with 3x123s though, that is NOT recommended... it will still work, but might shorten the lifespan of your KL4. KL1 is more versatile in the sense that it'll work with 3x123s... brighter and more runtime.

Do a search for TW4, it should answer all your questions. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Looks to me like you are trying to be a "lucky friend" to my friend too, Stanley. If I made you a "lucky friend" and he had another extra part just lying around, then how would I know if he was going to make you more lucky than me when he wants to get rid of it? I can't take the chance, buddy! Nice try, pal!

Wasn't the TW4 (Tactical Warehouse), a KL4 bezel from an L4, and an E2e's body, mated together, before the KL4 bezels were recently released as accessory LED Conversion Heads? The typical combinations supported by SF are the KL4 (or KL1) + E2e, or the KL1 + E1e. I want to make sure that we don't have our bezel/body combinations crossed. As long as they thread together, I am sure that it can be a match made in heaven, but at what output/runtime price?

The TW4 is a E1e body with KL4. It is called TW4 since Tactial Warehouse made this combination available by either splitting up L4's or by selling sets containing the E1e and KL4 - please correct me if this is wrong.

The L4 is a KL4 bezel with E2e body but different writing on the side. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

SureFire does not advertise the TW4 or the use of the KL4 in combination with the E1e or other single 123A cell lights as far as I know.

The KL4 bezel can be used with an E2e body, or a E1e body (the "TW4" that was mentioned here).
On the E1e body, the KL4 bezel will be less bright and have less runtime, but as I understand, it's still a very impressive flashlight.
I do not have an E1 or E1e, so I cannot test this combination for you. Let's see if it will fit my McLux Black Widow and see what happens...BRB...ok, it fits on and works on that body. The intensity reading is 177,000mcd, but I do not know what shape the battery is in. So please take this intensity reading with plenty of crystalline sodium chloride.

I believe TW4 is a KL4 + E1e + z57 tailcap, but please correct me if i'm wrong.

Check out the following thread in Custom B/S/T:
Pila 150S bodies (E1.5), E1 & E2 bodies

This is a body (no head or tail) that will fit a Pila 150S lithium ion battery. This rechargable should be as bright as a normal L4 but a bit shorter. So you get full brightness (unlike TW4) with a short body (longer than TW4 though). Of course you would also have to purchase a Pila 150S battery and a pila charger.

I really liked the TW4 configuration, but would prefer that the light ran in regulation. The estimated runtime of this custom body + lithium ion is estimated at about half an hour, which is just fine considering recharging is nearly free.

Erik.

I EDC a TW4 and IMHO it's about as good as it gets for a daily work light. I get about 80 minutes continuous runtime or about 120 minutes intermittent before it dims. It has somewhere around 30 lumens output, which is just about right for office and home, and it's still a great outdoor light.

I also have the Vital Gear 2AA tube (and the Vital Gear 1X123 and Surefire L4 tubes also) and the KL4 works just great on 2xAA Lithium, about the same output as a 1X123 but with a lot longer runtime, my notes indicate that I have almost 3 hours on one pair of AA Lithiums and there's no sign of dimming yet. I don't use the L4 tube at all.

I mentioned this to a rep at Surefire, and was told (quite off the record) they are fully aware of the various combinations the KL4 is being used for and will probably offer some "official" variants of their own down the road, no timetable though. He also mentioned that under powering like that will probably greatly extend the life of the Luxeon, which seems very reasonable to me.

I like the TW4 combo, it's my daily carry, the output suits my work perfectly and with a little mag pocket clip on the tail it's just about perfect.

You won't be disappointed.

Al

Not all KL4 heads work great on one 3V cell though. Depends on VfIn. Also there will be more color to the beam (usually greenish or yellow). I saw someone with slightly magenta tinted L4, which I would much prefer to my greenish tinted L4. Don't get me wrong, this is still a great setup, I just want to let you know what to expect.

Erik.

I have done the same thing. I bought a kl4 head from a guy at a gun show and put it on an E1 body and it works really great, I have no way to measure the light output but it beats the original E1 lamp. I have not yet test the run time but I would imagine it to be about the same as the E1 lamp.

My EDC is a KL4 on Vitagear single 123 body. It works great and I consider it the best EDC light I own. Bright white light and nearly a 4 hour total run time. The light doesn't seem to begin dimming until past 3 hours. It's true it's not as bright as when on the L4 body but it doesn't seem to me to be all that much less. It's also true what others say: Some KL4s don't work well in such applications but mine works just great. Guess I got lucky.

Thank you K-T, Craig, StEaLtH_, Eric and Al, for making my day with similar comments about the feasability of a KL4/E1e (TW4) combination.

Erik, I will do a little test by rigging some wires and alligator clips from my L1 light's battery to the KL4 bezel, bypassing the regulation circuit board on the top of the battery tube. First off, I will do a visual test of tint and brightness. Then I will measure the amount of current draw and voltage to the bezel.

Al, 80 minutes at 30 lumens on one battery is fine with me, and 120 minutes intermittently, which is more like "real life duty cycle", is excellent. This combo looks very encouraging on the basis of your findings.

Gman, I am not sure what could cause a problem with the combo, which would elicit a statement such as "Some KL4s don't work well in such applications", from anyone? Could anybody tell me why this combo might not work in all cases?

I don't know really, I think it's what Erik said about the individual LED. I just know I've read some people have good success and others don't. My experience has been more in line with Al's. I get great run time and a nice beam, almost as bright as when on the L4 body. What I like about the TW4 is the much longer runtime. The L4 just quits after about an hour. If you find a KL4 that will work well on one 123 it's a nice package. I like the Vital Gear body to keep the size down but I also liked it with an E1 body and the L4 clickie on it.

Erik and all,

Remember I wrote that a buddy will be giving me a spare KL4 bezel? I have it in my possession. I tested both of them, but not in the way I stated in my post. I did not use the L1 in the test. I used the KL4 bezels with the L4 battery tube.

I removed one battery from the L4. While making sure that the remaining battery was making contact with the center post in the bezel, I inserted a steel tweezer into the tailcap end, and wiggled it until it made contact with the battery negative and the tube's body. The light came on. Obviously, the output was not as bright as the light with two batteries, but it was plenty bright anyway. I am impressed by the total light output of each bezel, which is the same wide floodlight pattern emitted by the L4 using two batteries. The tint of each bezel ia exactly the same as when it is running on two batteries. One is white, and the other has a "yellow non-objectionable" tint. I cannot begin to guess what the lumen rating could be, but the overall light output is greater than either my Arc LSH-S, Micra, or L1 with the 3 watt bezel. The hotspot is more prominent than the Arc's, but less so than the other two.

For now, I will give you my current/voltage readings using a "somewhat depleted" battery. For a future test, I will find a dummy spacer so that I can use the light with only one active battery, and do a less tedious visual test due to tweezer manipulation. My haste is due to my desire to share something positive rather than wait, since all of us will eventually have a depleted battery and should know what happens at that point in the battery's life. Both bezels were electrically identical........
Voltage no load = 2.86V
Voltage with light on = 2.70V
Current draw = 140mA

As I look at these numbers and behold the light output, I am amazed at how much light these bezels emit with only one battery, and with so little energy. Unless somebody can prove that I am crazy, my KL4 bezels have a ridiculously low power consumption of .378watt. I think that my fascination in the results is due to the bezels' broad sidespill, even though the hotspot intensity is reduced by the omission of one battery.

I have read so many posts about the KL4/E1e combination, most of them written before I started my LED hobby on 2/17/04. Now I see what the hoopla is all about. Aren't we glad that SureFire has finally released the KL4 bezel as an accessory? Based on my very encouraging findings, I am quite sure that I will be ordering an E1e, very soon. Until that happens, I will continue to be overjoyed with the total performance on my L4 light.