Why terrorist whacks Russia instead of USA?

Because they got the world map upside down ? Those darn terrorist is whacking everyone now a days, someone is got to show them a map and point those idiots to their true direction. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsdown.gif

Uh... because there's an election coming up....
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif
Remember Spain?

Obviously they are feeling upset that we think we're so important that they only want to kill us. We'll show those self important Americans, we'll kill EVERYBODY!

Even though one of the planes send a hijack message before going down, Russia is saying that they don't think that is the case as there is no other evidence. While I have certainly been witness to several "freak coincidences" as they want to label this, I don't really believe in them.

It will be very interesting to see what information comes out over the next few days on this. The Russians definitely have some difficulties close to home that could be responsible, but groups like the Chechen separatists are very careful to point out to the media that they target only military targets. So they have little to gain by having done this.

Sounds like a coverup. Russia prides itself and this is embarrasing, like the theater deal they had awhile back. Its odd, since Russia was the major supplier to Iraq and other places, several magnitudes higher than the US did.
If it is Iraq/Alqueda related, talk about bitting the hand that feeds you...

I'd possibly believe thier spin if it was just one plane, but two at the same time...thats a whole another ball of wax.

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James S said:
... but groups like the Chechen separatists are very careful to point out to the media that they target only military targets. So they have little to gain by having done this.

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Didn't they take over a theatre two years ago?

GJW: Yes, that that was 2 years ago! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif We're an entirely different set of rebels now!

Or really, now I think they are trying to form themselves into a movement that will have international appeal so that some pressure will get placed on russia from other circles. At least their PR guys seem to realize that crashing airplanes full of civilians is not the best way to generate international support for your movement.

Unless they are American airplanes, then it seems that they could get plenty of sympathy when America goes after them. But thats not an issue for this current happening, at least not yet.

Those terrorist are missing the point and provoking the general public. I could at least be nice to them if they just target the US, but now they are just disapointments.. then again it could be a US conspiracy.. the cold war is really over, is it ?

Alleged terrorist attacks in Russia include apartment bombings and subway attacks which have claimed many civilian lives also. Most incidents have been attributed to internal issues. Information in Russia is still difficult to discern..

Two different types of airplane.

Departing 40 minutes apart from the same airport.

Going down within moments of one another....

Is one HELL of a coincidence!!!

I hope we find out the truth in time!

My uneducated (paranoid?) guess is that they're practicing for something here. Wasn't there some stuff going on elsewhere before 9-11? I have a pretty bad memory for that stuff. (Donald Sutherland: "Negative waves, man.")

All I know is that terrorist are COWARDS!!!! Killing the innocent and all the while hi /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/xyxgun.gifding.C-O-W-A-R-D-S!!!!!!!!!

I doubt if they are practicing for something here. The Russians have been fighting a pretty vicious fight against the chechnian (sp?) rebels for a long time. There are reports they are related to & trained by Al Quaida, but we are probably making ourselves too important if we think they are practicing for us.

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gtwace said:
Those terrorist are missing the point and provoking the general public. I could at least be nice to them if they just target the US, but now they are just disapointments.. then again it could be a US conspiracy..

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/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/huh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif

Am I understanding you correctly? Are you saying that you would "...be nice to them [terrorists] if they just target the US..."

Does this mean that if they just target the US, then you will be nice to them and they won't be disappointing you?

If this is so, then you support terrorists who attack the USA?

So, CPF is receiving donations from a supporter of terrorism against the USA?

Naw, this can't be true. I am sure I'm misunderstanding what you've posted. Could you explain it for me?

Thanks

BC

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Am I understanding you correctly

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I chose to read that as a continuation of the sarcasm I floated in my own post above.

Is there such a thing as an Arm Chair Terrorist? Perhaps thats what we got here /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif You know what those guys should have done? Well, if they were going to do it right then I'd.... etc /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Not that I believe Russian government, but... If it was a terrorist attack, then the attackers would've made a statement already claiming successfull attacks and praising "martyrs", etc... Not that they feel any guilt for killing innocent people anyway.
Besides, it's hard to imagine in what shape are the airplanes in Russia's(and most of the former SU countries for that matter) internal flights. Things are literally falling apart. When durign landing oyu can smell smoke and vapors in the airplane salon that's more than enough of a sign isn't it.

Granted they may not have the utmost in fine airplanes.../ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smoker5.gif

However, they do not fall out of the sky every day./ubbthreads/images/graemlins/str.gif

Two, that close together, two different models, I think two different airlines.... stinks like my sweaty clothes!/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/duh2.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad71.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

Maybe nobody has claimed responsibility yet... but it sure seems likely they will. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/poke2.gif

I favor the terr theories, but let me reluctantly point out something else.

These were airplanes built in a country whose government did everything it could to punish or kill their own citizens who demonstrated any originality or individuality. They did this for over 70 years. They also systematically attacked innovation during this time period.

In the time since the Sovs fell, the remnants of the bankrupt system they left behind has been ruthlessly plundered by the corrupt.

If you combine the effect of airplanes built by people with no profit motive who cannot be fired (except for political reasons), with the fact that the Russians never had the funds or the cultural incentive to preserve the life of the individual by maintaining the planes the way that we do, a creepy picture develops.

You would have had to drag me kicking and screaming onto any Tupolev twenty years ago when there was actually better upkeep of these planes -- with Russia's fiscal mess today and the mafia holding most of what has been privatized, I wouldn't fly on one today 'for all the farms in Cuba.'

The planes are not maintained anything like what we would tend to project, from our own knowledge of the industry here at home.

Having said all that, I still think it was the terrs.

A former Navy pilot I was talking to today told me that if the planes were both fueled with the same bad fuel at the Moscow airport, that could explain the coincidence in timing. However, he thinks it is probably terrorist related anyway, and I tend to agree.

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Zvi said:
Not that I believe Russian government, but... If it was a terrorist attack, then the attackers would've made a statement already claiming successfull attacks and praising "martyrs"

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This is not necessarily true and hasn't been that way for some time. Taking credit is an old paradigm of terrorism: relatively few casualties, big emphasis on taking credit to draw focus to one's cause. The new paradigm of terrorism is inflicting mass casualties in spectatular fashion, little emphasis on taking credit because the "cause" isn't much more nuanced than simply hurting the West. Look at the USS Cole and the embassy bombings. It even took bin Laden a few months to take credit for 9/11.

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These were airplanes built in a country whose government did everything it could to punish or kill their own citizens who demonstrated any originality or individuality.

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Though it has nothing to do with the topic at hand, i was reading a very interesting article on Murder by communism where the author tries to calculate the "democide" (that would be murder of the people by the state) numbers for various communist states in the world. USSR comes out on top with China a close second. It's pretty interesting reading.