To Charlie Wong

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MR Bulk said:

To Keith Brinkman - a while back I inquired whether you could help me out in this forwarding service for the upcoming LionHeart project and you declined (still have the e-mail), yet I see you are now doing it. What, you got a thing for black or somethin'?

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To Charlie Wong - The difference (to me) is that Tactical Warehouse does not offer international shipping and you do.

In your e-mail you didn't mention you wanted my help just for the LionHeart project. You stated that you ship a LOT of mods overseas and wanted to know what I could offer you.

I realize that you'd like to lighten your workload by having me do all your international shipping, but until you change your policy, the answer is still no.

However, if you'd still handle the day to day int'l stuff, I'd be willing to help with special projects, like the VIP or LH. But there would have to be something in it for me. For you to send me a box with 50? flashlights in it, and expect me to buy 50 boxes to re-mail them, isn't going to happen.

As it is now, I often reuse the boxes that come to me if they are still in good shape and are the right size. TW sent me 8 flashlights in one big box and I had to use 8 new boxes to re-mail them.

I only charge people what the postage cost. Sometimes people round up to the nearest dollar, but that doesn't cover my supplies. The cost for boxes, packaging tape, gummed Registered Mail tape, bubble wrap, labels, printer ink, padded envelopes, all comes out of my pocket. It's not a lot normally, but for projects like yours, the cost would add up quickly.

I am not running a business. I do this just to help CPF members be able to buy flashlights from dealers who would not otherwise do business with them.

And my LH is bare aluminum. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinser2.gif

i dont understand the meaning of this post

I do

why does he post it here?

Err.. I won't ask it. Nevermind.

Keith don't worry about it. I thought you perhaps worked for the post office or something and had some special deal on doing things cheaply or even free. Don't worry about it.

But in thinking about it more, I absolutely have to say that the statement, "TW doesn't offer int'l shipping and you do" is ludicrous. I am a one man HOBBIEST and do this on my own time just to offer CPF'ers something different that major mfrs. either won't or can't yet supply, making relatively little money while I'm at it (look at the price disparity between TW's LHs and my original ones) and so I regularly trudge through the int'l shipping requirements such as customs slips, etc.

So in addition to developing the light from scratch, ordering components, fronting much of the money, BUILDING the damn things, and THEN having to "offer" international shipping - this is totally incorrect and I am in absolute DISagreement with your statement. Dan's is a real business, and simply because he does not "offer" int'l shipping is merely a conscious decision on his part. If in future projects I decide not to "offer" int'l shipping, would this mean you will then do it?

BTW, unless you are shipping FedEx or UPS or DHL or whatever, all USPS postal boxes are FREE.

This is OT but Mr. Bulk (Charlie), I wish I was a venture capitalist. Then I could give you and your design team whatever it took to start a full-blown Illumination Tool company.

My flashaholism went full bore about 2 years ago when I purchased a Dorcy spyder (The Hyundai of lights), then a Pelican m6 (the Chevy of lights)….a Streamlight TL3( the Ford of lights)……several Surfires(the Cadillac of lights) and now your Lionheart -THE ROLLS-ROYCE of lights!

I really think with the right capital backing that in no time you could be the Bill Gates of Illumination Tools.
But I suspect you are content to be the Preston Tucker for now, by showing the big boys that they don't have a monopoly on cutting edge innovation. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Just had to say that.

pretty unusual people, Charlie and Keith (no not the Stones..).
not surprising they may each underestimate the other's unselfish intentions, considering the way a lot of the world operates...

Ouch, you guys be nice!

Charlie, my USPS office charges ME for the boxes I buy there, you're getting yours free?

I know I'm butting in, but it looks to me like there is a major misunderstanding based on communication here. KSBMAN has offered to provide this service to CPF'ers who otherwise couldn't get these lights. He doesn't offer the service to Dan, but to CPF'ers who need the help. Dan has made a decision to NOT ship internationally for whatever reason, (Surefire?) and it just so happens that members overseas use KSBMAN to ship the lights they have purchased. KSBMAN does this as a true service, not asking for any remuneration.

Charlie, in KSBMAN's view, is a manufacturer who HAS elected to ship overseas, thus he doesn't see any need to offer his services to those members who decide to buy Charlies marvelous creations. (I own two of them, a VIP which will probably be handed down as a family heirloom, and a SpaceNeedle II which is one of the best uses of a Mag I have ever seen!) Though certainly Charlie makes minimal money from his creations, in KSBMANs mind he fits that category.

I for one am amazed at Charlies ability to keep doing this time after time!! I do however, wish he would come up with the light that the LionHeart started out as. A sub $100 dollar, tough, everyday, go anywhere light. I doubt that very many people will carry their $300 LionHeart to work in the manufacturing facility, if for no other reason than that it might get lost.

However, the point here is that KSBMAN offers his services to buyers, not sellers!

Bill

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Never fails.......

Well, I'd be willing to forget the whole thing...just send me a free light with free shipping, (and maybe some free batteries too)...Thanks in advance....

I agree with what bwaites said. I'm sure it's just a small misunderstanding. That being said, both Charlie & Keith provide great service each in their own capacity. I for one, as I'm sure there are many, can attest earnestly to that.

We all know what excellent & innovative flashlights Mr Bulk aka Charlie Wong makes - one better than the other each time. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif

ksbman aka Keith always takes great care, effort & expense as well in packing up stuff no matter how small or what it may be. Plus I always enjoy that little 'gift' card that's included! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif I always try to add on a little bit more than the actual cost for shipping that Keith pays on my behalf. I know it's really not much but I hope it helps cover a small part of Keith's extra costs, time & effort. He's always willing & obliging to any ordering & shipping request; as well as quick to reply & update, & I'm sure often he's swamped with emails & stuff to pack & carry to the Post Office. Without him many of us 'foreign' CPFers couldn't get many of the fantastic stuff we hope for like for example the TW/Mr Bulk/CPF Ltd. Edition LionHeart! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif

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MR Bulk said:
BTW, unless you are shipping FedEx or UPS or DHL or whatever, all USPS postal boxes are FREE.

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Priority Mail boxes, which are used for mail within the US, are free. Global Priority envelopes are free. There are no free Airmail boxes.

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bwaites said:
However, the point here is that KSBMAN offers his services to buyers, not sellers!

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Yes, that sums it up nicely.

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MR Bulk said:
If in future projects I decide not to "offer" int'l shipping, would this mean you will then do it?

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Yes, in that case I would treat you like a dealer, and would help the CPF members who wish to purchase a product from you.



My life sucks. (Yeah, I know, boo hoo for me.) The things I do for the CPF community helps me to feel better about myself. But right now all I feel is doubt, worry, and guilt. I never thought I'd have to defend myself for helping others. I know you said don't worry about it, but that's exactly what I'm doing. I feel that I've let you down. But all this is my problem, certainly not yours.

Charlie, I sincerely apologize if I have offended you with my actions or statements. I have great respect for what you do here.

FYI, I am an Aircraft Mechanic.

keith i just wanna know why ya made the post here instead a email?i think you are a great cpfer so i just wonder it seems to be something spoke in pm would be better

Hey Keith, don't feel like you have to apologize to anyone. Business is Business period! Nothing personal! Any business would not perform tasks like you are doing for free(your gas,time etc.) so it is unfair for any business to ask you to do it.

And to play the race card in business is just wrong.

Your services were for buyers not sellers. As a hispanic business man myself, i never expect anyone to take on any cost of my business and always offer monies even if not needed.

Also, as a business man who has struggled, i would be thankful for anything you did to help my business even if it was just a referal.

You keep doing what you feel is right in your heart and always remember why you were offering your services to begin with.

[ QUOTE ]
raggie33 said:
keith i just wanna know why ya made the post here instead a email?i think you are a great cpfer so i just wonder it seems to be something spoke in pm would be better

[/ QUOTE ]
Because Charlies quote at the top, was in TW's LionHeart thread.

I chose to answer in a seperate thread so as not to muddy up TW's thread with this.

Charlie did send an e-mail, but since he also asked publicly, I answered publicly.

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junior said:
Hey Keith, don't feel like you have to apologize to anyone. Business is Business period! Nothing personal! Any business would not perform tasks like you are doing for free(your gas) so it is unfair for any business to ask you to do it.

And to play the race card in business is just wrong.

Your services were for buyers not sellers. As a hispanic business man myself, i never expect anyone to take on any cost of my business and always offer monies even if not needed.

You keep doing what you feel is right in your heart and always remember why you were offering your services to begin with.

[/ QUOTE ]Well said....

Keith, you're a great bloke, and highly appreciated!
I think Mr Bulk is just a bit playful, and could phrase things a bit better...

I think Mr. Bulk's "racist" remark was referring to the LH and not people although it could be considered an ambiguous statement by some creative-minded people.

This is the single most upsetting thread I've ever seen on CPF. I'd rather disprove my ignorance to b2p or negotiate a consultation deal with Aten Imago. Two of our most generous and beloved CPFers straightening out things in public. It's like seeing your Mom and Dad argue.

I think that I'm gonna keep my mouth shut and pray today.

I love and respect the hell out of both of you men. No finer in my book.

Britt