Katokichi Ichishiki - ARC4+

This is an individual, non-technical appraisal:
using freshly charged unprotected Li-Ions from AW, and pointing the lights at a white ceiling, my Ichishiki makes the room visibly brighter than my ARC4+, it also has a larger hotspot.
It also beats my NG1000/TWOK/Aleph2 and my KL4/E1e, both on single R123's.
All I can say, this is insanely impressive!

All the above lights were loaded with R123 700mAh Li-Ions, while the little Ichi only takes a CR2-size rechargeable of 300mAh capacity.

Runtime seems a bit short, but that's why I use rechargeables....
Congratulations to Mike Jordan and Katokichi! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif

hmm, rikvee, I think you should let the batteries rest a while off the charger to get them down from 3.7v to 3v as you might be putting too much to the converter IMHO...may have long-term consequences or sudden darkness! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

[ QUOTE ]
rikvee said:
This is an individual, non-technical appraisal:
using freshly charged unprotected Li-Ions from AW, and pointing the lights at a white ceiling, my Ichishiki makes the room visibly brighter than my ARC4+, it also has a larger hotspot.
It also beats my NG100/Aleph2 and my KL4/E1e, both on single R123's.
All I can say, this is insanely impressive!

Runtime seems a bit short, but that's why I use rechargeables....
Congratulations to Mike Jordan and Katokichi! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Very impressive /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/buttrock.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but cpf version of KI supports li-ion use. so blast away

I was researching this earlier this morning before I placed an order for some rechargeable CR2s and a recharger for the KI LE flashlight. Arcmania stated that the SCIII circuit accepts a max input voltage of 6.1 volts but recommends the KI to be used with 3.0-3.7 volts.

Elsewhere, someone stated that the CR2 battery needs to be charged to 4.2 volts to get its max capacity? So that is still much below the max v-in and should be OK. Please correct me if I am wrong... and do so before I burn out my Ichishiki. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ohgeez.gif

Dave

How is the 3W KI brighter than the 5W KL4? Are you just talking about the hotspot? I'm sure the KI has better throw but the TW4 combo outputs TONS of overall light. I ask because I was thinking of getting one of those KI lights. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Jeff

With the RCR2 some have said that the light gets hotter quicker. I guess that can't really be too good long term.

Nonetheless, I would be interested in the RCR2 and appropriate charger.

Curtis.

DaGunn,

The fully charged R-CR2 4.2V is the open voltage (no load), but once connected to the KI, the voltage will drop rapidly into the 3.7 range. I am using the same setup, and output is awesome bright! But careful not to let it on for too long, it can get pretty hot and will degrade the TWOH LED.

Also, the Nano charger from AW is a very nice charger for the R-CR2, because it's a slow charger. (150mA charging current, and it's about C/2 or half the battery capacity)
I would use the Nano for R-CR2 and the R-CR123(700mAH). For those interested in increasing the longevity of the rechargeable Li-Ion batteries, take the battery out at 4.10 volts, and not let it go beyond 4.20V (This will increase the life span by more than 30%, but at the expense of not fully charged)

Amorphous,

Thanks!
The Nano Charger charges the battery to 4.1V when its LED turns green. Leaving the cell in the charger for a few more hours will bring the voltage up to about 4.16 - 4.19V. This was designed to prolong battery life and cycles rather than pumping the max. power into the cell. ( Unlike CPFers, regular consumers prefer a longer life cycles than max. power for their batteries )

RCR2 can be charged like this with a stack of pennies or a spacer :

I never knew pennies could conduct electricity! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/stupid.gif

From some emails I exchanged with Arcmania, I got the impression that the KI's SCIII was modified to be only a boost converter because when I asked Mike about using rechargeable CR2's he stated that doing so would result in 600+ ma going to the led. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this behavior typical of a boost only converter?

Another thing I recall, unless I read it wrong, is that Mike did state in the other KI sale thread that was recently locked up that the SCIII in the KI is a boost converter.

So my guess is that Rikvee's tests with the rcr2's could have resulted in the KI being in DD instead of regulated mode. Unless someone can verify whether this a buck/boost or boost only converter, I'm not willing to risk using mine with rechargeables. It's just too perfect to even risk messing up.

Regardless, this is one hell of a kick-*** light when you take into consideration the brightness to size ratio. I really can't think of anything to improve it further. Maybe a UCL perhaps? I wonder if all the KI owners would be interested in convincing Flashlightlens to make a special run for us.

"The max input of the scIII is 6.1 volts. I have
modified the scIII to work efficiently with either a
protected, rechargeable CR2 lithium ion 3.7 volt
battery or a regular disposable CR2 lithium battery.
Another reason to use these two types of batteries
is that Katokichi wanted to maintain the
flashlight's compact size.

I will update this post with pictures as time goes by to show progress of the Ichishiki flashlight."

ARC mania

OK thanks for all the info guys. I had in mine the 300mAH 3.6V RCR2 # 15266 that AW sells so I guess they'd be perfect for the job but not sure if they are 'protected'.

[ QUOTE ]
xpitxbullx said:
How is the 3W KI brighter than the 5W KL4? Are you just talking about the hotspot? I'm sure the KI has better throw but the TW4 combo outputs TONS of overall light. I ask because I was thinking of getting one of those KI lights. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Jeff

[/ QUOTE ]

Pointing it at the ceiling (without looking up) is my crude way to look at overall light output.
I guess two things could make the Ichi brighter:
- its Mike Jordan converter may be more efiicient than the very flexible Surefire KL4
- the two KL4 5W LED's I have are a tad warmer, not to say greener than the nice and white Katokichi Ichishiki I've got here (#065).

btw, what type of 3W Luxeon was used for the "Limited Edition RK&MJ" K.I.?

[ QUOTE ]
flashlight said:
OK thanks for all the info guys. I had in mine the 300mAH 3.6V RCR2 # 15266 that AW sells so I guess they'd be perfect for the job but not sure if they are 'protected'.

[/ QUOTE ]

The RCR2 is unprotected.

/me scratches head, humm....

**coughs**

I've never seen a protected CR2 li-ion cell. cpf version of KI has a buck/boost circuit.

chromed version of KI uses a different circuit and doesnot support li-ion use. but I've been using CR2 li-ion from day one with no problems so far.

hot spot of KI may be as bright as KL4, but no way does my KI put out lumens even near a 5watt L4.

I need to so a ceiling bounce tests with KI VS ARC4+ and AR4X.

[ QUOTE ]
cy said:
I've never seen a protected CR2 li-ion cell. cpf version of KI has a buck/boost circuit.

chromed version of KI uses a different circuit and doesnot support li-ion use. but I've been using CR2 li-ion from day one with no problems so far.

hot spot of KI may be as bright as KL4, but no way does my KI put out lumens even near a 5watt L4.

I need to so a ceiling bounce tests with KI VS ARC4+ and AR4X.

[/ QUOTE ]

CY,

Can you verify if the light is putting out the same brightness using either disposable or rechargeable cells? I also knew that the SCIII is a buck/boost converter but Mike's reply to me which I stated above was a bit puzzling.

You get your ceiling results yet cy?

not really a fair test KI VS ARC4 due to larger cell and lens sizes. Li14430 VS KI both with CR2 li-ion is a closer match.

all running li-ion cells pointed at same spot in ceiling.

ARC4X # 0321 w/R123 4.09V (tested at 48.4 lumens)
ARC4+ # 0283 w/R123 4.08V
KI chromed version (V3.1? not cpf version) CR2 li-ion 4.09V
Li14430 w/CR2 li-ion 4.011V

Results are KI's hotspot is brighter than both ARC4X and ARC4+. but KI's output is aprox same as ARC4+. ARC4x's output is quite a margin larger.

Li14430 W/CR2 li-ion output is just a crack less than ARC4X. KI's hotspot is way brighter than Li14430 W/CR2 li-ion.

note this test is only valid for my lights. your mileage may veri..

classical lux readings distorting actual output. if someone measured lux reading only, they would think that KI is putting more lumens than ARC4.