PhotonWrangler
Flashaholic
The news media are going absolutely nuts with this. It IS interesting to finally know the answer, and it helps to understand the motivation behind it. I think. Very interesting to see regardless.
Deep Throat finally revealed
- Thread starter PhotonWrangler
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PhotonWrangler
Flashaholic
Huh... am I the only one who remembers Watergate?
MaxaBaker
Flashlight Enthusiast
lol, I'm 14 and I know what's going on. Where are the people that were actually alive during that time?!? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/au.gif
PhotonWrangler
Flashaholic
I know there are others here who have lived through that era. Maybe they just don't want to get too political here, which I can understand, but this goes beyond politics. This is about morality, honesty, conscience, secrecy, all sorts of very human traits. It's the stuff that spy films are made of.
It's amazing to me to see this huge puzzle piece of history finally falling into place. It helps me to understand a little better just what was going on during that scandal.
It's also mildly amusing for me to see how the media is just having multiple cows over this. They're not only interviewing all of the remaining players, they're interviewing their wives, their friends, the actors who portrayed them in All the President's Men, and when they get tired of that, they start interviewing each other! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif
It's amazing to me to see this huge puzzle piece of history finally falling into place. It helps me to understand a little better just what was going on during that scandal.
It's also mildly amusing for me to see how the media is just having multiple cows over this. They're not only interviewing all of the remaining players, they're interviewing their wives, their friends, the actors who portrayed them in All the President's Men, and when they get tired of that, they start interviewing each other! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif
Flashlightboy
Enlightened
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2001
- Messages
- 856
Ooooooh, pick me!!!! I know this one!!!! Me, Me, Me, please!!!!
It was Bing Crosby's daughter on that oil and cowboy show.
It was Bing Crosby's daughter on that oil and cowboy show.
James S
Flashlight Enthusiast
[ QUOTE ]
they start interviewing each other
[/ QUOTE ]
They have been doing this for quite some time /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I think it's HILARIOUS when an article is printed that starts with "according to CNN" or some other such phrase. As if we don't need to know anything more about it if they said it!
Watergate was a big deal, whats sad is how the press insists on reliving their glory there over and over again for things that just don't compare.
Not every story or scandal can be that important and news worthy, but keep trying, maybe someday it will happen again.
they start interviewing each other
[/ QUOTE ]
They have been doing this for quite some time /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif I think it's HILARIOUS when an article is printed that starts with "according to CNN" or some other such phrase. As if we don't need to know anything more about it if they said it!
Watergate was a big deal, whats sad is how the press insists on reliving their glory there over and over again for things that just don't compare.
Not every story or scandal can be that important and news worthy, but keep trying, maybe someday it will happen again.
UncleFester
Flashaholic*,
PW, you're right. I don't want to get political. My big mouth will get me into trouble and I don't want that.
I WILL say the thing was (and now is) blown out of porportion.
I WILL say the thing was (and now is) blown out of porportion.
BB
Flashlight Enthusiast
Mark Felt was later convicted of illegal searches and eventually pardoned by Ronald Reagan.
CQ Blog
[ QUOTE ]
What we know is that Felt took part in those efforts in Hoover's FBI to use the bureau for political purposes. Felt at one point immediately after Hoover's death had possession of Hoover's Official/Confidential files, the supersensitive political dossiers that Hoover used to retain power for almost 50 years. Felt eventually got convicted of illegal break-ins of the same sort as Watergate, receiving a pardon from Ronald Reagan. Pretending that Felt, one of Hoover's most trusted aides, somehow stood apart from the corruption at the Bureau flies in the face of both history and common sense.
If Felt wanted to act heroically, he could just as easily have retired or quit from the FBI and gone public with the information. Alternately, as the #2 executive of the nation's premier law-enforcement agency, he could have started his own investigation of Watergate publicly and openly. Instead, he chose to hide in the shadows and dole out only that information that targeted his enemies in the White House who had passed him over (and other Bureau stalwarts) for the top job in order to give it to an outsider. That doesn't make Felt a traitor, but it certainly doesn't make him much of a hero. As I wrote yesterday, it provides a microcosm of the corruption in Washington in both the White House and the FBI in which Felt was very much a participant.
[/ QUOTE ]
Mark Felt leaked against Nixon probably as payback because Felt, as 2nd in command of the FBI was passed over and somebody else was named as head of the FBI.
San Jose Mercury News:
[ QUOTE ]
But in the end, it might not matter. The facts don't diminish Deep Throat's courage or the reporters' resolve. They do suggest most of the people in this drama acted for grubby as well as noble reasons.
Begin with Felt, who grew up in an FBI dominated and shaped by J. Edgar Hoover, a man not averse to using blackmail to cling to power.
What Felt did in talking to Woodward wasn't simply an act of conscience. He deployed an ancient bureaucratic weapon -- the leak -- to weaken White House enemies who wanted to control his domain.
[/ QUOTE ]
And the kids just wanted to make a buck from an old man who was no longer competent.
[ QUOTE ]
Why did Deep Throat's identity surface now? If you read lawyer John D. O'Connor's piece in Vanity Fair, you'll understand that one reason is money. Left to his own devices, the 91-year-old Felt would probably have gone to his grave with his secret, which was increasingly tattered.
O'Connor describes a scene in which Felt's two grown children, Joan and Mark Jr., urged him to go public. ``They explained that they wanted their father's legacy to be heroic and permanent, not anonymous. And beyond their main motive, they thought there might eventually be some profit in it,'' he wrote.
In other words, one way to view the unmasking of Deep Throat is through the lens of publishing rights. If their father died, Woodward would have the story. This was a way to scoop the master scoop artist of the century -- and get a little money for grandkids' tuition in the bargain.
[/ QUOTE ]
It is hard to find many heroes in Washington DC anymore.
-Bill
CQ Blog
[ QUOTE ]
What we know is that Felt took part in those efforts in Hoover's FBI to use the bureau for political purposes. Felt at one point immediately after Hoover's death had possession of Hoover's Official/Confidential files, the supersensitive political dossiers that Hoover used to retain power for almost 50 years. Felt eventually got convicted of illegal break-ins of the same sort as Watergate, receiving a pardon from Ronald Reagan. Pretending that Felt, one of Hoover's most trusted aides, somehow stood apart from the corruption at the Bureau flies in the face of both history and common sense.
If Felt wanted to act heroically, he could just as easily have retired or quit from the FBI and gone public with the information. Alternately, as the #2 executive of the nation's premier law-enforcement agency, he could have started his own investigation of Watergate publicly and openly. Instead, he chose to hide in the shadows and dole out only that information that targeted his enemies in the White House who had passed him over (and other Bureau stalwarts) for the top job in order to give it to an outsider. That doesn't make Felt a traitor, but it certainly doesn't make him much of a hero. As I wrote yesterday, it provides a microcosm of the corruption in Washington in both the White House and the FBI in which Felt was very much a participant.
[/ QUOTE ]
Mark Felt leaked against Nixon probably as payback because Felt, as 2nd in command of the FBI was passed over and somebody else was named as head of the FBI.
San Jose Mercury News:
[ QUOTE ]
But in the end, it might not matter. The facts don't diminish Deep Throat's courage or the reporters' resolve. They do suggest most of the people in this drama acted for grubby as well as noble reasons.
Begin with Felt, who grew up in an FBI dominated and shaped by J. Edgar Hoover, a man not averse to using blackmail to cling to power.
What Felt did in talking to Woodward wasn't simply an act of conscience. He deployed an ancient bureaucratic weapon -- the leak -- to weaken White House enemies who wanted to control his domain.
[/ QUOTE ]
And the kids just wanted to make a buck from an old man who was no longer competent.
[ QUOTE ]
Why did Deep Throat's identity surface now? If you read lawyer John D. O'Connor's piece in Vanity Fair, you'll understand that one reason is money. Left to his own devices, the 91-year-old Felt would probably have gone to his grave with his secret, which was increasingly tattered.
O'Connor describes a scene in which Felt's two grown children, Joan and Mark Jr., urged him to go public. ``They explained that they wanted their father's legacy to be heroic and permanent, not anonymous. And beyond their main motive, they thought there might eventually be some profit in it,'' he wrote.
In other words, one way to view the unmasking of Deep Throat is through the lens of publishing rights. If their father died, Woodward would have the story. This was a way to scoop the master scoop artist of the century -- and get a little money for grandkids' tuition in the bargain.
[/ QUOTE ]
It is hard to find many heroes in Washington DC anymore.
-Bill
UncleFester
Flashaholic*,
He was the #2 man in the FBI. Ain't that kinda like a super cop? Somebody broke the law, shouldn't he do something about it instead of snitching to the media????????? The media IS NOT law enforcement.
PhotonBoy
Flashlight Enthusiast
Nixon was a very powerful president and I think a lot of people resented his winning a second term. He really knew how to pull strings in the government. I think Mr. Felt thought that Nixon would get away with Watergate so he resorted to being a high level whistleblower, IMHO.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Nixon
(BTW, when Kennedy was shot, I was in grade eleven French class. Very little information was coming through that morning; I thought the Russians had attacked the US or something.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Nixon
(BTW, when Kennedy was shot, I was in grade eleven French class. Very little information was coming through that morning; I thought the Russians had attacked the US or something.)
Bimmerboy
Flashlight Enthusiast
In the interest of not getting too crazy here myself, I'll keep this fairly tame and short.
I do believe the media is loving this. For the Left leaning, this is a major opportunity to continue howling to the public how bad the Republicans are. For the Right leaning, this is a major opportunity to show that the Left is completely out of ideas and have been for a long time.
For the record, I'm mostly not with either side as I see them essentially as opposite sides of the same coin, but this hypocritical, Nixon is the Spawn of Satan stuff, has been annoying me since I was a kid. Like the Dems are any better, if not worse.
That's as far as I'll go about this before heading for CPFU.
I do believe the media is loving this. For the Left leaning, this is a major opportunity to continue howling to the public how bad the Republicans are. For the Right leaning, this is a major opportunity to show that the Left is completely out of ideas and have been for a long time.
For the record, I'm mostly not with either side as I see them essentially as opposite sides of the same coin, but this hypocritical, Nixon is the Spawn of Satan stuff, has been annoying me since I was a kid. Like the Dems are any better, if not worse.
That's as far as I'll go about this before heading for CPFU.
BB
Flashlight Enthusiast
From the San Jose Mercury News link I posted earlier:
[ QUOTE ]
(Felt himself was indicted in 1978 for authorizing FBI break-ins against people linked to the Weather Underground. When he was pardoned by Ronald Reagan, Richard Nixon sent him a bottle of champagne and a note saying justice had prevailed.)
[/ QUOTE ]
Nixon probably knew that Felt harbored some resentments towards Nixon (being passed over after Hoover died), but Nixon was still a gentleman to the end.
Or--It may have been "professional courtesy" (you know, like why sharks don't eat each other) from two old Washington hands... Who knows now.
-Bill
PS: Well, I guess that Nixon did know who Deep Throat was:
CBS5
[ QUOTE ]
Did Nixon Know Deep Throat's ID?
# Taped Conversation In 1972 Suggests He Did
May 31, 2005 10:00 pm US/Pacific
(CBS) In a taped conversation on Oct. 19, 1972, Nixon and chief of staff H.R. Haldeman discuss how information about the Watergate break-in was getting into the press. The conversation was excerpted in a story by Tim Noah in the online magazine Slate back in 1999.
Nixon: Well, if they've got a leak down at the FBI, why the hell can't Gray tell us what the hell is left? You know what I mean? ...
Haldeman: We know what's left, and we know who leaked it.
Nixon: Somebody in the FBI?
Haldeman: Yes, sir. Mark Felt. You can't say anything about this because it will screw up our source and there's a real concern. Mitchell is the only one who knows about this and he feels strongly that we better not do anything because —
Nixon: Do anything? Never.
Haldeman: If we move on him, he'll go out and unload everything. He knows everything that's to be known in the FBI. He has access to absolutely everything ...
Nixon: What would you do with Felt?
Haldeman: Well, I asked Dean ...
Nixon: You know what I'd do with him, the *******? Well that's all I want to hear about it.
Haldeman: I think he wants to be in the top spot.
[/ QUOTE ]
Note: Further quotes deleted as inappropriate for CPF (redacted quotes do not make Nixon look any better).
Of course, much of this was just par for the course politics of the time (on both sides of the cesspool).
-BB
[ QUOTE ]
(Felt himself was indicted in 1978 for authorizing FBI break-ins against people linked to the Weather Underground. When he was pardoned by Ronald Reagan, Richard Nixon sent him a bottle of champagne and a note saying justice had prevailed.)
[/ QUOTE ]
Nixon probably knew that Felt harbored some resentments towards Nixon (being passed over after Hoover died), but Nixon was still a gentleman to the end.
Or--It may have been "professional courtesy" (you know, like why sharks don't eat each other) from two old Washington hands... Who knows now.
-Bill
PS: Well, I guess that Nixon did know who Deep Throat was:
CBS5
[ QUOTE ]
Did Nixon Know Deep Throat's ID?
# Taped Conversation In 1972 Suggests He Did
May 31, 2005 10:00 pm US/Pacific
(CBS) In a taped conversation on Oct. 19, 1972, Nixon and chief of staff H.R. Haldeman discuss how information about the Watergate break-in was getting into the press. The conversation was excerpted in a story by Tim Noah in the online magazine Slate back in 1999.
Nixon: Well, if they've got a leak down at the FBI, why the hell can't Gray tell us what the hell is left? You know what I mean? ...
Haldeman: We know what's left, and we know who leaked it.
Nixon: Somebody in the FBI?
Haldeman: Yes, sir. Mark Felt. You can't say anything about this because it will screw up our source and there's a real concern. Mitchell is the only one who knows about this and he feels strongly that we better not do anything because —
Nixon: Do anything? Never.
Haldeman: If we move on him, he'll go out and unload everything. He knows everything that's to be known in the FBI. He has access to absolutely everything ...
Nixon: What would you do with Felt?
Haldeman: Well, I asked Dean ...
Nixon: You know what I'd do with him, the *******? Well that's all I want to hear about it.
Haldeman: I think he wants to be in the top spot.
[/ QUOTE ]
Note: Further quotes deleted as inappropriate for CPF (redacted quotes do not make Nixon look any better).
Of course, much of this was just par for the course politics of the time (on both sides of the cesspool).
-BB
MaxaBaker
Flashlight Enthusiast
[ QUOTE ]
DaFiend said:
Ahh. Deep throat... 1972 starring.... oops hang on... wrong forum, wrong deep throat /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleye11.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif
DaFiend said:
Ahh. Deep throat... 1972 starring.... oops hang on... wrong forum, wrong deep throat /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleye11.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif
James S
Flashlight Enthusiast
On the way back from the hardware store today I was behind an old pickup truck that had a "Nixon/Agnew" bumper sticker on it /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
I'M NOT KIDDING!
I'M NOT KIDDING!
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