Is This Asking Too Much From The New Modules?

I love the great sammies Wayne and others have come up with over the years and even though I'm not smart, I'm not really dumb either, (okay, that's debatable!). /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I recently purchased one of cjpeanuts POP2 modules and for the life of me, no matter how hard I try, I don't get it!

Yes, it has low, high, burst, and, (I think), SOS but to reach each mode is mind blowing and especially to an old fart like me!

Listen, these modules are flying out of CPF like hotcakes and I understand you guys are younger than me and you guys understand menus like reading a comic book but these things are not intuitive. Learning these modules are too hard for guys like me and besides, I don't want to click or turn after .04 seconds or whatever to resume whatever mode and when I need a light to go low/high/flash/SOS, I just want to push a button!

Really, what is wrong with a switch that just goes; first click: low, second click: high, third click: burst and last click: SOS? Again, I'm talking real world here to light a light and not what all you techno freaks like! Nothing wrong with that but I don't get it. Again, I don't want to have to turn a bezel again and again for a mode or click a button again and again for a mode.

Thanks for letting me rant because these POP's are too hard for me to figure out, much less to use in an emergency! Too all that love them and are buying them in droves, you're better than me!

Haha. I just prefer a super simple Hi-Low switch. Click on for High and Click again for Low. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif

I don't have any of the POP2 sammies, because when I start to read the manual for it I feel like my head might explode. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif

You could always sell it on the B/S/T forum. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Again, I really do apologize to all that love these things but I just want lights with switches that are intuitive! Low, high,, (maybe medium), burst and SOS. God bless all of you that have the memory skills where you can grab a light or a watch or whatever from your arsonal of gadgets and after not using it for awhile and know it's menu intuitively!

Danny,
Thank you for your input. I swear, I also read those manuals and my head explodes also! The engineers here on CPF are to be lauded highly for what they do but I just don't understand what they're trying to do with all these complications.

I'm now seeing lights that produce 3, 4, 6, 12, hell even 30 to 60 levels of brightness! That's fine to show off what a module can do but really, is that what you need? No, it's not, it's just what is the latest and greatest.

Didn't the ARC 4 fail because of it's many and complicated functions? People just weren't ready for all it could do and you can buy them for a song nowadays.

Folks, no admonishment here to those that do, just PLEASE make it simple!

Thank you Gene for summing it all up in a post. I'm going to end up trying one of the mult-twist light and I'm sure I'm not going to enjoy it as much as I do the McGizmo PD light. The PD light is something I can handle. PD twists on for low and twist it more for high.

Yesterday I got rid of cable and got a satellite dish for four TVs in the house. On each of the new remotes the buttons drove me nuts. I just wanted to change the channel and this is my option beside direct numerical imput- MENU, GUIDE, THEMES, BROWSE, SYS INFO, DISH and a scan up and down hidden in depressions on medium blue buttons. Then if I have the wrong option like TV/VCR/Aux (amplifier) then I've simply messed up.

To select the station on the TV I have to cross reference my TV Guide cable channel number and find the equal station and number equal to my satellite guide. There is a guide next to each of the four remotes that I dare not lose. Geez, I just want to change the TV station.

I would like a simple button or two for selections on lights. I don't like to memorize sequences for different lights.

Let me give credit to Surefire. Specifically the L2 and the U2 with the mult-stage twisty. Those are the stock lights I would use in an emergency.

For mod lights I use one that has a potentiometer, the McGiz PD, Aleph lights with two-stage switches and a Surefire L4 with an Aleph two stage.

I have to agree. While the strobing on the Gladius is neat, and I can sort of see the SOS flashing being useful if you intend to get lost or break your leg climbing, I don't see much point in having all that other stuff.

While I like the idea of having a high setting and a low setting in a light, most of my current projects go about that the low tech way: I use a Luxeon III for bright and one, two or three Nichias for low.

In fact, I just finished a scratch built headlamp with a Luxeon III and two of the new CU binned Nichias... and the Nichias are actually too bright for what I intended... I could have gotten by with just one, which is almost three times brighter than the last light I made with the older ones. And significantly increased my runtime yet still had enough light.

In addition, with this sort of design, even if one of the LEDS burn out, you still get light out of the thing.

I have a LOT of respect for the guys that can design and build these circuits, and build lights around them; and the "gee whiz" factor will just amaze the heck out of the stock Mini-m*g / 99cent plastic flashlight crowd, but I can't see me building or buying one of the fancy electronically controlled lights.

Well, I might buy one just to play with, but I probably wouldn't pick it up in an emergency or EDC it.

Simple lights for a simple mind is my motto. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Hi, Gene.

I think the difference between using a POP and a standard sammie is similar to the difference between driving a manual and a automatic transition car.

There are always two sides of a coin--and for us who like the more fancier functions and like to 'play' with those functions, naturally they might be attracted to the POP/multi functions of light.

Then there are those of us who will appreciate simplicity of a light, like the never-fail simple twist no-off or a short menu.

Honestly, I enjoy both types immensely. I think the key parts in deciding which are what you need it for and what you will enjoy most. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

C'mon now guys...doesn't anyone here carry a photon on their keychain /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Actually I like the regular machanical switches better too. When I need a light I always grab something with a traditional mechanism. But there's always that Photon on my keychain. Every time I go to use it I have to think for a few seconds and it never seems to become second nature, but sometimes the features are useful and fun, and you can't beat the size. The strobe is good for helping someone to find you in a crowd.

I'd really like to see a 3 level Wiz2 sandwich for an EDC light. You know, twist the light for low, a little more for medium, and more for high. Use whatever battery you want and it works. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I too believe in keeping controls uncomplicated. Remember when the left radio knob turned the radio on and also adjusted the volume, while the right knob was for station selection? Not anymore! Now they use 60 tiny buttons with super small print to do basically the same thing. I can't figure out how to turn it on or off, or adjust the volume...much less select a station. JUNK!!!!

I agree. KISS as they say. I'd be fine with a 2 level output. 3 at most. For instance, I'd like to have a tri-k2 mag mod, with 3 levels. High would be 1.5amp's each, medium would be ~800ma each, and low would be ~200ma each. If it didn't have an extra switch for this and used a circuit, then it would be nice if you pressed "on" once and it came on high, press again to go to med-low-off. Or to turn off you press and hold, and then it turns off, remembering the last level it was set at. Either way would be nice, the first would insure if you grabbed it in an emergency you would have high right away.

I don't really care much for multi levels in small lights, as I generally need more light! and if I need less, I'll use my Arc AAA....

Another KISS-fan reporting in! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Gene ... agreed! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink2.gif

However ... if the techno-geeks want it complicated ... I won't be in the way either /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

bernie

The POP sammie has its place. It will turn a simple light with no level control into one with some options. No doubt most would prefer a McLux PD in its place, but sometimes price is an issue. I appreciate the POP2 for leting me turn on a Q3 in a low mode of my choosing (very low when camping, not so low elsewhere) with "full" brightness also readily available. It can be pretty simple if you want it to be, more so than the online descriptions of the menus would imply. I suspect that is the case with other "complicated" menu lights like the HDS too.

But don't worry, the Flashlight Police aren't going to make you buy them.

I didn't "get it" either. There's a thread (the last sales thread?) where he posted a video of how the switching is done. Cleared things up right away for me. Hope it works for you too.

Gene.
You are not alone.
IMHO it's great to see some of the guys experimenting with 'new' ways of switching etc. However just because its possible to do something, does not make it necessarily good.
The market place is the great leveller and it will decide the outcome. I personally thing George80 is on the right track with his electronic thumb switch as currently used in the LH/LC. Its sad that the recent controversy over the Bulk lights has rather sidelined this most excellent switch design and we can hope that it becomes available in some other manufacturers product line soon. The UI available in that switch is superb.
However simplicity in electronic switching will eventually win out, and while we are waiting, it is hard to fault a simple 1/4 turn twist to switch a light.

Waiting for the perfect uC switch too ... would be a switch that simulated the action of a most sophisticated mechanical switch with less parts and labor ... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
bernie

P.S.: please understand that my "promotion" of KISS switches is not intended as an attack on all you guys who love your HDS, Arc, LH etc. ... it is just a different opinion and philosophy for tools in general.

The LH is pretty close to ideal in basic use, UI1 - it has the multi-stage, but you can either set it up to work like a two stage (force-level whatever, then high) or else you can set it up to scroll through multiple stages with one button-press instead of the 5-6 that the ARC 4+ used to make you use. It's not as simple as the mechanical switch, granted - but it's pretty simple as is.

Short of a mind-reading flashlight, I'm having problems figuring out how to simplify that yet further while keeping the extra functionality. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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Short of a mind-reading flashlight, I'm having problems figuring out how to simplify that yet further while keeping the extra functionality.

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Ah ... but it's that extra functionality that I just do not need in such a small and simplistic tool. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif ... makes a simple idea (portable illumination) get overly complex and distracting to the important task at hand, whatever that would be.

bernie

- programmable lights are fun, just as flashlights are fun...
- a single switch that does everything IS as simple as I can imagine it can be...
- the new POP2 v2.31 comes on low first, high after 2 clicks, and the low is programmable, much better than all that ****ing around with resistors and hoping it won't flicker on low (as in two stage Alephs with Wiz converters)...
- strobing and SOS-ing is fairly trivial, but a programmable 2 stage light is the ducks nuts! oops, I mean well worth it!

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a single switch that does everything IS as simple as I can imagine it can be...

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This single switch is the "bottleneck" for the abundance of functions in those light. The problem gets less severe (for me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif ) with the Eternalight for example ... which has 3 buttons for a similar interface.


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much better than all that ****ing around with resistors and hoping it won't flicker on low (as in two stage Alephs with Wiz converters)...

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Ah ... never claimed to have the Holy Grail of switches either /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif ... just talking switch philosophy. If you want a KISS 2-stage fully regulated take the McLuxIII-PD ... the successor of the Aleph.

The problem I see with the PD is that it took a hell of a lot of difficulat engineering to get to the KISS-switch eventually. This goal *might* be easier to reach in the future once the uC switches start to become useable. This is the goal after all, at least for me.
The Gladius showed very promising new elements in uC switches IMHO. The future should hold some interesting things to come ...

bernie

The U2 has an easy multi-level switch with no thought required. I agree that the programmable lights are fun. It all depends on the tasks you're using the lights for. If I'm working on an engine or fixing a broken appliance, for example, and have a tool in one hand and I'm leaned over or crouched down disassembling, measuring or adjusting something and need a light, I just want to be able to grab it and turn it on without refocusing my attention. This is the type of situation a simple twist or push button makes more sense. But, if I'm camping, or in a power outage, or just using a light for non mission-critical or time-sensitive purposes, then a programmable light has more versatility.