Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please help!

Alright Hot Wire guys, I have quite a bit of questions and I'm getting lost. I've been reading the forums for two days straight now and my mind is in a jumble! Your advice and help is urgently requested and will be used in the decision I make, so please be accurate and straightforward.

Alrighty, first let me lay out what my expectations/wants are in a modified Maglite:
* I want nothing bigger then a 3D host
* I want lots of runtime (70mins plus) at a *MINIMUM* of 400 lumens
* I want to use ONLY AA rechargeable cells (everything else is too exotic/expensive for my blood)
* I want the light to be extremely reliable
* I don't want to have to do anything special (e.g. wait hours after taking batteries off charger just so bulb won't blow)
* I want be able to have maximum flexibility when it comes to bulb choices (e.g. I want to be able to put out over 800 lumens at reduced runtime, I also want to be able to find bulbs well into the future)

With the above in mind I have worked up a possible specification using a 3D host:
LOP Reflector = $020.00
Borofloat lens = $005.00
High Temp KIU Switch = $025.00 ($03.00 s/h) (could be less if I get adapter and install on my own)
Battery Adapter = $036.00 ($04.30 s/h)
VANSON V-6988 Charger = $022.95 ($10.14 s/h)
AA Titanium 2600 mAh NiMH = $029.00 ($2.90x10)
Bi-Pin WA01306 = $018.00
total = $173.39

Even though I was able to come up with the above, I still have a ton of questions and they are:
1) What runtime can I expect with the above?
2) What is the formula to figure out runtime?
3) What kind of lumens can I expect?
4) Will I have to do anything special with the batteries before using them directly from charger?

Despite the above specification, I'm still really not trusting myself. I'd really like to see a specification from someone else that would meet my expectations/wants outlined above. I'm really sorry for making this post in the first place, but I just have to. I'm completely lost. After reading this forum for two days solid (seriously, no sleep) my mind is just spinning in circles! Please guys, give me the details and help me out, I would really appreciate it. Hopefully in the future this thread can serve as a "receipe for success" for others who just stumble upon this message board like me! I've really learned alot in all my reading, but I still really am confused, please help me! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

I dunno.. often what we want conflicts with what technology can deliver. 70+ minutes is a lot to ask for.

Runtime is current capacity of cells (2600) divided by current draw of the lamp. I have no idea about the current draw of that particular lamp so I can't calculate for you.

I can recommend one configuration that I've already researched, and that might work for you.

2D Maglite, LOP reflector, borofloat lens, two of the 3toD adapters ($5 each). Six of your AA cells. Pelican bulb part number #3854 as a two-bulb kit with 11W and 24W high output lamp, $15. No special bipin whatevers needed, since this is a PR drop-in bulb replacement. It's not meant for the Maglite but it works with the correct power pack.

Myself I use the 24W bulb since I want ALL the power and none of the compromises, but you'd be best served by the 11W bulb. Rated at 290 lumens, overdriven to bulb 550 lumens, derates to 350 output lumens once you've factored in optical losses. AFAIK no waiting time required, just light and go. 2.6A battery capacity / 2 amp draw = 1.3 hours = 78 minutes (theoretically). I'll give it around 70 minutes of runtime. Carry reloads.

And when you need more output, switch the 24W bulb in. Rated 610 lumens, overdriven to 1150 bulb lumens, derates to ~800+ lumens. Unholy bright. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif you severely compromise runtime as a result though.

Build instructions

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Many thanks KevinL, I appreciate the well written post and the detailed specification. What do you mean by "It's not meant for the Maglite but it works with the correct power pack."? By power pack you're referring to the batteries used I would assume or are you talking about something else? I know this seems like a dumb question, but uhm.. my mind is fried at this point and I just want to double check. Also, what adapters (3toD) are you using that are only $5 and where can I read about them/get them? I was looking into the FM 6AA adapter if I went the 2D route, but I'm opened to cheaper alternatives so long as it performs just as well! Also, another question, I'm going to assume (based on what I've read elsewhere) that you haven't switched out the bulb adapter with a high temp one due to the fact that the bulb in use is potted right? Apparently if the bulbs are potted you don't run the risk of switch meltdown, right? Or is this really not true if you plan on using the light for long periods of time (20mins plus each time)? Thanks for helping, I appreciate it very much!

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

KevinL I hope I'm not being rude by answering the questions meant for you...

The bulb is meant for use in Pelican lights, not in mag lights. The power pack is a collective term for the power source. You're right there mike.

The 3 to D adapters are from elektrolumens.com , click on the shopping section. It's a little bit hidden (at least I got lost the first time I went there). They're 3.50 each.

Re: the heat and the switch for a potted lamp - I'm not sure.

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Hrm, clicked all over elektrolumens.com and still can't seem to find the adapters. I did find a few "hidden sections," just not the right one. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Can you please link me to the particular section that lists the adapters, thanks!

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Grox, no problem at all /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif it's a Sunday here as it is for you, and no matter how much coffee I drink, my mind doesn't seem to be working as well as it usually does. And I didn't even have anything to drink last night.. must be the hangover from the week /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif thanks for helping me field some of the questions.

FM's adapter is really nice if your wallet agrees with you. I use the more affordable 3toDs as I am, as always, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/broke.gif . The 3toDs MAY occasionally require a little bit of fiddling. Rare, but it does happen from time to time, I just reseat the adapters inside the Mag and they're ok. Other than that they are very functional pieces of hardware.

No changes to the stock bulb pedestal, and no problems running the 24W ultra high power lamp for 30+ minutes at one go.

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Wow Kevin, that is great news. You've really got my attention with your posts. This seems like an incrediblely affordable hot wire light! I'm definitely adding this to my list of 'specifications' that I have wrriten down. Thanks so much.

To everyone else: please do still post other specifications for hot wire lights that match the expectations/wants in the first post. Me and many others can still benefit from seeing all the different specifications in one thread rather than searching all over (which I have done and didn't come up with alot)!

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Elektrolumens page

Just scroll down that link and it's there.

I've had problems with my FM 9aa-3d not lighting sometimes too but it may be the fact that the batteries in it have a bit of gunk on their terminals rather than a problem with the holder itself.

Supposedly these new holders have got less resistance than the v1s. I've got some on the way, I hope to report back soon. Hope they're less temperamental than the last lot were reputed to be

One advantage of FM's adapters is that you can charge the batteries inside them with a pack charger rather than pulling all of them out, charging, then putting them back in.

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Just thought of a few more questions Kevin (or anyone else in the know). What is the common voltage that AA rechargables operate on (in particular I'm trying to identify the Titanium 2600mAh voltage, its not listed on amondotech)? How can I figure out the overvoltage affect on the Pelician bulbs in question (whats the formula)? What does the beam look like on the setup you described (is it tight w/ decent spill for long throw)?

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Ahh, I now see why I didn't see the adapters. I was looking for a picture of something akin to the FM adapters! These adapters look like a very fine product. I'm going to wait for some others to post up specifications, but you guys (KevinL and Grox) have really got me hooked on this ROP idea. What a lost-cost alternative! Thanks again.

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Fresh off the charger about 1.40 volts, and midpoint 1.2 volts. The endpoint (at which you SHOULD NOT use them any more) is about 0.8V.

I think the rerating formula looks like

((new voltage/intended voltage)^3.5) * (lumens at intended voltage)

Factor in 60-65% losses for what comes out the front.

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

I also forgot to ask, what is a good source for the Pelician bulbs? I'm currently looking through the dealer's section trying to locate a store.

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

I haven't built a ROP (yet, muahahaa) but I hope to sometime. The usual constraints are holding me back (money, time). Let us know how you go!

Kudos to Kevin for inventing this great little mod /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowdown.gif

Instructions are here: http://mrbulk.darkgear.com/forum/index.php?topic=235.0

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

To anyone in the know, are Titanium 2600mAh cells rated at 10A + output (e.g are they high drain cells)?

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

The Titanium's as well as most other consumer NiMH are fine for the 11W lamp, you do not need high current cells for those. The 24W runs best on high current cells but may run acceptably well on the Titanium 2600s anyway - you'd best ask Silverfox, he is the resident battery guru with the hardware to back up what he's talking about. Ask him whether your cells can take a 4 amp drain - if they are good for 4-5 amps, they will even run the 24W without problems.

No worries about the batteries overdriving the lamp, I routinely light mine hot off the charger with high current cells, not a single recorded failure. In fact, some of the crazier hotwire folks have been feeding it SEVEN cells, which is waaaaaaaay out there. I personally wouldn't do it but so far the two of them are enjoying the light! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Basically if they can get away with seven we should all be able to run with six very comfortably. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


BTW as mentioned I cannot take credit for this - Phaserburn found the bulb and suggested that it could be run in a Maglite due to its PR base. I merely got a pack built up for it, checked whether the reflector would fit and published my results.

If you want you can read the story of how it all began /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Why not just get CBP high current cells. Then you'll have no problems with current draw...

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

This is true, but aren't they of lower capacity? If the Titanium 2600mAh can do 5A I'd think they'd last a decent amount longer then 1650mAh batteries.

Also, I got a rather unusual question. I was thinking of buying the BC-900 charger to charge my AA batteries when I buy them and I just found out it comes with two AA to D battery adapters/holders. Has anyone tried these in a Maglite? Do they work well?

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

They only hold one cell each But it is a very nice charger You can't go wrong on that.
Chris

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

Well I just got back from Walmart and I bought two 2D host, one gray and one red. The bill was ONLY $35.82. A full $11.56 less than the Scorpion I will be taking back tomorrow. I'm going to be stuck with 2xScorpion replacement bulbs and a brand new box of 12 SF Lithium cells. I guess I can just try and sell those in the B/S/T section at a later date.

I'm still looking for more 'specifications/plans' for hot wires that use 2D and 3D hosts. Please by all means, share your receipe for success!

Re: Recipe for Hot Wire modified Maglite? Please h

[ QUOTE ]
KevinL said:
Runtime is current capacity of cells (2600) divided by current draw of the lamp. I have no idea about the current draw of that particular lamp so I can't calculate for you.

Myself I use the 24W bulb since I want ALL the power and none of the compromises, but you'd be best served by the 11W bulb. Rated at 290 lumens, overdriven to bulb 550 lumens, derates to 350 output lumens once you've factored in optical losses. AFAIK no waiting time required, just light and go. 2.6A battery capacity / 2 amp draw = 1.3 hours = 78 minutes (theoretically). I'll give it around 70 minutes of runtime. Carry reloads.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just looked up some Big D bulbs on pelican.com. Apparently the Big D Alkaline bulb is 200 lumens, 1.1A, 7.2V, 8W. By my math this would equal about ~2.4hrs/141mins of runtime at probably right around the initial 200 lumens figure (not sure how to figure out lumens after overvoltage and then by what factor to compensate for optical losses, if someone could tell me how to figure this out I'd love to know). That seems like a very good tradeoff between weight/carry ability/lumens in my opinion. Has anyone tried using this bulb before? Is it potted (don't know anything about it except what they say in the specs)?

If someone can tell me if its potted I think I'm going to go ahead and buy one of these bulbs at the same time I buy the others to try out. Anyone know of some other bulbs I should look into? I'm so glad I posted this thread before I made a decision! Keep the plans coming guys! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif