More widespread uses of LED?

I am just curious if anyone knows...Are the major lighting players attempting to develop LED light bulbs? I know its not a great deal for them...Last forever...dont draw alot of power...but it would be great for the average person? What are the roadblocks to that type of technology? At a recent Lexus meeting I was told we will see 100% LED lighting in the 07 LS460....What is the automotive future of LED?


Glock Guy

I'm sure we'll see LED household bulbs eventually. Look at it this way-fluorescents last a very long time, don't use much energy, and are cheap, yet it's still profitable to sell them. It will be the same with LEDs. Someone will make them, and it will be good for the customer as well.

As for automotive use of LEDs, it's only a matter of time. Car manufacturers make nothing if a burnt out bulb is replaced by a mechanic. It's a good selling point to have LEDs which never need to be replaced. It also makes design easier if you don't need a tail light, head light, or instrument light to be accessible for bulb replacement. I've watched my brother many times cursing as he had to replace burnt out instrument lights, for example. That is probably already a thing of the past. Soon replacing any bulbs will be.

Current Compact Florescent bulbs produce about 60 lumens per watt already, and last almost as long as the useable life of an LED and I don't think you realize how much light a normal 60 watt light bulb puts out. According to the DOE ~800 Lumens...

However, Phillilps (last year or so) designed and implemented the first LED street lamps in some european city of somewhere.

I run compact florscent bulbs throughout my whole house. I like them because you know the color temperature as it is usually written on the box. I use different colors(of white) in different parts of the house. It's good technology, you should look into it.

Compact flourescents do not last anywhere near as long as the usable life of LEDS designed for long service life such as Luxeons and some of the other high powered LEDs we are seeing. The best compact flourescents are rating at 10K hours. Luxeons are rated at 50K hours if treated properly and that is with only 30% life degredation. The best power LEDS are sitting about 40-50 lumens/watt (production), but only the low end of the power leds, i.e. the ones in the 1 watt range. Other power leds claim those efficiencies, but not if you actually turn them on and leave them on as the thermals, etc. quickly push the light output down. Hence, one of the biggest issues today is cost. However, if you have a light that you really need to be on and/or are difficult to replace, LED can make a lot of sense. I.e. lights in remote locations, high up an inaccessible, or you just really need it to be on.

SemiMan

Two things that keep LEDs from taking over the world is initial cost and
replacement options. So far LEDs putting out lumens equal to general lighting needs can add up to costs way above entry level fluorescent bulbs and take complicated designs to shed heat buildup. I recall when the screw in CFL bulbs came out they were about $15-$20 each and now they can be bought around $3-9 or less in bulk. Compare this to the LED screw in bulbs I have seen costing in excess of $40 which have had odd output patterns and/or interesting color output and they have a ways to go to compete. It takes more electronics to adapt LEDs to house use because they are more sensitive to slight overdrive than incans and flouros and this adds to cost. I certainly wouldn't want a $20 LED bulb that if power hiccups or surges gets fried easily and with the lower levels of output LEDs have right now underdriving them slightly to prevent such problems is probably not going to happen, if anything manufacturers will always overdrive LEDs for higher output figuring they win all the way around because bulbs that never die could someday cut into their profits if they reached prices as low as $10 each.

The main reasons LEDs are showing up in traffic lights etc is the high cost of replacing them outweighs the cost of the light assembly due to longer time between replacements.... (or so they think). As long as these lights hold out at their rated life you will see them replacing lights in a lot of places, especially high traffic areas where it is outright dangerous to replace.

I would like to see LEDs replace everything but until they develop arrays that have more even omnidirectional lighting and cost as cheap as a $1 incan I don't think they will completely replace flouros and incans.

glock35guy said: "...Are the major lighting players attempting to develop LED light bulbs?...would be great for the average person? What are the roadblocks to that type of technology?...

There have been prototype cars with LED array headlights. Many cars already have LED array tail lights.

Even now LEDs make sense for automotive dashboard lights, due to the high labor cost of replacing incandescents.

The upcoming K2 emitter will enable single-emitter LED tail lights, plus a wider range of industrial and residential applications.

Plug-compatible LED residential "bulbs" already exist but are expensive:

http://www.theledlight.com/120-VAC-LEDbulbs.html
http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/lights/7aa8/

Prices will probably gradually decline, like they did with compact fluorescents (which initially were very expensive).

Re efficiency in residential applications, compact fluorescents are already much more efficient than present LEDs, so the main advantage to LEDs is longer life.

New high efficiency LEDs like the K2 roughly equal the efficiency of compact fluorescents, but not the efficiency of T8 fluorescent tubes. Presumably semiconductor-based LEDs will continue to improve at a faster rate than other technologies, so eventually they may become more prevalent.