Need help with increasing back pain.

My lower back pain is getting a lot worse. This started in 2002 as a relatively small pain in my right hip, but this past year it has gotten much worse. MRI's indicate only a small bulge between L4-L5 vertebrae – nothing that should cause this much pain.

I have tried several kinds of specialists and treatments, and currently, I am eating pain pills prescribed by a pain/anesthesiologist. He tried giving me epidural steroid injections. The first one worked, but I had serious reactions to the second and third attempts.

I tried a thing called "prolotherapy" in 2003, but the insurance does not cover it.

Recently, I tried a thing called, "disk decompression". This is a glorified chiropractor that uses a machine to stretch your back. Sounds good up front, but I had to stop because it was really hurting me.

At this time, I am doing mild exercises and applying either cold or heat.

No one has proposed surgery, because it doesn't look bad enough. From people I have talked to that have had surgery, it could either fix the problem or make it worse again. So, I am scared to try that.

Can anyone share their experiences with this agony?

Thanks so much!

Chuck

Consider purchasing an inversion table, that you lay on then tilt so that you are basically hanging from your ankles. Allegedly decompresses the squished discs. Also consider one of those devices that you attach to your back with adhesive stickers that sends electrical jolts into your muscles. We have both at the Powernoodle Compound. I only suffer from back spasms, but find both to be helpful.

If you get desperate, and back pain suffers do, you might read a book by John Sarno on the mind-body connection contributing to back pain. Sounds like hocus pocus, but some folks swear by it.

Good luck!

Ok, This is going to sound really stupid and like 'quackery'...

Have you tried magnets?

I know, I know; Magnets have been hyped for everything from putting one on your carburetor and getting 100 miles per gallon, and putting on your water pipes to give you pure water. And I'm a big skeptic about all the miracle health cures and any miracle products, but magnets really seem to work on this sort of thing.

Just a little background: I have had really bad knees for 25 years; (too many parachute jumps and too many thousands of miles with a 100 lb+ backpack).

My "ex" is an acupuncturist and Traditional Oriental Medicine practicioner (as well as having 30 years experience as a Western medicine tech) , and they use little teeny ferrous magnets for some therapy, and a lot of people swear it works. She tried it on me, and it didn't work at all. (and I didn't expect it to).

Well, one day, a few years later, I was playing around with some small, but very powerful rare earth magnets. (actually, I was setting up a reed switch for a hidden garage door opener switch.) My knees were 'screaming', so just for the heck of it, I taped a couple of them on, and darned if it didn't work. Pain eased up for me almost immediately, and was ~85% gone within a few days.

And it seems to have a lasting effect. My knees sometimes still flare up, but only enough to notice it maybe once a month... It was nearly constant before... And I only have to resort to magnets on my knees maybe 4 times a year now.... And I'm not doing anything else differently that might account for the effect.

Last couple of years my back has gotten in pretty sad shape too, and when it stays hurting for more than 24 hours straight, I apply some magnets and 9 times out of 10 the pain is reduced by ~75% percent, or even completely goes away.

I'm still a skeptic about it; I am always surprised when it works, and I'm not easily fooled by a placebo effect. But darned if it doesn't seem to work reliably

I won't promise it will help with your problem, but heck, it is worth a try. I've been selling magnet therapy kits through one of my little web stores for years, and offer a no questions full refund if anyone is dissatisfied, and no one has asked for their money back yet.

PM me if you are interested, and I'll set you up with a small kit free if you want to give it a try.

try the info on http://www.drbookspan.com/clinical.html

Read all the articles. Really study them.

Don't be afraid to email Dr. Bookspan. She has been very helpful to me through email.

The basic concept is to take the pressure off your back by using your abs to lift the front of your pelvis so it's level. There will be less curve in your lower back. Your back muscles will be able to lengthen and relax, something they are not able to do now.

I no longer have any back pain.

Sorry to hear about your pain Chuck. For me getting older has meant arthritis, especially in my back. I too am taking pain meds as well as anti-inflamitories. Not much to do for this kind of arthritis yet. Best thing for me is a soak in the hot tub. Works better than any pain pills. The only problem was for me I had to give it up for a while. The hot tub appears to be contra-indicated when a couple is trying to get pregnant. I look forward to my evening soaks again soon. :naughty: I hope you find something that works for you.

Greg

I'll second the inversion / gravity boot therapy and the EMS / TENS.

http://www.tensunits.com/whatistens.htm

http://www.sitincomfort.com/inprod.html

My problem is muscular tension and I find certain stretches to be the most effective thing. You might try taking a yoga class to learn some good stretches and maybe discover a combination that helps you.

I had my back surgery 8 weeks ago. It went well. Let me tell you all about it in case anything helps. I'm not a doctor and don't pretend to know what I'm talking about .

The problem manifested in November of last year. Probably about the time I packed up my mom's house and unpacked it all when she got to Oregon. 327 boxes, if I recall correctly. Many, Many tons.

Like Lightchucker, the sciatica was involved so the pain hit in my lower back, butt cheek and lower leg. At first I could sit OK but had problems when I bent over. It progressed to where sitting was murder. A 5 minute trip by car was agony.

I coped with it by laying on the floor to rest and standing the rest of the time. I worked from home as a computer consultant, so I was able to set a PC on a TV tray on the coffee table to get it to a usable height. I did this for almost 9 months.

First I did the anti-inflamatory, but there was no big change. I was referred to a specialist. that's when they did the MRI

The MRI showed that I had a hefty protrusion at the front of the l4-l5 disc. The MRI report called it a "Large central disc protrusion up to 5mm in AP dimension". That's about a 1/4 inch. I remember being surprised at the size. It also talked of "severe lateral recess narrowing" with "impingement on the right L5 traversing nerve root". In other words a pinched nerve.

They did not do an epidural because of the blood thinners that I take. My neurologist and back doctor played ping pong for 5 months each examining me and sending me back to the other. Bleeding after an epidural can be a major complication. When the back doctor decided to do the epidural anyway I got spooked and got a second opinion.

My second doctor recommended a short course of PT (Physical Therapy) since it had been 8 months since the original injury. The PT did help. The PT was masage, heat, movement and eletrostim. They suggested a "lumbar support pillow" when I had to sit.

Because the bulge was toward the front of the disk, I needed a curve in the spine to reduce the pressure. The PT and lumbar support pillow did well enough that I could drive 10 to 15 minutes with only minor pain. I still could not sit in front of my computer, but things were getting better. One day out of 5 had no pain at all for several hours at a time. When it did hurt, it was just as bad as ever.

This whole time I did not take pain pills. I simply avoided anything that caused it to hurt worse.

At the end of 3 weeks of PT, the doctor told me that a micro-discectomy and laminectomy would
probably fix the problem for at least several years. The micro-discectomy trimmed off the bulge and the laminectomy took off some of the bone next to where the nerve passes through. They also cleaned out some disc fragments that had broken free and were floating around.

The surgery was outpatient under general anesthesia. 2 hours, I think. The inscision is only 1 inch long. I look like I have a belly button in the middle of my back, but that's been filling in.

I have full range of movement again, and the sciatica pain was gone the day of the operation. Of course, then I felt like I'd been stabbed in the back. * Occasionally I get a twinge in my leg that is reminiscent of the sciatica, but only momentarily. I'm still on "light" duty and am only allowed to pick up 5 pounds. I feel like I'm 100% OK, but I learned to follow doctors' orders.

Degenerative discs run in the family. My son is having problems at the age of 30. He's taking Neurontin for the pain and it is helping him. He's not restricted his movements at all. He works as a manager of a Pizza parlor so he's lifting and bending all day long.

In summary, the PT may help, but it's important to figure out the cause of the impingement and tailor the PT to that. Changes in posture can help too. The surgery can be a godsend IF the conditions are right. If the root cause is muscle tension pulling the vertebre out of position, the PT will be most effective, as will TENS and masage. If the root cause is narrowing of the bone around the nerve, surgery is the only option that I was told about. I was lucky. It worked and only took a year.

Good luck and feel free to PM me if you want to talk about it or just want a picture of the surgey site after healing.

Daniel

My spouse has a lower back injury, and we discovered that one of the contributors to frequent lower back pain was our old waterbed which was way too soft. A firmer mattress made a significant contribution to reduction of back pain and increase in mobility.

I see almost everyone let their pelvis tilt forwards. You end up with a big belly and your back muscles are always very tight. You can consciously correct this and over time it becomes automatic. You will look better and you won't have anymore back pain.

It's really an easy thing. I've recommended this to a lot of people but most people don't want to take any responsibility for themselves. They want a pill or surgery or whatever. It never occurs to them that it could be this easy.

We are not meant to have back pain all the time. The reason we have it is poor posture. We let our pelvis tilt. Read the articles and try the exercises for a week. You will feel an amazing difference.

Contrary to what people are told, doctors know *nothing* about back problems. They are complete idiots. Surgery is a big racket that hurts people more than helps.

I tried many things over the years until Dr. Bookspan's site showed me how easy it is. Her book the Abs Revolution is more detailed but the articles on her site are enough and you don't need the book.

Our hospital has actually started a Reiki clinic for pain relief, I know it is another "quackery" sounding idea, but until you SEE it work and witness the lasting effects it is undeniable, our doctors won't acknowledge chiropratic medice as an alternative or conjunctive therapy but they actually HIRE Reiki therapists for the OR, Pain clinic and Anesthesia, If you have not tried it find out if there is one available in your area

It's also possible you have some serious muscle spasms...a good massage therapist could do wonders. Ask some coworkers if they can recommend one...you want a GOOD one -- a bad one can do more harm than good.

Good luck...

JM-99

cognitivefun said:

We are not meant to have back pain all the time. The reason we have it is poor posture. We let our pelvis tilt. Read the articles and try the exercises for a week. You will feel an amazing difference.

Contrary to what people are told, doctors know *nothing* about back problems. They are complete idiots. Surgery is a big racket that hurts people more than helps.

I tried many things over the years until Dr. Bookspan's site showed me how easy it is. Her book the Abs Revolution is more detailed but the articles on her site are enough and you don't need the book.

Click to expand...

It's not a bad idea to check into all possibilities. I have to take exception to the blanket statement that "doctors know *nothing* about back problems. They are complete idiots". There are obviously some bad doctors as well as some good ones. Mine was very good and did a terrific job.

The real key is to isolate the root cause. In my case, the disc was bulging at the front, so flattening the spine inreased pressure instead of helping.

The advent of MRI has made a big difference in the diagnosis of "soft tissue" injuries. I was able to see on the MRI film the bulge and the hole where the nerve was supposed to be. Even I could see there would be a problem. 30 years ago the narrowing of the holes could be detected but the disc itself did not show up on the film. They had to guess at the cause based on symptoms alone.

If the first doctor can't find a definitive cause of the pain, get a second opinion from another. My insurance did not balk at my seeing a second doctor for the same problem.

Again... Good luck.

I've had bulging discs at L4/L5 now for about 7 years. I've found that massage really DOES help -- find someone who specializes in deep tissue massage.

My wife purchased a "Zero Gravity" chair from the Relax the Back Store for me. It reclines FAR backward, with my head ending up lower than my butt. It seems to take all the pressure off my back. Apparently, it mimics the chair that astronauts use in space.

I SLEEP in this thing every night, as I was not able to find a bed, including Tempurpedic, that was comfortable.

I would also recommend a short course of really good pain medicine, at least until you can get the muscle spasms to calm down. If the muscles in the L4/L5 area are "protecting" the site, they can become VERY tight -- and they will "reach out" and affect other nerves, such as the sciatic nerve.

The combo of time-release pain medicine, massage and my beloved chair has left me virtually pain-free.

Good Luck!

Tom

I had daily lower back pain for the past several years, the last several vertebrae were locked together and didn't move. I also had upper back pain in the AM usually waking me up around 5am.

I went to the doc who prescribed physical therapy which helped greatly. They had me exercise and stretch twice daily which helped with both. The lower pain needed manual treatment meaning they would massage and "move" the lower spine to loosen it up. All of this was before Katrina hit.

Since Katrina I haven't been to the therapist for my back and it hasn't been hurting. I still do the stretches at home. Now I go to physical therapy and do different exercises to get strength back in my leg which I had knee surgery just before the hurricane (almost complete atrophy of the quad muscles).

Although I am doing different excercises, since I am still excercising my legs it also seems to help my back. I haven't had lower back pain, and not much upper back pain since I have been excercising daily.

Here is a page of back excersises. http://www.nismat.org/orthocor/programs/lowback/backex.html#Ex1

Doing daily time on a recumbent bike and mini-squats are working for me now, but a therapist would be best to analize your particular needs.

So to sum up dialy stretching and excercise will usually do the trick (if the problem doesn't need surgery). Oh, and all of this is without any medication at all YMMV.

gadget_lover said:

It's not a bad idea to check into all possibilities. I have to take exception to the blanket statement that "doctors know *nothing* about back problems. They are complete idiots". There are obviously some bad doctors as well as some good ones. Mine was very good and did a terrific job.

Click to expand...

I don't casually throw out this statement. There was a front page NY Times article some months back that backs me up.

It turns out that back surgery has a very poor prognosis. But the back surgeons said "how will we make our living if we don't do it?" I'm not kidding.

My father-in-law was a very well known orthopedist and he didn't believe in back surgery.

You can x-ray or MRI 1000 people's backs and find pathologies in hundreds of them. Ask the people and they will tell you they are asymptomatic.

Yet, when you do go in and complain, they often find something. The x-rays and scans are very convincing.


I will again point to posture as the central issue. I watch people's posture and most people have very poor posture. The #1 problem is they have an exaggerated curve in their lower back, aka lordosis.

Here's how to tell about your posture:

1. Go up against a wall, heels to the wall, butt to the wall. Your shoulders against the wall. Where is your head? Your head should be naturally against the wall, too.

Yet most people are head-forward. They get more head forward as they get older. Look at Larry King as an example -- a head forward of the torso. Doesn't look comfortable and I am sure it is not.

2. Stand in front of a mirror with your hands to your sides. Do you see the edge of your thumbs or do you see more of your hand than that? Most people see their fingers. Why? Because the pectorals are perpetually shortened at the expense of perpetually lengthened back muscles. Some pectoral stretches can help make this a lot better.

3. In front of a mirror, with your cloths on, look at your belt. Does your belt sort of point downwards? You can observe a pelvic tilt. Now, pull your abs up so you straighten your pelvis and your lordosis is smaller. Now stand against the wall. Guess what? Your head will be closer to the wall or against the wall.

You need to re-learn use of your abs so you are always holding your pelvis level. 90% of people don't do this and their back muscles are chronically shortened. This chronic problem results in all kinds of pain and problems for many of us.

Back trouble isn't natural. It is caused by something. Usually it is caused by poor posture and that usually is because of lack of using the abs as they were intended to be used.

Look in the

Most of the advice in this thread sounds pretty reasonable to me. But then IANAD

I can say though that having myself had and had friends and relatives go through back problems, that a few days of bedrest are as effective at relieving it as a trip to the chiropractor. Lay down and stay there, get the pressure and the problem off of it and let it start to heal or whatever. This is actually not just anecdotal advice, but real medical studies still show that for regular back pain a few days of bedrest is as effective as any other remedy apart from surgery, which is often not a full cure either and if you can avoid it you should.

Course, what you have might not be considered "regular" back pain, but in any case a day or 2 of bed rest has no serious complications Unless you have a too soft mattress!

Silviron said:

Ok, This is going to sound really stupid and like 'quackery'...

Have you tried magnets?

I know, I know; Magnets have been hyped for everything from putting one on your carburetor and getting 100 miles per gallon, and putting on your water pipes to give you pure water. And I'm a big skeptic about all the miracle health cures and any miracle products, but magnets really seem to work on this sort of thing.

Click to expand...

I'll be another to admit that I'm "Mr. Skeptical" from the start!! A co-worker at work who had lower back pain and used magnets, did a little demo on me - making a longer story shorter...my sister~n~law sent me one of those HoMedic "magnet therapy" kits (has several size/shape earth magnets with belts/straps to wear them)...

I slipped the trapezoidal one behind my belt on my lower back for several weeks - I INDEED experienced relief or at least perceived it. After all the mind is a powerful thing and if I believed it was going to work - that coupled with time and being aware of posture???

I'd do it again! Not saying it would work on everyone though...

This made a world of difference in my lower back:

http://www.amerimark.com/cgi-bin/amerimark/cat_item.html?prod=22653&media=G02098&days=XVQ

Cheap and can be done every day. I noticed a huge difference after my first "session".

Eric

I had one of these for an unrelated use, my mother-in -law used it for her lower back pain.. It is supposed to be the best.
This just happens to be my auction..
Tens unit
David