500 Lumen - AAA Flashlight (photos) - Work In Progress - Part 2

[Cataract]

Hey guy's, mine never got hot, that I know of, anyway. But, it did seem to die on me. For some reason, I decided I didn't think the magnet was "working" any longer. I pulled out a dime sized neodymium magnet I had around and swiped it around the control ring and bingo. It seems the magnet is either just too weak or somehow moving. I now have the spacer magnet shrink tubed on my control ring and it functions again.

I also had the same spring problem. Mine actually went a step further and eventually burned, as in like a fuse. Found pieces in the bottom of the tube. Replaced it with another, beefier spring and no problems since.

Just a couple thoughts... Hope they help!

Th8tredude

Just tried with a neodymium magnet, strong enough that it sticks to the ring's magnet and still nothing and the head still gets warm (never got the thing hot as I didn't wait for that to happen). I'm still keeping the theory of spring problem open, but I wasn't able to pull it out so far as it seems to have a pretty good grip on the bottom of the tube; it even looks like it fits in a groove on the sides, but it's hard to tell at this size. I'll bring it at work tomorrow and see if we have a boroscope head that can get a good look inside (I knew I had something I wanted to look at with it!). The spring is really clean, though. I'll also grab some of the real electronics Q-tips to give it a real clean.

Thanks for sharing! :twothumbs:
I'll definitely

 

[nbp]

Yeah, the spring catches tight. I mangled one charred spring up trying to pull it out with a paperclip. Had to put the one in from the other body. Not a big deal though since it's not functioning anyways, but the spring seems to be at least partly the culprit in some of the issues.

 

[mcbrat]

X073 landed today! top notch packaging all the way...

I tested first that a nuke lit it up, and it did, but since everyone else had been testing stock functions, I thought I'd go the route of lego testing.

I did stretch the long body spring, and curl in the small end for a smaller contact point to avoid the pitfalls a few other have had with the spring.

While my 2 copper HF parts all interchange quite easily, the 10440 torp body did not want to thread onto one of the 10440 HF bodies. The torp 10250 body went on fine though. I finally got the torp 10440 body to thread onto the other CU HF 10440 body, but it wasn't smooth, and had to be forced a bit, and there was a thin curl of AL by the torp body threads when I pulled them apart. it looked like I had run a tap into the body. it still fit on the torp head fine though.

so I tried a few different configurations. the longer ones I ran 2 AAA in for 3.0 volts. bottom 2 modes worked fine. 3rd level would last a half second then drop down.

loaded with 2 alkaleaks.

Loaded with an efest 10440

short body size comparison with some other small lights.

I now have it in stock short body config with a nuke, as a pocket carry light. in high, it gets hot plenty fast, and I've had 2 occasions, where I cannot get it to start decreasing level, but when I put a little bit of pull pressure (towards the tail) on the ring while turning, it seemed to start working again. now this may have been because I had a momentary pause in the right location (aligned dots) but since it was getting hot, I wasn't paying attention to it. It does seem to be working fine now though.

I don't find the tail fins too sharp, but they are a stark contrast in feel to the rest of the torp.

the 10440 body seems to fit better with the o-ring. the 10250 body kept squishing it out if I went tight. by pulling the o-ring more towards the threads, I did get the short body to not squish it everytime, but it still occasionally did.

 

[jonwkng]

Nice pictures, mcbrat!

Now, Guy... I think the Torpedo would look great in copper, no?

 

[rebelbayou]

My Torpedo has never gotten hot like others on here, but after running a 10440 for a couple of days, I then went back to the 10250 tube and the battery rattled and was loose. It seems the 10440 must have pushed the driver up into the head just a hair. I tried the small magnet Guy enclosed in the package but it still wouldn't make contact so instead of trying to stretch or replace the tube spring, I just slipped a heavier duty spring over the top of the spring down in the tube and it works fine. I wonder if it would hurt anything if I just put a magnet on the - end of the 10250?

Rebel Bayou

p.s. The HF o-rings work fine on the Torpedo.

 

[Tixx]

Hi Guy,

I used the included batteries. Seemed to work fine for a day. So the one battery is dead and so is the light. A regular AAA does not work it now.

 

[Art]

Finally the X044 arrived in Portugal !

Havent had much time with it yet , tested first with a eneloop and worked fine. Then tested with the nuke and it did not go to the higher modes.
When I arrived at home tested it with a efest and it runs perfect. Havent figure out yet the UI... but when I get to high its amazing bright for its size.
I have a lot of flashlights , some moded ones and even a 900lumens pocket rocket and still this tiny thing amazed me!

Will leave more feedback as I use it , I did not need to use any spacer or do anything out of the ordinary to run it.

Guy : The card with your writing its the kind of detail I wasnt expecting and really made my day! It makes me feel like there is still amazing people around this world that make everything worthwhile!

 

[walterr839]

I've been using #39 for about two weeks now with mixed success. At first both alkaline and lion cells worked well with merely some inconsistencies with the UI. Then I noted the nukes would not hold level four for more than a split second. Thought it was a discharged cell---charged it up with no improvement then it got hot and the cell got stuck in the tube.

next the lion 10440 trustfire protected cells stopped working consistently and I gave up using them.

Now the only light/cell combination that I have any faith in is an alkaline AAA

I've been reading about others changing the spring for a stiffer one --- perhaps if I can did one up i'll give it a try

I'm open to suggestions

im not complaining just trying to give you some feedback on the X version

 

[Cataract]

Just a quick idea for interface improvement:

- I did like the idea to turn the ring left 2 full turns to lock out, then 2 full turns right to unlock and that modes would only go up turning right
- The propeller could serve as a switch for the lockout, eliminating standby drain and giving the propeller more function (I like the way it tail stands and I don't really find them all that sharp, but a little roundness on the outside corners couldn't hurt)

 

[Doug]

Just noticed this thread..... Are they still for sale?

 

[Bimmerboy]

I did like the idea to turn the ring left 2 full turns to lock out, then 2 full turns right to unlock and that modes would only go up turning right

Agreed... that'd be some nice stuff right there.

The propeller could serve as a switch for the lockout, eliminating standby drain and giving the propeller more function

Excellent idea! Now THAT's a delay I'd be happy to wait (and pay) for! :twothumbs

I just lurrrrves me some mechanical lockout, and this would be super "trick". Talk about setting a light apart from the rest... torpedo fin lockout?!

 

[th8tredude]

Probably not any X-run left for sale, but hopefully it won't be too long until they go in to production.

 

[Got Lumens?]

X099 reporting in.
Just got mine today.
As others have said much to like with design, weight and packaging.

No Pics yet.

In response to the O-Ring dilemma, I have foud that a little oil/grease does help, but a ratcheting motion works best as to not pinch the O-Rings while tightening the body. Two steps forward and one back

Now the X news . . .
Tried AAA works pretty good once getting used to it's nature of level changing.
Tried a 10250 Nuke. After about 5 minutes of playing with levels 1, 2, & 3, with a few short 3-5 sec bursts on high, the light got warm and I turned it off. After that no more Li-Lion's will work. Functions fine with 1.2 - 1.5V cells . Being this is a beta version, the important thing to remember is that my X's failure info will make the final release the best it can be.

Take Care
GL

PS I am still without my primary computer and may not be able to respond to all posts

 

[cnlson]

Nukes arrived today

time for updated pix
roughly 10' to the wall

Left Torpedo Right ITP A3 EOS upgrade
both low

Medium Low Torpedo Low EOS

Medium Low Torpedo Medium EOS

Medium High Torpedo High EOS

High Torpedo High EOS

+10 more feet away
EOS High

Torpedo high

Defender 650LM 3 D cell

Wow that is BRIGHT.

I've also gotten to the point where I can turn the light on and get it to do what I want without even looking at it. when on high turn the other way 1/2 turn or so then go back to the direction you were turning to turn it up and it will turn down.

originally when I got the nukes I could not make it light at all. but it wasn't getting warm nor were the nukes losing a charge when connected to the head and the AAA kept working. I finally took the nuke out and extended the small tube and attempted to use the AAA, it didn't work at first, took the tube all the way apart and it appears the remains of the O-ring had insulated the two halves somehow. once i put it back together the aaa worked in the tube extended and once i turned it all the way back in the nuke worked as well. it is amazingly bright.

I am amazed at all that works with this light. Bravo Guy!

 

[cnlson]

X099 reporting in.
Just got mine today.
As others have said much to like with design, weight and packaging.

No Pics yet.

In response to the O-Ring dilemma, I have foud that a little oil/grease does help, but a ratcheting motion works best as to not pinch the O-Rings while tightening the body. Two steps forward and one back

Now the X news . . .
Tried AAA works pretty good once getting used to it's nature of level changing.
Tried a 10250 Nuke. After about 5 minutes of playing with levels 1, 2, & 3, with a few short 3-5 sec bursts on high, the light got warm and I turned it off. After that no more Li-Lion's will work. Functions fine with 1.2 - 1.5V cells . Being this is a beta version, the important thing to remember is that my X's failure info will make the final release the best it can be.

Take Care
GL

PS I am still without my primary computer and may not be able to respond to all posts

might want to try as i did taking the tube completely apart. maybe yours is suffering the same connection issue mine was. extend the tube and try a aaa in it if it works try a nuke again.

 

[Got Lumens?]

might want to try as i did taking the tube completely apart. maybe yours is suffering the same connection issue mine was. extend the tube and try a aaa in it if it works try a nuke again.

Cnlson,
Thanks for your reply.
The X 10250 expandable tube/spring works just fine with a 10250 Nuke using a HF, UTT, and HF-R head. I did as you and others and disassembled the expandable tube and tweaked the battery spring. Results works fine with a 1.5V cell but does not with a 3.7V 10250 Nuke/ 10440 cell.

I initially had a bit a manufacuring burrs or debris that would not allow the head to fully seat on the 10250 tube, which went away quickly. I also tried the AAA tube with a 10440 with the same results.

Take Care
GL

Update ! :
While composing this post the X head using the AAA tube loaded with a primary lithium 1.5V cell was in standby/off mode, the body became very warm after a few minutes. The lights driver is now doing what happened with a 3.7V cell.

GL

 

[flashflood]

@tgwnn: Guy, the replacement Cottonpickers charger arrived yesterday and seems to work flawlessly. Thanks!

Also, much thanks for throwing in two of the new MBI 10250 nukes! That was a wonderful and generous surprise.

You are building up the most intensely loyal customer base imaginable. I mean, wow.

A couple of updates on the Torpedo itself:

(1) I have figured out a reasonably reliable way to work the UI. Hopefully this will work for others as well. When going up in modes, pause just a moment after each mode change. Then resume turning in the same direction to go up another level. To go back down, first turn 180 degrees the opposite direction (which will not induce a mode change, but apparently tells the Torpedo circuit "we're going down now"), then turn in the original direction, again pausing briefly between mode changes. After off is achieved, continue turning until the white dots are lined up, so that it stays off. It's a little finicky, but with practice, quite workable.

(2) I forgot to mention how gorgeous the Torpedo is. That's what I meant when I said this has the potential to be an iconic flashlight. Aesthetically, there's almost no room for improvement. I love it! The only thing I'd suggest, if it's possible, is to make the red anodizing more of a pure red. It's currently just slightly on the fuchsia side. It may be that the underlying metal is naturally bluish, so that a slightly more orange-red ano is required to achieve a pure red appearance. I don't know though -- not my area of expertise.

(3) I have had no trouble with overheating. I've been using MBI 10250 nukes exclusively.

(4) Now that I have the interface down, and I'm reasonably confident it won't pocket-activate or overheat, I've started to EDC the little guy on my keychain. I love how small and light it is!

(5) That said, one practical issue I've observed is that even after just two days of all-day pocket carry, the keyring is starting to rub off the anodizing on the sharp corners of the fins. If the fins were even just slightly rounded, the anodizing would presumably fare better.

Thanks again, Guy. -- flashflood

 

[kaichu dento]

Nice pictures, mcbrat!

Now, Guy... I think the Torpedo would look great in copper, no?

How about some Matchbox Industries lights leading the way with some CuTi lights? Would it be better to go CuTi30 with more copper for better cooling/appearance, or CuTi50 where they're both 50/50 copper and titanium?

 

[the_guy_with_no_name]

I get busy for 2 days and wow, a landslide of posts to catch up on!
Thank you all:bow:

Here goes.... a few at a time

Just to let everyone know, It's my problem (I have a paranoia concerning safety). Guy is stepping up to the plate and taking it on the chin as if it was his problem, Thank-U Guy.

Hi Husker,

Thanks very much for the post

Whilst it would seem like I'm serving up flashlights, in truth my aim is to deliver exceptional satisfaction.
To that end, I consider your issue and in fact all issues posted/mailed to be opportunities to further refine my product and ensure the passion I send out in big white envelopes is always as equally satisfying to those who receive one, as it continues to be for me to prepare and send one out.

I'm more than ok with learning under the careful (and caring) eye of everybody here and perhaps slowly but most definitely surely you'll all eventually know that I enjoy the making together and sharing with you all the most, and the economics, is just a side effect that needs to be taken care of so that I can share things with more than one or two people (else I'd be homeless).

So rather than on the chin, I tend to embrace every chance I see, sucking it up like a hungry sponge, all with the aim of reaching better and better, delivering more and more pleasurable fantasies.

Every now and again, I'll mess up or miss something (not by intent of course) mostly due to lack of experience (or lack of sleep) in which case I do aim to go out of my way to make up for it as best I can.

Update:
I replaced the stock spring in the 10250 body with a more robust spring I had on hand. The X now accepts 10250 cells and performs as well as it does with 10440's or AAA 1.5V batteries.

Hi maskman,

Thanks very much for sharing that and reaffirming th8tredude's earlier findings that replacing the spring might be a 50/50 chance of being a kind of magic fix in some of the more temperamental Torpedo Xs out there.

My Torpedo is the X078 with the 4000K emitter. I have now been able to test it for about two weeks.

What I really like about the Torpedo:
- The size is handy (for edc)
- The easy one handed operation (About the UI: It seems intuitive to stop moving the control ring when the light mode changes. On my unit it seems to help to turn the ring just a little past that point before turning the other way. Doing this I have experienced a quite consistent UI. (If that made sense.))
- The very nice tint (and the red light effect you see around the bezel if you tilt the light when on)
- The floody beam is very useful
- The high quality fit and finish
- The ability to safely use several kinds of batteries.

I have tested it with the nukes and with aaa eneloops. (By the way, I also like the minimalistic cottonpicker charger very much!)

Even with its beta-version funkiness I feel that the Torpedo is good value for money. It is hands down my best EDC light.

What I, if possible, would like to see in the production version:
- a really low low mode (to use for checking on the children at night).
- an option to have installed trits in the tail.

Guy: Thank you very much for your efforts and for the pleasure of following the whole process from the beginning!

Hi gerok,

Thanks very much for the feedback and the encouragement :thumbsup:
Always happy to hear you are happy even at this early stage and my pleasure of course.
I hope I might be able to offer a lower low in production or perhaps have it lower with non li-ions.
Trits, that would be a plus of course.
I have some ideas.....that might just end up in the production version.

This also makes me wonder if the spring is limiting amperage!
Did you notice it being brighter with the stronger spring?

Also wonder if spring is related to some overheating

Hi windy
I think it definitely is and thanks to a lot of good feedback, a spring swap seems to have improved more than a few Xs.
I'm tracking down some new springs at the moment.

I just received my Torpedo (X064) and my thoughts pretty much are the same as everyone else. Amazing job. You've packed a lot of design elements into such a small package.

I think your list above is a pretty good one. A few points that I think are important:

- I would love to see the UI have a fixed off. No more free rotation 360+ degrees. I know that may be unpopular with some in the group but that would be my preference. It seems that fixed rotation points would be easier to implement than the current UI. It would be nice if there were marks with detents for each level. That would make getting to a desired level easier.

- I will probably be grinding the tail fins and lanyard plinth off of mine. I use a clip and have no need for key chain ability. A version without those would be great.

- Does the light have thermal protection? If it does then why the time limit on high? Shouldn't it be based on temp?

A few of observations on mine:

- It seems like I got a 4000K, the color is very warm.
- The o-ring in the extendable tail cap was destroyed when I unscrewed it. It looks like it got caught up in the treads and torn to shreds. I'm not concerned, just a data point.

Great work. Can't wait to see what comes next.

Hi bfly,

Thanks very much for the feedback :thumbsup:
A fixed OFF looks like a popular request.
I'm currently working on the details for the W5 PCB and hope to know by tomorrow if it can be done on a hard PCB or not (its possible but I don't want to delay it too much). I am very curious to use a hard PCB though to ascertain whether it does in fact solve many of the inconsistency issues so far.
After that, I'll begin work on the production candidate with the goal of implementing many of the points shared here

The circuit has thermal protection but during an earlier proto, it was hard to know whether the light was shifting modes because of heat/voltage/or other reason and it causes a lot of inconsistency so I decided to limit the high in the X and plan to reimplement the thermal detection for production.

Looks like the 5000K batch are possibly slightly warmer than that as the 4000K have a very distinct emitter color, even warmer still.

The extendable body, some great feedback already on that and it was always still "unfinished" in my mind design wise but did want to see what you all thought of the concept so there is room for revision and improvement there too.
Thanks very much for your support.

Tgwnn

 

[the_guy_with_no_name]

There was an all around improvement with the stronger spring. The light does indeed appear brighter, but the stronger spring eliminated the heavy flickering I was experiencing and so far it has eliminated the heat issue. The latter two being the largest improvements.

Thanks maskman,
sounds like a huge plus!
Thanks for sharing :thumbsup:

In addition to the following, I have a couple other thoughts for when I have some energy left over from NOT having to shovel snow, and dig out plowed-in cars (just got mine out today after almost two weeks. Been using Dad's car... haha). But, for now...

I'm not seeing the advantage to having detents in the rotation. Seems like extra cost, and ultimately, production delay for something one could easily just use their eyes for. For example, programming, and using the fairly complicated LF2X is not a problem with no detents.

There's an emotional side to it for me as well. The freely rotating ring sets the Torpedo apart from almost all other lights that give a tactile feel in one way or another. I'd like something different.

Hi Bimmerboy,
Thanks for the feedback.
Looks like we might be in for more snow here tonight!

I'm thinking as a minimum a static stop point would be beneficial, as that could help reduce standby current to zero and then depends on the UI being flawless and consistent which would make all the difference.

The two original design goals for the control ring were
1) eliminate lost tails/heads that are common with standard twisties
2) eliminate the back n forth twisting required to change modes (also common with multi-mode twisties)

Husker, if you're seriously not going to keep it please send me a PM and we can make this little problem go away, or at least to Texas.

Hi Dale,
I think its now on its way to Florida or Cape Canaveral (or wherever my US fwding address is) but I may be able to get mission control to reposition it for you.

You can borrow Uni as much as you like, he needs a good workout

Thanks Cataract,
Sent him home just in time to join your unpacking party

My Torpedo X arrived a few days ago but I have been working too many hours and didn't get a chance to post until now.

I wanted to write something intelligent, and take some nice pics.

Neither of those things has happened but I need to at least say something!

First, thank you Guy for returning the loaners I sent you (hope you had fun ) and a huge thank you for the gifts you sent us, a great surprise and the HF-R instantly replaced the Fenix she had on her keyring, uses it daily and really loves it

Secondly, knowing you I did have high expectations for the packaging of the Torpedo X and I was still pleasantly surprised. That metal torpedo tube/case is amazing, it's a quality piece of work and packaging genius.

The light itself I love too but did have some early issues with certain batteries not working etc, but all sorted now.

I've been carrying it all day and night and playing with it a lot.

I'll post my thoughts as bullet points.

- I had 1 instance of the body heating as soon as a 10440 was installed, with the light off. I removed it right away and haven't had a repeat performance since.

- I did replace the tail springs in both bodies with thicker stronger ones from old broken AAA lights,

- Not sure if the new spring fixed whatever the issue was but the light now works with all batteries.

- UI has been stable and semi- predicable with all batteries. I think the light is working to spec but a tiny difference in how far you turn the ring affects what result you get. If the light is on level 2 or 3 I can't always be sure that I can get it to turn off without going up into level 4 by mistake. You know what you're doing though and I'm confident the final version will be reliable and intuitive

- I'm not fussy about the interface, detents etc, I'll get used to it and learn to love it, as long as it's consistent.

- I do need to use the little battery with 10250 nukes.

- The quality of manufacturing is brilliant, very high quality. I don't find the tail fins too sharp, though I thought I would at first touch. I planned to grind them down if they bothered me but now I like them

- The extendable body is very cool. It takes me less than 10 seconds to extend or retract it. The oring was chewed up when I extended it for the 1st time though. Won't be getting it wet so don't care.

- I actually like the clip a lot. great for pocket use, or to clip on the brim of a hat if you wanted to. It may have scratched the anodize a bit on installation but it didn't feel like it and I won't be taking it off so don't care. Used lights get scratched anyway, I'm not precious with my lights. The attachment to the light is my main criticism of the clip, it could be stronger to deal with accidentally snagging the light when getting in or out of the car. Hasn't happened to me but feels like the clip might bend or come off.

- I agree with someone elses comment that the lanyard hole is too close to the edge. My heavily keyring-carried HF-R lanyard hole is starting to open out too, it might break through after a year or 2. Ideally the attachment would be very strong. Maybe a pressed in SS insert or something. I don't know.

- Beam and tint are perfect for my use.

- Output levels don't suit me 100% though. Mainly I would like a much lower low, 0.1 lumen or so would be great. Then 20 lumens, 100 and 500 (on li-on)

- Massive value for money. Even ignoring all the huge R&D costs and just considering unit cost, I feel that what I paid was a fantastic value for what I got. When you include all the money and time you have put in to this effort, the value equation goes beyond any other purchase I can recall making.

- Apart from the teething issues, reliabilty, consistency etc, this unit feels like a Torch From The Future

Gotta run now, sorry for the messy notes and for any spelling mistakes.

Thanks again Guy!

Hi stevenkelby,

Thanks very much for the feedback :thumbsup:
and enjoyed the funny intro too

You are welcome on all counts of course. Couldn't send back all those lights without something in return
Thanks a lot for the clip feedback.
Like me, I think most people have been hesitant to use it, not wanting to scratch up their new Torp which I can understand.
I made quiet a few versions before the current one and still feel like its not yet perfect.

Mostly wondering if anybody would actually attach it to the head if you were to use it or only to the tail?

Lanyard hole, got it, thanks. Its on my list.

10 Seconds to extend the body, wow you have fast fingers
We'll have to have races with a prize for the fastest extender

Another spring fixer... glad to hear that its improved.

Definitely need more space between level 1 & 2 and will revise the levels for production.

>>When you include all the money and time you have put in to this effort, the value equation goes beyond any other purchase I can recall making
Very kind of you to say so, thank you :bow:

Tgwnn

p.s. still more posts to follow....