Any ideas about the Muyshondt Beagle?

[djans1397]

I'm not a Nichia guy and prefer the XPL actually. I'd actually want an aluminum one for the wt savings and price point. True u can use both the 35 and 70 body, but I'd only prob ever run the 35 for size factor. So does the set up on the 35 throw AS FAR as the Beagle? I do like a combo of both if possible And figured with the high output on the Boss it would make up for any lack of reflector that the beagle has in terms of throw

Any input?

thanks SOOOO MUCH all for the help!

 

[archimedes]

You might be surprised between the 35 and 70 .... Of the two, I actually find the 70 preferable for EDC.

 

[Thetasigma]

An update for me, I no longer own a Boss or Beagle but having owned both I'll throw two cents in.

The Beagle is throwier than the BOSS, where the BOSS sort of makes of for that, is in much higher drive current which allows it to brute force for a short range, but at the expense of very short battery life and high heat.

Ergonomics, the BOSS feels better in hand, particularly with the 70 body which is actually pretty damn compact for a rear switched 18650 setup, the problem here being that the Beagle is essentially a straight tube, there isn't much aside from the clip for retention in the hand, and while the knurling is nice, it doesn't help as much in grip as I would have liked.

Clip, the BOSS uses OR's SS clip which I absolutely love, and will say it is the single best clip available today, great tension, smooth, slick look on most anything, and cheaper than most any of the other standard offerings. The Beagle clip is well...atrocious at best IMO, stock they are too weak for such a chunky light, sharp-*** edges, and poorly finished, especially the optional Timascus offering that were just roughly milled, bead blasted, and heated for a finish and color selection that looks more like mud than usually colorful Timascus. With an appropriately sized bushing, you can use an OR universal clip for much better retention, but doing anything to your Muyshondt light besides changing the battery, voids the warranty...

Battery selection, they can both strictly speaking handle 18350s, 16340s, and CR123s, though the BOSS requires some programming to achieve that.

UI, BOSS is programmable but is essentially up to 4 modes with an auxiliary color LED option, the Beagle is not programmable but is KISS with a simple 5 mode selection from low to high with the first couple modes being strictly the flood ring.

Warranty, hands down the BOSS is the better light to own in this respect.

Now, don't get me wrong, I love the concept of the Beagle, I just think as it is implemented it is mediocre. A proper dual beam light in the custom area is something that just doesn't exist aside from the long discontinued Lunasol, the problems with the Beagle IMO, are bland/slick host design, poor clip, too small of a center reflector, use of an XP-L2 in the center instead of something throwier and/or with better tint, and a loosely fitted engine, the pill is fitted loosely into the head with some thermal paste, no threading on the production lights. I hope to see a better revision or version of the Beagle concept as it has promise.

 

[djans1397]

Thanks thetasigma, Arch and all! Glad u mentioned the Timascus clip as the one I'm looking at has that. I'm not one for sharp edges on my clips. As much as I'd like to try the Beagle, I think I'm going to wait on that perfect used aluminum BOSS model after reading through this thread and everyone's input.

Thanks again all for the input! That's why I love this place, great help all around!

 

[gunga]

I was curious about the beagle too. Thanks for the great info guys. I'll pass on this one.

 

[thenikjones]

I'm not a Nichia guy and prefer the XPL actually. I'd actually want an aluminum one for the wt savings and price point. True u can use both the 35 and 70 body, but I'd only prob ever run the 35 for size factor. So does the set up on the 35 throw AS FAR as the Beagle? I do like a combo of both if possible And figured with the high output on the Boss it would make up for any lack of reflector that the beagle has in terms of throw

Any input?

thanks SOOOO MUCH all for the help!

My BOSS is XPl HI and pretty warm, prefer it to my XML2 SPY007 tint

I was on a sea wall at 10:30pm last week doing my annual torch test. I had the following

1. SPY 007
2. 219 e-series version of the BOSS head
3. Beagle
- did not have my actual BOSS with me.

The SPY showed the furthest rocks, followed by the e-BOSS on 2 cells. The e-BOSS on 1 cell and Beagle had similar throw - there were rocks the Beagle just did not reach out to. The Beagle is a single cell, to be fair, but it is bulky.

The Beagle is a great torch for working around the house but doesn't last me an hour on throw settings which the SPY has. I tried it on night runs multiple times and the BOSS 70 lasted longer.

Just my experiences, YMMV etc etc

 

[LogicalBeard]

I have never owned a BOSS but three things you said would make me recommend a BOSS to you:

1.) The weight and form factor. I'm assuming this is going to be your EDC and the lighter weight would probably make a noticeable difference. I think an aluminum BOSS is half the weight of a Beagle.

2.) The Beagle is a reverse clicky and you don't like those.

3.) You don't like Nichia's.


Reasons I like the Beagle better: Theoretically, since I have never gotten to try out a BOSS.

1.) 5 modes vs 3 modes with a secondary mode. I'm not big on a low red/amber mode so it would make the BOSS a 3 mode light for me. I know some people prefer less modes but I have no problem getting to my preferred mode for the task at hand in under a second. I actually prefer the 7 mode setup on my Manker E14.

2.) I prefer Nichia emitters. The Beagle's flood mode is amazing. I click the button and this wash of warm high CRI magic envelops my surroundings. The beam pattern has more flood than a traditional mule and I can still use mode 4 and 5 when I need to see farther. This accomplishes 99% of my tasks.

Side notes:

Testing runtime on mode 4 got me into 2 hours before it fell out of regulation with a 700 mAh battery. I now use protected Keeppower 1200 mAh batteries for even longer runtimes.

I have zero problem with the ergonomics.

My only issue with the clip is that it is rough on my pants. Mine doesn't poke me or cause me any other problems.

If you haven't already, you should join the "Control the Dark" Facebook group.

 

[archimedes]

Just a couple additional comments regarding the BOSS ....

Modes are fully programmable, up to 4 modes total, in each of two banks (4 + 4) , as well as an optional "bounce" mode. If you want less than 4, or none of them to include red / amber (except for bounce) , that is easy to set up.

Emitter options have varied among the "waves" of light engines, but have usually included both Cree and Nichia as choices.

 

[LogicalBeard]

"If you want less than 4, or none of them to include red / amber (except for bounce) , that is easy to set up."

Nice to know. I thought you had to use the secondary as one of the levels. Has it always been like that?

How do you switch between the "banks"?

 

[archimedes]

.... Nice to know. I thought you had to use the secondary as one of the levels. Has it always been like that?

No, all levels are fully selectable. Yes, I believe that has been the case, at least since the start of the web/optical programming system was first available.

How do you switch between the "banks"?

Each bank is selected automatically, based on voltage detected (one cell vs two cells)

 

[scout24]

It's amazingly versatile. Want red, and three other sub- 25lm modes on a single RCR cell? With one and only flamethrower mode on two RCR's? DONE!

 

[djans1397]

Awesome info guys! So appreciated. I'd love to get them both, but have decided to wait on the next drop and get an aluminum combo in XPL, if itsoffered. Now to decide on amber vs red secondary.

 

[scout24]

I'm deleting your post as heresay and a violation of Rule 4. And stirring up controversy just for the heck of it. Enough, please.

 

[fyrstormer]

Ugh. I wish I'd read this thread before buying my Beagle. Such a great concept, ruined by having no mode-memory and having a reverse-clicky switch. The clip doesn't bother me, I could round-off the edges myself using a whetstone and a sanding sponge, but there's nothing I can do about the deficiencies in the driver.

Sure, the original Aeon and Nautilus didn't have mode-memory, but they also didn't require repetitive motion to select the desired brightness setting -- just tighten the head and stop when you reach the brightness you want. There is no clicky-switch equivalent for the progressive-twist UI, and Muyshondt should've known that. At the very least, for $600 I would expect UI settings to be somewhat customizable. Even McGizmo, king of the "simple and durable" titanium flashlight, offers user-programmable drivers nowadays.

Also, it surprises me how difficult it is to go back to a reverse-clicky switch after spending several years using forward-clicky switches exclusively. I keep unlatching the switch when attempting to change modes, and relatching the switch requires releasing it completely and turning off the light. If I accidentally unlatch a forward-clicky, I can just relatch it without having to turn off the light.

I'll have to return it. $600 is too much money to spend on something that doesn't work exactly the way I expect.

 

[LogicalBeard]

While I prefer the no mode memory and the reverse clicky, I'm with you on the programing.

If I understand his position correctly, he thinks a user shouldn't have to worry about programing the levels. But this doesn't make sense to me because if they don't want to mess with them, they would't have to; just like on a BOSS. But maybe I am missing something. :shrug:

 

[fyrstormer]

I wasn't even thinking about programming the brightness of each level. Given the complexity of having multiple emitters running at multiple brightnesses simultaneously, I wouldn't even want to try programming the brightness settings anyway -- at least not using blinky-codes. A bluetooth wireless interface would be an effective, though unforgivably geeky, way of allowing advanced configuration without needing a USB port built into the driver, but again, I wasn't thinking of anything that complex. I was only thinking of basic user preferences, like enabling or disabling mode-memory. It might also be nice to include a forward-clicky switch in the box, or offer it as an optional accessory. After all, switch type and mode-memory are both hotly-contested design choices among flashaholics.

And let's be honest here, the market for the Beagle is flashaholics. It doesn't matter if Muyshondt is trying to design fancy flashlights for the average person, because the average person is not going to spend $600 on a damn flashlight when they could buy a really good smartphone with a flashlight app for the same amount of money. (or, you know, pay their rent for the month.) The market Muyshondt is targeting doesn't exist, but the flashaholic market does exist, and his design choices should reflect that. He can't be the Apple of flashlights, because Apple has already claimed the $600-easy-to-use-premium-flashlight market niche -- it's called the iPhone.

(this post was not sponsored or endorsed by Apple, Inc., and the poster received no compensation for it.)

 

[LogicalBeard]

I suppose at the end of day, he doesn't feel like there is a sufficient need to justify the hassle of adding in the option to program mode memory, turbo mode, or providing a forward clicky to switch out the tail cap like one of my foursevens lights did. Maybe he thinks just giving people the option to change these things confuses people and takes away the elegance of the product. But I like options and there is always something I could tweak to make it perfect for me; I'm sure you are the same way.

 

[fyrstormer]

I used to be less persnickety about my tools than I am now. The more I use them, the more I understand what makes them work really well for me. Anyone who's reached the level of proficiency at operating a flashlight that they can justify spending $600 on one is probably going to have a pretty good idea of how it should be set-up to work just-right for them. It's the same reason all the various "easy to use" versions of Linux keep dying off -- anyone who's proficient enough at operating a computer that they would actually consider running Linux on a daily basis is not going to need, or want, a simplified version of Linux. It's a corollary to the Dunning-Kruger Effect (i.e. people lacking competence are also incapable of judging other people's competence): People who don't know what they want also don't know what they could have, while people who do know what they want also know what they could have and they want it.

 

[GoVegan]

I find it very surprising how anyone could order a 600 dollar flashlight without first confirming if the UI is what they want.

FWIW I hate memory modes, as I'd never remember what mode I last used, or It would be the wrong mode next time I went to use the light.

BTW re Linux, Debian user here.

 

[fyrstormer]

It is surprising, isn't it? Silly me, I made the mistake of trusting my satisfaction with the Muyshondt lights I've bought in the past, and I didn't notice what the product page neglected to mention. It never occurred to me to ask, because I can't think of another high-end boutique flashlight I've bought that didn't have mode-memory. (well...I guess there was a LuxRC Triple drop-in that I used to have, but I sold it years ago when the newer version with mode-memory was released.)

Having the wrong setting saved in my light generally doesn't bother me. I usually EDC a light with a rotary dial, so I can see (or feel) what position it's in before I turn it on. For multi-click lights like the Beagle, if I'm somewhere dark and I need to protect my vision, I always turn-on the light against my hand first. That isn't an inconvenience, because I used to do the same thing with lights that didn't have mode-memory. Sometimes it's so dark that even the dimmest setting on a cheap light will be too bright, and I'll need to dim it down by shrouding the beam with my hand. So I already have the habit in-place to avoid blinding myself if my light turns-on too bright. When blinding myself isn't an issue, I want the light to turn-on at the same setting I was using a few seconds before. When I look away from whatever I'm illuminating, even if only for a couple seconds, I shut the light off by habit, because letting any power tool continue to run when you're not looking at where it's aimed is a Very Bad Idea. Having to re-cycle through the modes to get back to the one I was using before is irritating as hell.