365nm 18650 Checklist. Need help.

ICSK

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Hello all, I've never modified a flashlight before so I was hoping that the knowledgeable people of CPF could help me.

The goal was to make an 18650 powered 365nm LED flashlight for my fluorescent minerals. As such I need more flood than throw.

LED:
  • Likely going to be LED ENGIN's LZ1 (though I don't know which one of these will be a snug fit in the Ultrafire body this or this)
Base: Ultrafire Wf-502B (I'll just swap out the board)
Driver: ?

A couple questions I had:
  • Any other LED manufacturers I should consider? I'd say $50 is the limit for the LED. I know Nichia makes some but they're out of my price range. They have slightly more efficient LEDs but the only places that I can seem to find them are $100+
  • Is an upgraded driver even needed? I don't know how well the Ultrafire ones regulate and this light will only be 1 mode.
  • How's the heatsinking on those Ultrafires? I noticed that the body is very minimalistic. The thing that attracted me was the price point of the light so I'm welcome to alternatives.

Thanks for your help! If I missed something please feel free to address your comments/concerns.
 

datiLED

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The LED ENGIN UV LED is a good LED. I have used both the Nichia NCSU033B and the LZ1 (on the 11mm board), and the LZ1 is top quality. You will need to replace the driverif the stock converter outputs more than 1A. That is the absolute maximum for the LZ1, though it would be better to stick to 700mA. (A UV LED generates a fair amount of heat.) The GD converter boards are good for this task, especially since you can handle a single level converter.

I can't speak for the heatsinking on the Ultrafire, but you can never have too much heatsinking. If there is not good contact with the head or body, you will need to fabricate an additional heatsink to improve the thermal transfer.
 

ICSK

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The LED ENGIN UV LED is a good....transfer.

Thanks for the response. Would a single 18650 work though? The typical forward voltage is 4.1 according to LED ENGIN's spec sheet. Would it dim considerably after a few seconds since a fully charged lipo only has 4.2V?

As for the driver it looks like all the UV models Ultrafire makes is driven at 1A so I'm fine in that respect. I just need to see what the heatsinking is like when I get it.
 

ICSK

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Just for future reference to anyone looking to build a longwave UV light like I did. The LED ENGIN LZ1 is garbage. Far too much visible light. I actually got a green hotspot! That's way above their 365nm range! I had more luck using a 3W 365nm Ultrafire drop-in. Cheaper and put out less than a lumen of visible light.

Edit: forgot to mention that I had a sample of two. I sent the original back and the replacement had the same amount of green in the beam.
 
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Just for future reference to anyone looking to build a longwave UV light like I did. The LED ENGIN LZ1 is garbage. Far too much visible light. I actually got a green hotspot! That's way above their 365nm range! I had more luck using a 3W 365nm Ultrafire drop-in. Cheaper and put out less than a lumen of visible light.

Edit: forgot to mention that I had a sample of two. I sent the original back and the replacement had the same amount of green in the beam.

Wow. How far off was their reference spectra from what you measured?
 

RI Chevy

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Other members here have had great luck with the LED ENGIN LZ1. Maybe you did something wrong with your build?
 

ICSK

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Apologies for the lack of response. No one was able to help me so I had long discarded this as a resource for information. However, CPF has helped me in the past so I feel obligated to help the next people in line. I hope this response will be a catch-all to those wanting to make a 365nm flashlight.

Wow. How far off was their reference spectra from what you measured?
Unfortunately I do not have a spectrometer to test these things out with. My Samsung phone has a debug mode that gave me readings from the light sensor though. This is the best information I could get:

LED ENGIN LZ1
  • 7000K ~6000 lux held right against sensor driven at 1A (the max according to LED Engin's spec sheet. I noticed the same green tint at 500ma but did not do any testing at that range.)
Chinese no-name 365nm LED. Here's a picture of a 3x LED version. I've seen them in 1x 3W,2x 5W, or 3x 7W offerings: http://imgur.com/7zcLbZo . They have a max of 1.2A per LED according to the eBay seller I contacted. Take that with a grain of salt. I tested at 1A safely though.

  • 7000K ~400 lux held right against sensor driven at 500ma

Not quite apples and oranges with the different draws but hopefully that illustrates just how much visible light is coming out of the LED Engin LZ1

Other members here have had great luck with the LED ENGIN LZ1. Maybe you did something wrong with your build?
Perhaps. It was only a sample size of 2. I don't discount the possibility that this particular batch was bad or my 2 samples were not representative. I can only speak from my experience. I'm not sure where one could go wrong though. It's literally an LED and driver soldered together for P60 dropins. Sure color temperatures and outputs can change with temperature increases but the problems consistently happened whether it was a cold start or after 5 minutes of operation.


Conclusion. What I did in the end:
Even though I berated the LZ1 I stuck with it. Why? Because it was the most efficient at 1A. To compensate for the visible light I used a cutoff filter. They can go under different names:

If you just want a solution you can use out of the box the no name 365nm LEDs that Tank, Ultrafire, etc. use. They're all the same LED I bet. If you are willing to cut glass or use adhesive to stick the filter onto the end of your flashlight go with the LED Engin.


Examples:
Here are some photos to help illustrate my point. Focus on the materials fluorescing as opposed to the visible light. That's the point of a UV light after all. I tried to make the brightnesses equal at the same EV so I don't see the need to emphasize the settings I used. Also keep in mind the no name Chinese is running at 500ma.

In this first set of imagesimages we can see that all of them will do fine for discovering stains. I'm not sure what these stains are from exactly as they were left by the previous owner but I'd bet on chemical. I'm told that urine stains are more subtle so maybe that's what the blue is?

http://imgur.com/a/xXYja

The first image is the no name Chinese 365nm LED. You can easily see the yellow staining and the blue stain pops out. Much better with the visible eye. Remember 500ma vs 1A! In the second the same is true for the LED Engin LZ1. It might be a bit harder to see due to less contrast with the visible light but it's evident if you look hard enough. The third image definitely won't make sense unless you've used a proper UV light. It's the filtered 365nm. What's going on here is that the bleach that the carpet makers used is weakly fluorescing but doing so nonetheless. The fact that this can pick up on that makes this a top class 365nm light in my book. Also notice how much more blue staining you can see.


http://imgur.com/a/bV7XA
I didn't feel that that illustrated my point well enough though so I took another set. It hopefully illustrates the detriments visible light does to subtle fluorescence The subject is a mangano calcite from Peru. The first photo is a natural light image. The second is the filtered 365nm. This is what our LEDs should strive for ignoring the blue lint. The third is the no name 365nm LED. It clearly shows fluorescence but the color seems slightly altered. Likely due to the slight bit of purple light coming out. The last one is the LED Engin LZ1. This one shows why you want little visible light out of your UV lights. You can barely see the fluorescence at all if you compare it to the visible light shot.
 
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