Batteries for flashlights ?

[SnowJim]

Hi,

In Sweden AA and AAA is without a doubt the most comon battery. Many of the flashlights are however using a battery called CR123A and this delivers much more power. The problem is that even if you find a store in Sweden that have them, thay will go for about 5,27 EUR / each (rechargeable(500mha for about 9,48 EUR)) compare to AA for 0,32 EUR / each. If I buy them over internet I can get 2 Eunicell CR123A, 3.0V, 1300mAh for 6,21 EUR. It will however still be hard to get got pris on batteries on the fly(in local stores).

So the question is if its really worth it?

If I would buy CR123A rechargeble, would this recharger handle them : http://www.tecxus.com/chargers/multi-purpose-charger.html

 

[välineurheilija]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

That charger seems to be only for nimh and nicd so no it will not handle rcr123 or any other lion battery for that matter.
I would go for whatever lion battery that fits the light because then you get the power and you will save the cost off primary cells quite fast.

 

[mcnair55]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

Similar case in the UK, although I have C123 lights in the collection I feel better off with AA or AAA fueled lights.

 

[kj2]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

CR123a-batteries are pricey. Therefore most of my light accept 18650 or they're AA lights. RCR123 is a nice solution, and I can buy those fairly cheap here.
Depending on what you need the light for, you'll have to choose if it's worth it. Most task I do, can be done with AA-lights.

 

[RetroTechie]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

CR123A primaries are worth it if their higher energy contents (vs. RCR123) matters more than cost. I can imagine that for example law enforcement users with a 2xCR123 light wouldn't even consider rechargeables but just keep a stack of spare CR123A's at hand. The same goes for lights that are used so rarely that a CR123A lasts for years.

If cost matters and you're burning through a couple CR123A's a week, then getting a charger + some RCR123's is a no-brainer. And will start saving you money quickly. I've got several RCR123's which cost me between 4 and 9 Euro / piece (depending on make / supplier).

Note that if you get a charger that can handle different size Li-ions, cost of that charger can be spread over many cells & their uses. Both charger and (rechargeable) Li-ions are basically one-time costs. Get a new light, get some Li-ions to use in that light, done.

 

[reppans]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

Vote with your dollars - buy wide voltage (0.9-4.2v) AA lights and run 14500 Li-ions in them if you want the output. The 14500 has ~20% more capacity than the 16340 and you can ways run common ~1.5v Alkaline, NiMh, or L91 Lithium primaries. In the US, we have the option of 3v CRAAs (same as CR123s) for $1.50 a piece, which is an important off-grid cell for me since it will also power any of my 2xAA devices.

 

[SnowJim]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

Vote with your dollars - buy wide voltage (0.9-4.2v) AA lights and run 14500 Li-ions in them if you want the output. The 14500 has ~20% more capacity than the 16340 and you can ways run common ~1.5v Alkaline, NiMh, or L91 Lithium primaries. In the US, we have the option of 3v CRAAs (same as CR123s) for $1.50 a piece, which is an important off-grid cell for me since it will also power any of my 2xAA devices.

Can you explain this some more? Are you saying that I can buy AA batteries that more then 1.5 v?

 

[jorn]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

Yes, but it's not a aa battery. The 14500 is 3,7V (4,2 V fully charged). 14500 means Its 14 mm in diamerter and 50 mm long, the last 0 tells its a cylindrical batteri. Same size as a standard aa. I like single 14500/aa lights way better than cr123 / 16340 lights. Last time i checked a cr123 costs around 17$ in stores around here

Lots of tiny aaa lights becomes "keychain monsters" with a 10440 cell. (same size as the aaa battery, but 4,2V fresh out from the charger. :devil: ) Heats up fast, so you have a tiny but powerful light, and a handwarmer on your keychain. It's so smalll thats it's always with me, so it's the most used light.

 

[reppans]

Batteris for flashlights

Can you explain this some more? Are you saying that I can buy AA batteries that more then 1.5 v?

Yeah, the AA size has all the battery chemistries represented - CLICKY

In addition to the ~1.5V Alkalines, NiMh, and Lithium L91s, you also have rechargeable 3.0-4.2V Li-ions (Colbalt, Manganese, Iron versions) called 14500s (14mm x 50mm) and disposable 3v Lithium Manganese primaries called CRAAs. These are basically the AA equivalent of the RCR123/16340 rechargeable and CR123 primary cells (except more capacity with the Li-ion). Not many lights have both buck and boost drivers and can fully support (ie, retain lower modes at spec) the broad 0.9-4.2V range..... but your light (Quark) can using a 1AA body . Unfortunately the CRAA cell is currently a monopoly and I'm not sure it can be easily shipped to Europe.

 

[mbw_151]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

There are three problems with commercially available AA batteries. The common inexpensive alkaline battery can not sustain high power draw, they leak, and they operates at 1.4-1.5V. Two of these problems are solved by using rechargable NiMH batteries (Enloop or similiar) or disposable Li/FeS2 (Energizer L91 or similiar). Both battery types do not leak and can sustain high power draw.

Solving the third problem requires a compromise. LEDs want to operate at ~3.7 volts. A boost circuit is used to adjust the voltage from the battery to the required level. Boost from 3V (voltage of a CR123A) to 3.7V is relatively efficient. Boost from 1.5V to 3.7V is less efficient and results in lower output and/or shorter runtime. The solution to this is to use 2 AA batteries which achieve the same 3V, but requires a longer (or wider) flashlight.

 

[cland72]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

Sounds like it isn't worth it, I'd stick with AA and 18650 if I were you. CR123s are only used in my long term storage lights, but if I were in your shoes, I could just as easily make due with a quality AA/AAA light with lithium primaries in it.

 

[mcnair55]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

There are three problems with commercially available AA batteries. The common inexpensive alkaline battery can not sustain high power draw, they leak, and they operates at 1.4-1.5V. Two of these problems are solved by using rechargable NiMH batteries (Enloop or similiar) or disposable Li/FeS2 (Energizer L91 or similiar). Both battery types do not leak and can sustain high power draw.

Solving the third problem requires a compromise. LEDs want to operate at ~3.7 volts. A boost circuit is used to adjust the voltage from the battery to the required level. Boost from 3V (voltage of a CR123A) to 3.7V is relatively efficient. Boost from 1.5V to 3.7V is less efficient and results in lower output and/or shorter runtime. The solution to this is to use 2 AA batteries which achieve the same 3V, but requires a longer (or wider) flashlight.

You cannot go around saying Alkaline leak.Manufacturers spend huge amounts of money on marketing high quality Alkaline batteries.I use them on a daily basis and provide you use common sense you should never really get a problem.Leakers generally come to light when some id yacht has left them in there appliance for months and months on end without use and rechargeable would have been the correct option.I wager the leak rate on Alkaline would be a % of 1% per million sold.

Your solution of using double AA would suit very few people.I recently bought a D25A because of its size runs ok on Alkaline or Eneloop type but i certainally would not want a double AA version due to size.

 

[välineurheilija]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

You cannot go around saying Alkaline leak.Manufacturers spend huge amounts of money on marketing high quality Alkaline batteries.I use them on a daily basis and provide you use common sense you should never really get a problem.Leakers generally come to light when some id yacht has left them in there appliance for months and months on end without use and rechargeable would have been the correct option.I wager the leak rate on Alkaline would be a % of 1% per million sold.

Your solution of using double AA would suit very few people.I recently bought a D25A because of its size runs ok on Alkaline or Eneloop type but i certainally would not want a double AA version due to size.

Do you work for Duracell or something?:duck: Better use rechargeables and save the planet :laughing:

 

[yellow]

very easy: DAILY USE --> rechargeable.
... not to argue

in actual high drain lights - under 4-5 hours per set of batteries - this is even more evident because
1: of cost
2: unnecessary toxic waste when using primary cells (especially in sub 1 hour lights)
3: most primary cells can not give the current needed, while the rechargeables can ...
(has already been typed above ...)


to give an idea:
AA and 14500 is the same size cell - and, when rechargeable, both offer about the same energy.
An CR123 (the rechargeable one: CR123a) has a bit less power inside.
the main difference is, that the typical CR123 light can be run with both sells,
while the AA light MUST be able to be run with the 14500 Li-Ion else it will
Also needs a special charger - for Li-Ion
(but the whole system is cheaper than a Ni-Mh/Ni-Cad setup, because a good charger for that is really costy)


to give You a "visible" idea: See size differences:

my advice:
AA / 14500 rechargeable for extreme ECD (every day carry), but for "normal" light chores, nothing beats an 1*18650 light.
That cell houses extremely more energy but the light itself is not that much "bigger". In case of the typical 2*AA light, it actually is shorter ...

 

[Lynx_Arc]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

You cannot go around saying Alkaline leak.Manufacturers spend huge amounts of money on marketing high quality Alkaline batteries.I use them on a daily basis and provide you use common sense you should never really get a problem.Leakers generally come to light when some id yacht has left them in there appliance for months and months on end without use and rechargeable would have been the correct option.I wager the leak rate on Alkaline would be a % of 1% per million sold.

It is a little higher than 1% for sure
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?338882-Akaline-Battery-Leakage-Usage-Poll-(Part-2)
The fact that battery makers put on the back in their guarantee a way to contact them when they leak and a promise to recompense for such shows they do indeed know there is problem with leakage. Personally I think the amount of people who take advantage of the "warranty" for leakage is such that they can write it off as most people who have batteries leak just throw away the device damaged by them.

 

[prop]

The internet is your friend. I get mine from here: http://www.flashaholics.co.uk/batteries/lithium-batteries.html

12 Energizer lithium batteries for 12 pounds. That's not too bad in my opinion.

 

[fivemega]

Invest once for single 18650 and enjoy rechargeability for many years.

 

[Monocrom]

Not sure what the import fees are, but generally the best way to save on CR123s is to:

1) Buy online from a reputable place.
2) Buy in bulk.
3) Buy only Made in America or Made in Japan cells, in order to avoid the dangerous no-name junk coming out of China.

Must admit, as far as AA and AAA cells are concerned; plenty of new flashlight models giving rather impressive performance using those batteries.

 

[StorminMatt]

It is a little higher than 1% for sure
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...2-Akaline-Battery-Leakage-Usage-Poll-(Part-2)
The fact that battery makers put on the back in their guarantee a way to contact them when they leak and a promise to recompense for such shows they do indeed know there is problem with leakage. Personally I think the amount of people who take advantage of the "warranty" for leakage is such that they can write it off as most people who have batteries leak just throw away the device damaged by them.

Agreed. It's also very likely true that battery manufacturers found that the cost of making batteries more leak-proof FAR exceeds the cost of paying the few warranty claims they receive. Remember that many people look at a device destroyed by leaked batteries as an opportunity to go out and buy something newer and better.

 

[mcnair55]

Re: Batteris for flashlights

It is a little higher than 1% for sure
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...2-Akaline-Battery-Leakage-Usage-Poll-(Part-2)
The fact that battery makers put on the back in their guarantee a way to contact them when they leak and a promise to recompense for such shows they do indeed know there is problem with leakage. Personally I think the amount of people who take advantage of the "warranty" for leakage is such that they can write it off as most people who have batteries leak just throw away the device damaged by them.

That is no proof,hobby polls are nothing.I still maintain failure rate would be less than a % of 1 % per million batteries sold.