Confused over how many 18650's are needed for solar force 5 mode 980 XM-L2 U2

[schwizzle]

I just want to say to approach this flashlight lego~ing with caution.

Once you get started it's like crack.... Ya' gotta' just keep building them..Lol..

But seriously, I would go ahead and get at least one extension so you have the option for 2 x 18650's if you ever feel the need. They're cheap enough.

Yes, you are right, I already have a 2nd build in mind, lol.

I was looking at a fenix PD35, but I started seeing how cheaply you can build a similar torch for much much less money and get the kind of host you want, so decided to go that route. PD35 has more brightness settings and that instant strobe feature that I really liked, but I decided I didn't need the PD35 for $40 more.

BTW, I went with the low voltage 820 lumen 3 mode XM-L T6. That limits me to using just one 18650. Will change the bulb if I decide I don't like it.

I'm putting this question here because I think it's getting looked over because of how many posts I've put (sorry): How safe/unsafe are li-ion batteries? I see some discussion that says NiMh are better. It seems most people get the 18650 batteries however. I suppose with a good charger and good protected batteries, there is little to no risk of the batteries exploding? I am planning on getting a Nitecore Sysmax I4 Intellicharge i4 version 2 and a Nitecore 2600 18650.

 

[Therrin]

They have 980 lumens XML2 U2 on their sales website. Their main website isn't up to date for whatever reason. Here is the link: http://www.solarforceflashlight-sales.com/product.php?sname=&s=53&t=RB

I decided to go with the 820 lumens, 3 mode XML U2 T6 low voltage version.

How safe/unsafe are li-ion batteries? I see some discussion that says NiMh are better. It seems most people get the 18650 batteries however. I suppose with a good charger and good protected batteries, there is little to no risk of the batteries exploding? I am planning on getting a Nitecore charger, lots of good reviews.

Hey awesome! Thanks for that link, I hadn't seen those yet. I stand corrected!

I'm pretty sure that your question wasn't overlooked. At least one person linked you to some useful information. It is helpful for you to do your own research on this stuff, so that you can make qualified decisions for yourself about what is better and what you feel safe with.

That having been said....even normal batteries can explode if you mistreat them, it's just not very common. Little kids learn how to handle and charge and use these things safely, it's not rocket science. Don't over charge it, don't run it too low, don't short it out. Do your research, there is a WEALTH of knowledge on this forum, probably far more than you would ever care or want to know, depending just how far you wanna follow that road to miniscule bits of knowledge; it just depends on what kind of person you are and how you go about using the stuff.
There should be specs somewhere for just about everything you purchase, or there is probably someone on here who has used it or done it, just look stuff up.

*I* like LiIons because they have a higher energy density than NiCd/NiMh, aren't as fickle, have a higher cycle life, run at a higher per-cell voltage.
If you wanted to run a dropin that required 6 - 9V input for example, that'd be at least FIVE NiMh cells in SERIES!!! (end-to-end) but it'd only require 2 LiXx cells. See?
(primary AA/AAA cells are 1.5V, rechargeable NiCd/NiMh cells are only 1.2V, LiXx cells ... lets just say for argument's sake they're ~4.2V)

Chances are, if you have a cell phone or a laptop you're already using LiIo/LiPo/LiXx type cells and you just don't realize it.

 

[schwizzle]

Hey awesome! Thanks for that link, I hadn't seen those yet. I stand corrected!

I'm pretty sure that your question wasn't overlooked. At least one person linked you to some useful information. It is helpful for you to do your own research on this stuff, so that you can make qualified decisions for yourself about what is better and what you feel safe with.

That having been said....even normal batteries can explode if you mistreat them, it's just not very common. Little kids learn how to handle and charge and use these things safely, it's not rocket science. Don't over charge it, don't run it too low, don't short it out. Do your research, there is a WEALTH of knowledge on this forum, probably far more than you would ever care or want to know, depending just how far you wanna follow that road to miniscule bits of knowledge; it just depends on what kind of person you are and how you go about using the stuff.
There should be specs somewhere for just about everything you purchase, or there is probably someone on here who has used it or done it, just look stuff up.

*I* like LiIons because they have a higher energy density than NiCd/NiMh, aren't as fickle, have a higher cycle life, run at a higher per-cell voltage.
If you wanted to run a dropin that required 6 - 9V input for example, that'd be at least FIVE NiMh cells in SERIES!!! (end-to-end) but it'd only require 2 LiXx cells. See?
(primary AA/AAA cells are 1.5V, rechargeable NiCd/NiMh cells are only 1.2V, LiXx cells ... lets just say for argument's sake they're ~4.2V)

Chances are, if you have a cell phone or a laptop you're already using LiIo/LiPo/LiXx type cells and you just don't realize it.

Thanks! Yes, I realized I was probably asking too many questions and figured these questions had been answered before. Seemed like there was a lot of differing opinions on Li-ion vs NiMh(from two years ago or longer too), I didn't know if anything had changed in battery tech the last couple of years.

I like Li-ion better as well for the reasons you mentioned. I had seen some of that information before, but still wanted a 2nd opinion.


I did see Valineurheilija's link on electronic testing of a flashlight which is very helpful. The flashlight wikia that is out there is also very helpful.


Also, what I said wasn't a criticism of people in the forum, just an observation, which I thought I was to blame because of how many posts I have posted.


Everybody has been very helpful and I appreciate it.

 

[Therrin]

When it all comes down to it, my opinion really doesn't matter, I have my own uses for the stuff. I know some folks on here who still prefer only using NiMh. It really depends what your uses/needs are, and what YOU think, and what you're interested in playing around with.

I'm glad people have been very receptive to you! I wouldn't want you to think that there is any....elitism...going on here. <.< >.> It's (of course) not like every other hobby or clan/group/club where people end up getting massive egos.:nana:

There are tons of nice and very helpful folks on here. The others, you can differentiate between pretty quickly because they will refuse to respond to you, because you're beneath them and you don't speak their language, and they've just seen tooo many n00bs come and go to waste their time talking to someone who isn't also a die-hard fanatic......yet.

 

[schwizzle]

When it all comes down to it, my opinion really doesn't matter, I have my own uses for the stuff. I know some folks on here who still prefer only using NiMh. It really depends what your uses/needs are, and what YOU think, and what you're interested in playing around with.

I'm glad people have been very receptive to you! I wouldn't want you to think that there is any....elitism...going on here. <.< >.> It's (of course) not like every other hobby or clan/group/club where people end up getting massive egos.:nana:

There are tons of nice and very helpful folks on here. The others, you can differentiate between pretty quickly because they will refuse to respond to you, because you're beneath them and you don't speak their language, and they've just seen tooo many n00bs come and go to waste their time talking to someone who isn't also a die-hard fanatic......yet.

Emphasis on the yet. . Actually...might as well take the yet out of it completely.

 

[Aahhyes68]

Emphasis on the yet. . Actually...might as well take the yet out of it completely.

Whatever you do... DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT log on the CPFMarketplace....... You'll watch your expendable income go !!

 

[schwizzle]

Whatever you do... DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT log on the CPFMarketplace....... You'll watch your expendable income go !!

What's expendable income? Never seen that before......

 

[schwizzle]

I haven't been able to find the answer to this question I have, so please bear with me: The L2N host that I got says the tailcap can withstand a 3A current. Does this mean I shouldn't use 3100 or 3400 18650 batteries? I am looking at using 3100 batteries.

Thanks again everyone.

 

[välineurheilija]

I haven't been able to find the answer to this question I have, so please bear with me: The L2N host that I got says the tailcap can withstand a 3A current. Does this mean I shouldn't use 3100 or 3400 18650 batteries? I am looking at using 3100 batteries.

Thanks again everyone.

The current that your drop in takes from the battery is what matters because that current goes trough the tailcap and 3A is enough for (i think) every normal drop in.3100 and so on is the capacity of the battery and not the current it can deliver.
if you have a protected battery then the protection circuit will dictate the current you get out of that battery but that is a different thing.
to the point you are good to go with those batteries and tailcap

 

[schwizzle]

The current that your drop in takes from the battery is what matters because that current goes trough the tailcap and 3A is enough for (i think) every normal drop in.3100 and so on is the capacity of the battery and not the current it can deliver.
if you have a protected battery then the protection circuit will dictate the current you get out of that battery but that is a different thing.
to the point you are good to go with those batteries and tailcap

Thanks again välineurheilija! I will be using protected batteries because the drop-in doesn't have its own protection circuit.

 

[8steve88]

I've been using Lithium batteries for about a year and have a couple of things to point out. Don't buy ****(any)Fire batteries, stick to known good brands, they are more likely to state the correct mAh rating. Same goes for chargers, good quality will be safer than ****(any)Fire or no-name chargers. Bad things can and do happen with cheap imports.
I've been using Nitecore 3100mAh and Samsung 3000mAh protected 18650 batteries with a Nitecore i4v2 charger this set-up has performed flawlessly in all my Solarforce L series lights, a lot of them, be warned they are addictive - being able yo "Lego" them together is a great way of getting the light you want at low cost.
Just a few things. Don't leave the charger on for longer than it takes to fully charge the batteries. Personally I never leave it unattended when charging. Don't let the batteries get over discharged. A digital MultiMeter should be in your future if you haven't already got one, invaluble for checking battery voltage when deciding when to re-charge. A few simple precautions like these will ensure trouble free and reliable light when you need it. Enjoy.

 

[schwizzle]

I've been using Lithium batteries for about a year and have a couple of things to point out. Don't buy ****(any)Fire batteries, stick to known good brands, they are more likely to state the correct mAh rating. Same goes for chargers, good quality will be safer than ****(any)Fire or no-name chargers. Bad things can and do happen with cheap imports.
I've been using Nitecore 3100mAh and Samsung 3000mAh protected 18650 batteries with a Nitecore i4v2 charger this set-up has performed flawlessly in all my Solarforce L series lights, a lot of them, be warned they are addictive - being able yo "Lego" them together is a great way of getting the light you want at low cost.
Just a few things. Don't leave the charger on for longer than it takes to fully charge the batteries. Personally I never leave it unattended when charging. Don't let the batteries get over discharged. A digital MultiMeter should be in your future if you haven't already got one, invaluble for checking battery voltage when deciding when to re-charge. A few simple precautions like these will ensure trouble free and reliable light when you need it. Enjoy.

That is exactly what I got coming (two Nitecore 3100's and the Nitecore i4v2 charger). Glad to hear they are working for you.

The charger is supposed to have over-voltage protection, and the batteries have undervoltage protection don't they? Better safe than sorry I suppose. Got the multi-meter, so I am ready.

 

[Therrin]

Most of the cell protections have over-voltage, under-voltage, over-draw, reverse polarity, and short circuit protection built in. But they also vary a bit from circuit to circuit, and you can get cells both Protected or regular non-protected.

I've only used 4 or 5 chargers, I have no idea exactly how the wall-chargers are regulated, except that I've been using my SolarForce wall charger for a few years, well over a thousand times, and have had no issues till it finally just stopped working. If I put a cell into it that needs charging, it just still shows a green light and does nothing. (so I got another one! Cuz, they're cheap).

My other chargers I can actually dial in and specify what voltage specifically I want, one of them even down to 0.005v. So in terms of "what chargers do" and "what protection circuits offer", those are pretty broad questions and the results vary widely based on what you're using. For the most part, most of them try to do the same things, to some degree.

HKJ has a site that reviews both chargers and batteries, I would HIGHLY suggest you check it out! It has been a wonderful resource for me. He even has a program on his website that shows graphed outputs of his tests of different cells so you can compare cells to each other.
http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers UK.html

As well as some of his specific posts here on the forum:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?257543-LiIon-18650-battery-comparison


I already have one 18650 tube extension for my L2p, that I've had for a while.
Have another extension, 3 more 2600mAh cells, and the SolarForce K3 Cree MT-G2 head section on the way!!
It claims 1500 lumens (which is actually conservative for that LED, based on spec sheets).
But that head is 5.5-13V.
So that way I can run with with 2x18350, 2x18650, or 3x18650. Super stoked for it to get here so I can try it out!

 

[8steve88]

"I already have one 18650 tube extension for my L2p, that I've had for a while.
Have another extension, 3 more 2600mAh cells, and the SolarForce K3 Cree MT-G2 head section on the way!!
It claims 1500 lumens (which is actually conservative for that LED, based on spec sheets).
But that head is 5.5-13V.
So that way I can run with with 2x18350, 2x18650, or 3x18650. Super stoked for it to get here so I can try it out!"

One of my favourite Solarforce lights is the L2M I use a CR123 3v primary in shorty mode, forget which drop-in I have in it, I've built up quite a collection of drop-ins and enough parts to Lego 8 or 9 lights including one attached to a Solarforce LT1 lantern kit. Bezels and other bits as well. Two of my prized bits are by a member here dsche - Titanium lanyard rings Superb workmanship and very useful as well.

 

[schwizzle]

All right, got everything in the mail from Solarforce, and I do like what I received. The bulb is very bright, though I don't know what the OTF lumens are. However, I was slightly disappointed in the throw...until I read that XM-L's are not known for throw. Should have done more research on that.

So now I am looking at XP-G2. I've read about XR-E and the regular XP-G as well. I'd still like some flood, which is why I was looking for XP-G and XP-G2. XP-G2 is reported to give 20% more output and 5% smaller hot spot per flashlightwiki.

I've found this at dealextreme: http://dx.com/p/ultrafire-cree-xpg2...h-reflector-silver-golden-197210#.Uv6MCPldV8E

Are Ultrafire drop-in's any good? It's so cheap, I figured it's worth a shot. I'd like to buy one of Vin's drop-in's, but $45 is a little out of my price range right now. Any other recommendations?

Edit: BTW, I have looked to see if there are any threads regarding the quality of Ultrafire's drop-in's, but I haven't found much.

 

[schwizzle]

Most of the cell protections have over-voltage, under-voltage, over-draw, reverse polarity, and short circuit protection built in. But they also vary a bit from circuit to circuit, and you can get cells both Protected or regular non-protected.

I've only used 4 or 5 chargers, I have no idea exactly how the wall-chargers are regulated, except that I've been using my SolarForce wall charger for a few years, well over a thousand times, and have had no issues till it finally just stopped working. If I put a cell into it that needs charging, it just still shows a green light and does nothing. (so I got another one! Cuz, they're cheap).

My other chargers I can actually dial in and specify what voltage specifically I want, one of them even down to 0.005v. So in terms of "what chargers do" and "what protection circuits offer", those are pretty broad questions and the results vary widely based on what you're using. For the most part, most of them try to do the same things, to some degree.

HKJ has a site that reviews both chargers and batteries, I would HIGHLY suggest you check it out! It has been a wonderful resource for me. He even has a program on his website that shows graphed outputs of his tests of different cells so you can compare cells to each other.
http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers%20UK.html

As well as some of his specific posts here on the forum:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?257543-LiIon-18650-battery-comparison


I already have one 18650 tube extension for my L2p, that I've had for a while.
Have another extension, 3 more 2600mAh cells, and the SolarForce K3 Cree MT-G2 head section on the way!!
It claims 1500 lumens (which is actually conservative for that LED, based on spec sheets).
But that head is 5.5-13V.
So that way I can run with with 2x18350, 2x18650, or 3x18650. Super stoked for it to get here so I can try it out!

That K3 head looks awesome. I like the M3 as well.

 

[DellSuperman]

That K3 head looks awesome. I like the M3 as well.

The M3 is built for throw, deep smooth reflector.
I modded mine for direct drive & it throws damm well.
The K3 is a floodier light than the M3 but can still throw quite well due to the sheer lumens.

 

[välineurheilija]

I have a couple of ultrafire drop ins.They work but you will never know when they stop doing so

 

[schwizzle]

Thanks välineurheilija. I went ahead and ordered one just to try it out and see what XP-G2 is like. If it craps out I'll just save up for one of Vin's.