I need two new torches for hunting, as I am changing how I'm doing things

[JohnGalway]

Hello folks,

I am a sheep farmer here in Ireland. Over the Winter and in Spring I will be shooting foxes, as we have lambs taken by them each year. Recently my knee, hip, and shoulders have been giving me trouble so I need to get rid of some weight........... meaning my 28amp battery! I walk a lot over bad ground so hunting from a vehicle isn't an option, it isn't allowed here either way.

Currently I am using a LightForce 170 Striker with a 100W bulb (which will explain the 28amp battery) as both my spotter and shooting light. I use a Nightforce NXS 5.5-22x56 scope if that makes any difference to anyone.

In recent days my attention has been drawn to the Nightmaster 800 (Dereelight I think) to use as a scope mounted light. I have been seeking out opinions on various hunting forums from actual users. The most important thing to me in a rifle mounted light is that I can positively identify and shoot the fox not less than 250 yards. Obviously performance will vary depending on weather conditions, but let's assume that we can see the fox through the scope at 250 yards using the above mentioned Lightforce as a base.

The second light I would need is a spotter. I could be out for anything up to 6 hours so would need a light to last that long. I don't mind carrying spare batteries the size of 18650's. My main need for this light is that I can spot eye shine a long way out, over 600 yards as a minimum - we have a lot of open ground to cover such as bogland and mountain. We have used the Lightforce to spot foxes out on the hills over 600 yards. It should not have a very narrow beam, should be more like the Lightforce really, where I can cover areas of groud not square inches

So to sum up, scope mounted light needs to let me shoot a fox at 250 yards.
Spotting light needs to let me spot fox eye shine out to at least 600 yards.

I have the Nightmaster 800 lead for my scope mounted light but I am clueless as to the spotter.

I want to get away from heavy batteries, backpacks, wires, and Lightforces, so I don't wish to buy a Lithium-Ion battery. It would be nice if both torches used the same type of battery, it would simplify things for me.

In short, I need some friendly knowledgeable help

Thanks to everyone who takes the time to read and reply

ATB,

John

 

[langham]

I am not exactly sure what you want, and I do not spend more than $40 on a light as a general note, but the lights that saabluster has are amazing. I think that they would be best for both applications, his website doesn't have a lot of lights but they are great. http://www.onestopthrowshop.com/aboutus.sc. I would make some cheaper suggestions if you would like, but I know not everyone is as cheap as me with lights. 250 yrds is a long way to be able to see something clearly at night, around where I live it is too humid, so I am not sure I will be able to help other than to tell you what I know to be the brightest.

 

[GRunner]

Hi,

The only thing that comes to mind is from a company called Laser Genetics. They make both scope mounted and hand held lights for your purpose. I think the model is ND3x50. I've only played with these inside stores so I can't say how they act in the field but their web site may be of interest to you.
What rifle and caliber are you putting it on.

Good luck.

 

[subwoofer]

What is your budget?

At the lower end of the scale, the FandyFire STL-V6 has good reports as a thrower which would be good for your spotting. I've not got one, but it is probably the cheapest search light that would do the job you need. You can find these in DealExtreme.

Personally I use a Fenix TK41 and Xtar S1 for this purpose.


For the gun light, again it depends on what you want to spend. Starting with the UltraFire WF-502B Cree R2 (again from DX) this has good throw due to the R2 LED and is a P60 host so you can play with different drop-ins.

I use a variety of lights gun mounted. The ArmyTek Predator, FOURSEVENS Maelstrom X7 and two Ultrafire WF-501Bs (with Red LED drop-in and another with an R2). These all run off 18650 or CR123, so if you go with any of these then the FandyFire or Xtar would use the same batteries.

You will find reviews of the Xtar S1 and FOURSEVENS X7 in my list of reviews:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?330562-Subwoofer-s-Reviews

and the TK41 features in many of these as well as a benchmark light.

 

[cummins4x4]

I have a Deeree with an aspherical lens which should work for your situation. For longer range I have a custom Maglight which lights things up to 1 kilometre. Both of these are dedicated throwers and hunting lights.

 

[SUNDAYBAIN]

I have a Deeree with an aspherical lens which should work for your situation. For longer range I have a custom Maglight which lights things up to 1 kilometre. Both of these are dedicated throwers and hunting lights.

Hi what is your custom maglite

 

[JohnGalway]

Thank you for all the replies, I have been keeping up to date with this thread, but I didn't want to but in too early

As for ranges shooting at night, to be able to shoot a fox 250 yards at night is the minimum distance I will tolerate. The ground is safe, it's mountainous or barren bogland, so backstops aren't a problem. There are, as I am sure in many areas, a few loose cannon shooters who go around educating foxes. The ones who will shoot at eyes and when they don't see the eyes any longer they assume they killed the fox, but never go look for it :thumbsdow I've shot foxes using the Lightforce out to 300 yards at night. That's as far as my skill allows at the moment.

Weather conditions are of course another variable, and one will see farther on cold crisp winter nights, than humid wet nights. What I am looking for is simple, that given conditions where I can shoot a fox at 250 yards with the Lightforce, I can also do the same with what ever torch. In other words, I don't want to fork out money for something that will give me lesser performance at that range than the LF does.

I'm not interested in the Laser Genetics, I have seen too many of them come up for sale secondhand quite quickly from people who regularly shoot foxes in my part of the world. That tells it's own story.

Now, my budget, that is indeed a good question. I don't have a set budget. If my requirements can be filled by a lesser €$£ torch, then that is a torch that will do. If I have to spend more €$£ on a torch, then I'll just have to save longer and buy later. But, I think getting rid of the backpack, heavy battery, big lamp and associated wires is the right direction to be heading for me.

Subwoofer, thank you for the leads on torch names, I have looked into them. I liked the Xtar S1 beam the most I think, going from internet pics here.

Cummins4x4, can you tell me more about the modified maglight? Is it a Lardy/Marky light? or something else? I have some type of a maglight, 4c/d cell I think. To be honest I don't use it and I wouldn't be against butchering it if I was able to modify it :thumbsup: 1km is some range

 

[TEEJ]

The Deerelight night master with aspherical head will work well as a gun sight light, a few of us use it that way. It can light up a ~ 10' area at the range you are looking at, fine for lining up a target.

Its beam is too narrow to be an excellent spotter though, as that's too small a patch of light to FIND things with.


Spotters;

Some other lights with excellent throw, but an off the shelf light, with a broad enough beam to search with would include the Fenix TK70, the Olight SR90 (There are newer versions of this too), the Crelant 7G9, the Thrunite T31, etc.

Another route would be the modified lights from OMG Lumens (Saabluster's), or Lambda Lights (Such as the modified Maglites).

I have many of the above, and stuff from both customs, and selecting any of the above spec'd for your needs, you can't go wrong really.

We're talking about clearly SEEING the critters at 400-600 meters, not just eye shine.


A caveat...the modded mags tend to not have great run time...they are powerful but use up juice to make that power. The run time is useable, I do search and rescue work, and I use 2 different Lambda Lights for example for aspects of that.

There are reviews and beam shots for all the above lights...you could take a gander at them.

 

[BenChiew]

John. What caliber are you using? 17 Remington? 22 magnum? 22/250s?
I presume you go shooting alone.
You already have the perfect setup.
Incandescent lamp will out throw most LEDs. And even if you have a big throw led setup, you will be lacking in runtime. Light force uses a motorcycle size battery and that will beat the hell out of any lithium. Unless you pack a lithium the size of a motorcycle battery.

And if you are using larger calibers than 22, you would need pretty good recoil resistant setup light. But I don't know anyone taking foxes with a 30 caliber.

Scanning at 600 yards using led, the beam would have to be laser thin, probably using an aspheric lens. That does not do any good for you.

Have you tried whistling them in?

 

[Gunner12]

Like the last poster said, the Dereelight Nightmaster could work, but the beam could be too narrow.

Would two lights be better? One with a wider and less throwy beam for searching for targets, and a narrow beam more throwy one to confirm the target.

 

[BenChiew]

Plus your variable scope will quickly loose the target in higher magnification if your beam covers a small field of view. Your 56 ocular lens should be able to pick a target up quite easily even in low light. Upgrading your scope and a good spotting binoculars may help you identify the target effectively under low lighting conditions. Zeiss and Swarovski makes good low light binoculars.

 

[JohnGalway]

For the spotter, I am liking the look of the Thrunite TN31. My reasoning is weight, value for money, throw. I would have preferred the Fenix TK70 until I saw it took 4 D cells, that will weigh too much for spotting over an extended period IMO. I was also looking at the Creland 7G9, but I think the Thrunite TN31 beats it.

Anyone care to disagree with my choice and suggest something better - cheaper, as light, as good a throw.

I shoot a .223.

I disagree that my lightforce set up is perfect. A 28 amp sealed lead acid battery is HEAVY. The leads get caught in barbed wire fencing, and on the edge of my jacket pocket. The 170 Striker itself is really badly wired, I had to rewire it from new, it's prone to catching the wind, the light plastic makes loud noise if it touches most anything.

It works, but it's very far from perfect IMO.

My knee, shoulders and hip tell me it is time to change.

My plan is for two lights. One (semi) permanently attached to the scope. Another as my spotter.

Changing scope and buying bino's would cost me thousands of euros more than what I actually want to do and solve none of my problems.

 

[JohnGalway]

Got a question about the Thrunite TN31, can it be focused manually?

 

[Gunner12]

Most lights here do not have adjustable focus (including the TN31). Also de-focusing a reflector light will give a pretty ugly beam. A diffuser would work better for a wider beam.

 

[JohnGalway]

Thanks Gunner.

 

[JohnGalway]

I don't suppose coloured LED's are available for the TN31..........

 

[JohnGalway]

Well...

In the end I cheaped out, blessed myself and ordered:

For my spotter:

FandyFire STL-V6 CREE XM-LT6 2-Mode 1000-Lumen White LED Flashlight (2x18650/3x16340/3x123A)

For mounting on my rifle scope: Hi POWER OPTIMUS LD-50 SUB ZERO GREEN LASER HUNTING or RESCUE DESIGNATOR 25-30mm mount

I'll report back on how I get on with them from a fox shooting point of view.

Links removed as per the banner at the top of the page - Norm

Thanks Norm, sorry about that, habit from other forums.

 

[SUNDAYBAIN]

Look forward on how they perform John i was looking for a spotter would have liked a red or green led but will see how you get on with the fandyfire

 

[langham]

If you were willing to go cheap you should have said so and I could have pointed you toward any number of lights that would do the job. You need to buy the SKU:26248 batteries, IMO they are the best for the money, not just on DX they outperform many LG and Samsung 18650s. I recently bought the SKU: 102582 and I am amazed at how well it performs at distance, it will easily illuminate 300 yds to the naked eye. I bought it while it was on clearence for $31 so it was a bargin. You should check several things when you get the light, first of all the soldered connection to the pill from the driver, a lot of times this is a small connection that will disconnect over time from mechanical agitation and such. I personnally solder the entire way around the board to the pill. There will most likely not be any thermal paste on any of the joints from the pill to the outside of the light, this causes poor thermal charicteristics. They have cheap thermal paste available from any number of online stores, and on DX at SKU:4579 I got this stuff and it isn't the best, but it is better than not haveing it and it helps quite a bit on getting rid of the heat. If you can you should test current too, with 2*18650 it should get around 1.6 A if it gets much more it has a poor connection somewhere and you are loosing a lot of power, much less and it is being underdriven. I looked at the weight of the light and it seems to be a little light for that kind of emmitter (ie. not enough material for heat purposes.), so ensuring it has proper heatsinking will be important. The light should start to heat up after 5 min. of use to the point where you can feel the difference, and should never get so hot to where you are uncomfortable holding it. If I had to guess with the before mentioned batteries you should get almost 2 hrs of continuous use at high mode, mine gets about that much with these batteries. Good luck with the light, I hope you are happy with it, that design seems to be a very popular choice.

 

[JohnGalway]

Thanks Langham,

To be honest I chickened out when I added up the cost of what I had in mind initially. Thrunite tn31 + batteries & charger, and Nightmaster 800, various LEDs, extension tube and other bits, ouch! I may get them in the future but I also need a new car now so I had a reality check.

You reckon the 102582 torch will light up ground 300 yards away so I can make out features etc, such as lake edge, or walls? I will test out the Fandyfire when I get it and see how that works. I'll probably start a new thread on what I've bought for tips like you've given me above, which are much appreciated. I am way out of my depth in the terminology and technology here so I expect I'll make a whole lot of errors before I get to where I want to be.