scout24
Flashaholic
Flared tail? Bear-trap pocketclip? See my avatar... 
The best there is.
The best there is.
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McGizmo Ergonomics set the standard
- Thread starter precisionworks
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fyrstormer
Banned
Heh. I disarmed my bear traps so I could use my lights without destroying my pants, but the lights sit so deep in my pockets they still never fall out. That's the best part about the McGizmo(-style) clip, in my opinion, and it's something you can't notice until you use one: the light stays almost entirely in your pocket where it's safe and out-of-the-way.
precisionworks
Flashaholic
Non official procedure for reducing pocket clip tension ...
Remove both screws & mount pocket clip so it points the wrong way.
Pull up on clip until you barely feel it give. This sometimes happens on the first try but is more like on the tenth attempt.
Remove screws & mount in the normal position. Check tension. Adjust as necessary.
Remove both screws & mount pocket clip so it points the wrong way.
Pull up on clip until you barely feel it give. This sometimes happens on the first try but is more like on the tenth attempt.
Remove screws & mount in the normal position. Check tension. Adjust as necessary.
fyrstormer
Banned
That's way too dangerous. The last thing I need is to break off the screws in the screw holes.
The way I do it is I remove the clip entirely, clamp the flat part of the clip in a bench vise (or BIG adjustable wrench if a bench vise isn't available), put on a leather glove to protect my hand in case the clip breaks, and push HARD on the mounting point of the clip to straighten the bend a little bit. (the clip has never actually broken, but the amount of pressure I use is enough to cut my thumb to the bone if the clip did break, so I prefer to wear a little protection.)
I usually have to re-mount the clip, check the tension, remove it, and adjust it once or twice to get it just right. It's almost impossible to see the difference in the bend angle, so it has to be re-mounted on the light to confirm the remaining tension in the clip.
The way I do it is I remove the clip entirely, clamp the flat part of the clip in a bench vise (or BIG adjustable wrench if a bench vise isn't available), put on a leather glove to protect my hand in case the clip breaks, and push HARD on the mounting point of the clip to straighten the bend a little bit. (the clip has never actually broken, but the amount of pressure I use is enough to cut my thumb to the bone if the clip did break, so I prefer to wear a little protection.)
I usually have to re-mount the clip, check the tension, remove it, and adjust it once or twice to get it just right. It's almost impossible to see the difference in the bend angle, so it has to be re-mounted on the light to confirm the remaining tension in the clip.
If you want to loosen the clamping force on the clip you can do it with the clip in place. Use multiple shims of some sort that are the same thickness so that as you add to the thickness you have a feel for how much you are lifting the clip off the light body. At some point you will lift the clip far enough to induce some permanent deformation (loosening of the grip force). I would think some plastic sheet stock like credit card thickness would work. If you need to increase the clip's clamping force then you do need to remove it from the light.
precisionworks
Flashaholic
Thanks, Don. I don't remember ever seeing that suggestion before.
Perhaps Don will comment on that.
If people plan to take these screws in and out they might want to put some lube or wax on them to aid in this activity. I don't believe I have encountered or heard of a screw head breaking off or seizing of a screw but no doubt it is possible. By and large, I see no reason to ever take the clip off the light and my intent when i build these lights is that the screws never work themselves loose. The clip itself puts some load under the screw head when the screw is tightened and I don't believe a screw will vibrate or loosen under any normal circumstance. Thermal expansion of titanium is probably non existent in the normal range of use so this is no factor in upsetting the set of the screws.
fyrstormer
Banned
My concern about breaking off the screw heads is specifically related to the shear forces involved with using the screws as anchor points while bending the clip past its elastic limit. The amount of force I have to apply to bend the clip when it's off the light is far more than I would expect any 1/16" screw to withstand, and if they do withstand it, it's only because of good luck.
For my part, removing the clip is also an opportunity to lube the threads with Permatex anti-seize compound, so they won't get stuck and break if I ever have to remove them again. I had one screw head get rounded-out, even with the recommended Thorp 1/16" hex driver, and that was enough.
For my part, removing the clip is also an opportunity to lube the threads with Permatex anti-seize compound, so they won't get stuck and break if I ever have to remove them again. I had one screw head get rounded-out, even with the recommended Thorp 1/16" hex driver, and that was enough.
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precisionworks
Flashaholic
Bending the clip doesn't impose a shear vector force but rather it acts as a tensile strength pull. Tensile strength (at yield) of Ti-6-5 in the annealed condition is 128 ksi (880 MPa). A 4-40 screw has a minor diameter of .081" (2.06mm) so the area is .005 square inches. That means the screw will yield (pull apart) when stretched with 640# of pressure.
While working on my personal V10R the Lunsford Racing screws have been removed & installed at least a few dozen times. Each time they're installed the Thorpe driver is twisted hard enough that the screw can no longer be turned. The V10R is probably a worst case example as the thread depth is only 0.084" (2.10mm). The Haiku tail is nearly twice as thick at 0.150" (3.81mm). If those screws were going to break or strip they've already had plenty of opportunities
So, just keep adding shims under the clip edge until it bends outward a bit? That almost seems too simple to work. I guess it's the same as bending it by hand except a lot less likely to snap the clip as the pressure is added more gently.
am I seeing it right? u have orings in the spaces in your haiku head? can I please get their sizes and type
I never realized how great the ergonomics are on the Haiku/Sundrop/PD-S until working on a similar sized titanium light (SWM V10R). The V10R felt terrible in my hand & that caused me to analyze the McG design. My conclusion is:
Tail shroud design that flares out slightly. This makes extraction from a pocket easy, even with a super tight pocket clip. It also gives the gripping hand a "back stop" (for lack of a better term).
Reduced body tube diameter between head & tail. Lights that don't have this are much more difficult (for me) to grip.
Design of grooves. The spacing & height of the grooves is ideal for a good grip without being knurled or roughened.
Taking all that into account I McGizmo-ized the V10R by turning away half the grooves:
The difference in feel is night & day. Most of us take for granted the superb ergonomics of Don's lights - I certainly did. There's no doubt in my mind that the Haiku/Sundrop/PD-S has the best feel of any light on the market.
Thank you Don for a superb series of lights.
precisionworks
Flashaholic
That's exactly what you seeam I seeing it right? u have orings in the spaces in your haiku head? can I please get their sizes and type
I took my Haiku to the local Ace Hardware store & kept on trying O-rings until a size was found. Some are thicker, some thinner, some wider, etc., so you'll want to find the size that works for you.
You are basically lifting the clip away from the flashlight body and at some point you will lift it past its ability to return to its normal state. It will return but with less force against the body; that is to say looser clamping force. By doing this incrementally you are more in control and less likely to bend it too far. I don't know if I am being clear on this or not.
Makes sense to me, just seemed too simple is all.
One benefit of the beartrap clip though, is that it really works. Today I ran two miles with one of my Mules clipped on the elastic waistband of my running pants, on the outside, and it didn't budge a millimeter.
Who runs on a treadmill in a gym with a flashlight? Yeah, that's what this place does to people.
At least my shirt covered it to hide the geekiness. And Ti clips hold up well to sweat also. 
I disarmed the traps on my Haiku and Mule today, with the shim method. Jammed about 10 plastic membership/gift cards under the clip. It stretched it out just enough. It doesn't look any different and it still grips plenty well, but it is just loosened enough to be able to slide it on my pocket and pull it out without lifting up the clip to get the raised part of the body past my pocket edge. Success!
SAKplumber
Newly Enlightened
HI McGizmo! I was over at EDCF and Okie Chick shared a pic and mentioned something about you and some meet a bunch of you had. I kust say, I had no idea you made such nice looking stuff. I was going to ask where one could see a selection, but just noticed a link in someones signature line.
And I thought I was gonna spend money BEFORE! Ha.
It's good to hear so many fans reviews.
And I thought I was gonna spend money BEFORE! Ha.
It's good to hear so many fans reviews.
precisionworks
Flashaholic
Welcome aboard SAKplumber. Nice images on your Flickr site: http://www.flickr.com/photos/71467108@N08/
Don's lights remind me of a potato chip commercial that ran some years ago - "Betcha can't east just one". If you're like most of us you'll end up with a few. Not designed to be shelf queens but perfect for EDC & tough as nails.
LOL
This is only slightly OT regarding the McG pocket clip ... there's a Ti pocket clip for knives that has a tension release feature. Made by father & son knife makers Grant & Gavin Hawk:
ZT 0550 with Hawk Grip Clip & McGizmo Ti PD-S.
The PD-S has been carried every day for about five years & the 0550 is a new addition.
BenChiew
Flashlight Enthusiast
By far, the Haiku is my top favorite.
