Night Vision Devices, Housings VS Tubes.

[IPSC_GUY]

In my experience in using and repairing Night Vision Equipment has led me to a method of thinking about these devices as a system. These systems consist of generally two components.

1. The housing, be that a Monocular or a Binocular or a Weapons sight

2. The Image Intensifier, commonly referred to as the tube.

Now the tube is the magic part of this equation, in what ever generation it is. Generally speaking US made tubes are a self contained device only requiring a positive and negative voltage input (usually 3 volts) from a self contained voltage source of batteries.

Housings range from the simple like the AB Night Vision NVM, which is a super light weight MONO to the full blown 6X Raptor Night Vision Weapons sight and everywhere in between.

The point to all of this is when thinking about Night Vision devices, think of them as two parts, making up a system. It will better help when making choices in selecting the Night Vision device that is right for you.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[Greg G]

On voltage requirements, would NiMH batteries (Eneloops) be alright to use with an ITT GEN 3 tube?

The applications are PVS-14 and D-740.

Thanks.

 

[Patriot]

On voltage requirements, would NiMH batteries (Eneloops) be alright to use with an ITT GEN 3 tube?

The applications are PVS-14 and D-740.

Thanks.

Those units require 2.7 - 3.2 volts so NiMH would would be at the bottom of the voltage range.

 

[IPSC_GUY]

Are you using a single battery or dual battery 14?

Generally rechargeables have, as a rule of thumb been discouraged for use in NVDs. With the CR123s they come out at what, 4.2 volts? That is a bit high for my comfort level.

With the Double As they just won't last as long especially in the single battery units.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[Greg G]

The 14 is a single AA device. The 740 takes 2 AA's.

 

[iraqgunz]

IPSC_GUY,

I have a question that you may be able to answer. So far, the guys at Insight have not been able to help and I have exhausted my knowledge of NVG's.

I currently have about 50+ Insight Tech. NVM-001 night vision monoculars in my armory inventory. 3 of them are not working correctly. If you power the unit on, you cannot see an image. When you switch to IR mode the little indicator light comes on, but again no image is visible. If I remove the battery housing unit, place it back on to the main housing and power the unit on it works. I then tighten the screws and turn the unit off. If I let it sit and then power on again, it does that same thing all over.

The image intensifier works and doesn't seem to be an issue. I have cleaned the contacts, on the intensifier and the battery housing unit. At this point I am stumped and can't figure it out.

Any ideas or suggestions?
Any tests that can be done locally to isolate the problem?

I appreciate your assistance.

 

[IPSC_GUY]

WOW ! ! !

I am having a somewhat similar problem with a BRAND NEW Insight NVM mono. In addition I know another owner of an Insight NVM that is experiencing the same problem on a unit that is a couple of years old.

I have a couple of thoughts on your situation, but first let me describe my current problems.

If the unit sits for a period of time (12 to 24 hours) when the unit is first turned on the image tube will not light and if you turn the on switch to IR on, the indicator in the eyepiece will light and eventually the Image Intensifier will light. Turn it off and back on and the Image Intensifier will instantly light.

I suspect my problem is in the discriminator circuit that determines which battery is used as AAs seem to take 1.5 seconds where as CR123s take just at 2 seconds.

Now I have a couple of questions,

1. Do all three do the exact same thing?

2. When removing the battery assembly do the spring contacts appear straight?

3. Are your 10160 tubes silver bullets?

3. Do you have any Teflon tape?

Now here is a suggestion, put some tape in between the electrical contacts where they fold in and back out. I think you might be shorting out the connections?

Start there and see if that works.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[iraqgunz]

IPSC_GUY,

Yes, all three units do the same thing. Once , I separate the BHU from the housing and re-attach they work until I shut them down.

The battery contacts appear no different from the ones that are good.

I am not sure what type of tubes we have. They are black with the standard shiny gold contacts (Gen. III).

I will try the teflon tape thing and see if that solves the issue. I personally do not like the way they make contact as opposed to the AN/PVS-14 with the connectors and ribbon cable.

I wonder if this is some type of factory defect? My personal feeling is there is an issue with the BHU.

Thanks for the info and look forward to discussing NiVis in the future.

 

[iraqgunz]

IPSC,

Well it would appear that our problem is similar if not identical in some ways. I turned the unit on to IR and let it set for a while went back after a couple of hours and all of sudden it was working. Switched over to regular mode and it still worked.

IYHO, is this a problem that can be solved by purchasing a new BHU for the unit? It would seem as if most if not all the circuitry and stuff is in there. Thanks.

 

[IPSC_GUY]

IPSC,

Well it would appear that our problem is similar if not identical in some ways. I turned the unit on to IR and let it set for a while went back after a couple of hours and all of sudden it was working. Switched over to regular mode and it still worked.

IYHO, is this a problem that can be solved by purchasing a new BHU for the unit? It would seem as if most if not all the circuitry and stuff is in there. Thanks.

I believe the problem is in the battery pack. In my case, the tubes I tried, when placed into a test fixture running a straight 3 volts with only a switch in the circuit, light instantly.

I do not know if insight will sell on the battery pack and circuit board and I am thinking they will say removing it will void the warranty or compromise the vaunted 66 ft waterproofing?

I have never had anything even close to this with the PVS 14 platform.

On your tubes, could you pull an eyepiece and see what the FSCM (manufacturers code). I suspect they might be Northrup Grumman tubes as ITT are usually silver.

If I find anything out, I have this unit returned for testing) I WILL let you know.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[iraqgunz]

IPSC,

I have been in contact with them and they are getting me quotes for the battery packs. I told them that there is no possibility of sending them back for repair and I would have to accomplish this here in country. The image tubes are definitely not silver and the next time I pop one open I will let you know what find. I have a PVS-14 stateside and have never had an issue like this either. Of course, I think they are better made.

Thanks for the assist and I'll let you know what happens on my end.

I believe the problem is in the battery pack. In my case, the tubes I tried, when placed into a test fixture running a straight 3 volts with only a switch in the circuit, light instantly.

I do not know if insight will sell on the battery pack and circuit board and I am thinking they will say removing it will void the warranty or compromise the vaunted 66 ft waterproofing?

I have never had anything even close to this with the PVS 14 platform.

On your tubes, could you pull an eyepiece and see what the FSCM (manufacturers code). I suspect they might be Northrup Grumman tubes as ITT are usually silver.

If I find anything out, I have this unit returned for testing) I WILL let you know.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[IPSC_GUY]

Cool. If ya need any other help let me know. I am slowly coming to the opinion that the NVM is not all it's cracked up to be.

The lighter weight is only a few ounces.

The smaller size is only fractionally smaller.

The 66 foot waterproof rating seems to be a somewhat moot point. The only people I have known to actually take one down any depth were using one on an ROV to watch a bioluminescent critter in an underwater cave. Eventually they put it in a dedicated waterproof housing anyway.

As for issues with the electronics in the 14 I agree, they are better and more avalible.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[iraqgunz]

IPSC,

I agree that the NVM is not the best thing since Wonder Bread and peanut butter. As for being "waterproof" water resistant is probably more applicable/ important. What concerns me more is the failure of the units, especially since they have not been used all that much. Also, I have seen a tendency for the on/off knobs to come off. They are only held in place by a small circular spring.

Considering that we purchased about 72 of these units had we had a competent purchaser and negotiated then we probably could have gotten real PVS-14's for not much more.

Unfortunately, there are those who don't understand that cheap probably isn't better. Especially if you end up with a 3300.00 dollar piece of crap that fails in the field. Take care.

BTW- I am curious about your thoughts on the AN/PEQ-2A. I know that there are other potentially better units out there, but I have had no luck in purchasing one.

 

[IPSC_GUY]

Sorry for not responding earlier,

IPSC,

I agree that the NVM is not the best thing since Wonder Bread and peanut butter. As for being "waterproof" water resistant is probably more applicable/ important. What concerns me more is the failure of the units, especially since they have not been used all that much. Also, I have seen a tendency for the on/off knobs to come off. They are only held in place by a small circular spring.

The NVM /MUM is supposed to be NO poop Dive-ably water proof to two atmospheres (66 feet). Also the switch is a week point as it is in an odd place and to me it is counter intuitive to operate so if your used to a 14 the MUM seems odd.

Oh and I have owned three of these things, so I am not just making statements.

Considering that we purchased about 72 of these units had we had a competent purchaser and negotiated then we probably could have gotten real PVS-14's for not much more.

I understand the whole purchasing process and not being allowed to go out and BUY anything that is assigned an NSN BUT... there are commercial versions of the PVS 14 that are not the "AN/PVS-14" that exceed mil spec and your unfortunatly right you could have gotten them for a fair amount less being who you are and where you are. Sorry.

Unfortunately, there are those who don't understand that cheap probably isn't better. Especially if you end up with a 3300.00 dollar piece of crap that fails in the field. Take care.

BTW- I am curious about your thoughts on the AN/PEQ-2A. I know that there are other potentially better units out there, but I have had no luck in purchasing one.

As for the PEQ-2... Well they take up a huge amount of real estate on a rail and there are newer better things out there. My former roommate left Force Recon and went to work for one of the "THREE" letter agencies and they use the new PEQ-15. It is smaller, lighter, does more and they all LOVE IT ! ! ! Eventually the 15 will replace the 2 but since there are SOOOO many 2s in the inventory they will be around for a WHILE longer.

Keep your head down over there,

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

 

[iraqgunz]

IPSC,

Thanks for all the info. Do you by chance happen to know where one can purchase a PEQ15? I have seen them and I like them alot. Finding is almost like searching for the Golden Egg.

Sorry for not responding earlier,



The NVM /MUM is supposed to be NO poop Dive-ably water proof to two atmospheres (66 feet). Also the switch is a week point as it is in an odd place and to me it is counter intuitive to operate so if your used to a 14 the MUM seems odd.

Oh and I have owned about three of these things so I am not just making statements.



I understand the whole purchasing process and not being allowed to go out and BUY anything that is assigned an NSN BUT... there are commercial versions of the PVS 14 that are not the "AN/PVS-14" that exceed mil spec and your unfortunatly right you could have gotten them for a fair amount less being who you are and where you are. Sorry.



As for the PEQ-2... Well they take up a huge amount of real estate on a rail and there are newer better things out there. My former roommate left Force Recon and went to work for one of the "THREE" letter agencies and they use the new PEQ-15. It is smaller, lighter, does more and they all LOVE IT ! ! ! Eventually the 15 will replace the 2 but since there are SOOOO many 2s in the inventory they will be around for a WHILE longer.

Keep your head down over there,

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA