Outdoors Fanatic
Flashlight Enthusiast
True, but LED fundamentalists really have no clue.
Smallest 500+ lumen flashlight?
- Thread starter RobertM
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tricker
Enlightened
What about this one...
A Milky SF KL2 3xUSWOH SSC X464.
It churns out 464 lumens (Regulated) for approximately 54minutes on a single 18650 protected rechargeable battery. More pictures below.
Where can I purchase this light?
TITAN1833
Flashlight Enthusiast
Vestureofblood,this is not a production light,first get yourself a SF KL2 then contact milkyspit to have it modded or you might see one for sale,but those are your options.
Many of the above posts did not take note of your asking for 500 torch lumens, or they did not understand what that means. You cannot be sure of torch lumens by using manufacturer's bulb/emitter lumen rating.
Since you did not say anything about run time, then I would say some of the bulbs on this list that would work in a 2s, 2s2p, or 4s Li-Ion Sub-1D Mag. There are others that I have tested in my Destructive Bulb sig link that may also work.
Since you did not say anything about run time, then I would say some of the bulbs on this list that would work in a 2s, 2s2p, or 4s Li-Ion Sub-1D Mag. There are others that I have tested in my Destructive Bulb sig link that may also work.
Good point Lux.
To the OP, it's really hard to know torch lumens because of so many variables such as the reflector type and lens. In a way it kind of like splitting hairs to specify torch lumens as a requirement since some lights will be close but it's difficult to know for sure if it falls slightly above or below 500 torch lumens. The only way to be sure is to overkill it a bit and shoot for an mag11 which can be build on a 2 x AW C cell based maglite, which is fairly compact in size
Fivemega also makes the FM11, ready to go..
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/161540
To the OP, it's really hard to know torch lumens because of so many variables such as the reflector type and lens. In a way it kind of like splitting hairs to specify torch lumens as a requirement since some lights will be close but it's difficult to know for sure if it falls slightly above or below 500 torch lumens. The only way to be sure is to overkill it a bit and shoot for an mag11 which can be build on a 2 x AW C cell based maglite, which is fairly compact in size
Fivemega also makes the FM11, ready to go..
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/161540
mdocod
Flashaholic
It is often forgotten that with LEDs, there is less reflector loss since ALL of the light is being projected on the frontal "plane" so to speak. Incandescent bulbs suffer from increased reflector losses due to light being lost "out the back" and more of the light having to make it's way out by means of reflecting off of the reflector rather than just coming out the front. The general rule of thumb for incans in a reflector is 35% loss, for LEDs it seems that 20% loss is more realistic for most reflector designs, with many designs achieving 90% or better transmission efficiency through the use of optics. Point being, that a "625" emitter lumen LED light is pretty close to a solid 500 torch lumens, whereas a incan needs more like 770 bulb lumens. However, many applications will favor the increased contrast provided by a incan bulb, in which case less lumens may prove to be more useful than a high lumen rated LED light...
When reading the original post here, my interpretation is that if you can think of a pretty small light (pocketable, give or take) that is in that 500 lumen ballpark, it should be listed here and possibly discussed. The way I see it, lumen "requirements" should never be discussed as a specific number, but as a "ballpark." In reality, any light with somewhere between ~350 and ~1000 emitter/bulb lumens can be discussed as being in that 500 lumen "ballpark" because the total output is rarely the most important once you have defined a range, more important is the beam pattern for the intended application, combined with user interface, size, and runtime. In reality, modern "500 lumen" pocket rockets are going to have a floodier beam profile and there is no getting around that until they cram more of those lumens into a single die. So if reaching out and lighting up something at a distance is important, then there is not necessarily any need for that 500 lumen option since it's going to be floody in a small form factor, a "250" lumen single die light would be far more practical (like with a cree R2).
What's amazing is, just a few years ago, the concept of a 2xCR123 size light pushing into this category of illumination was pretty much inconceivable, and now we have a whole LIST of options that are in this ballpark. If things continue at this rate, the concept of multi-thousand lumen flashlights in the EDC-pocketable category will be reality soon.
Anyways, I'll quit my yappin
Eric
When reading the original post here, my interpretation is that if you can think of a pretty small light (pocketable, give or take) that is in that 500 lumen ballpark, it should be listed here and possibly discussed. The way I see it, lumen "requirements" should never be discussed as a specific number, but as a "ballpark." In reality, any light with somewhere between ~350 and ~1000 emitter/bulb lumens can be discussed as being in that 500 lumen "ballpark" because the total output is rarely the most important once you have defined a range, more important is the beam pattern for the intended application, combined with user interface, size, and runtime. In reality, modern "500 lumen" pocket rockets are going to have a floodier beam profile and there is no getting around that until they cram more of those lumens into a single die. So if reaching out and lighting up something at a distance is important, then there is not necessarily any need for that 500 lumen option since it's going to be floody in a small form factor, a "250" lumen single die light would be far more practical (like with a cree R2).
What's amazing is, just a few years ago, the concept of a 2xCR123 size light pushing into this category of illumination was pretty much inconceivable, and now we have a whole LIST of options that are in this ballpark. If things continue at this rate, the concept of multi-thousand lumen flashlights in the EDC-pocketable category will be reality soon.
Anyways, I'll quit my yappin
Eric
whitedoom34
Newly Enlightened
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2006
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sorry tricker, i meant my ROP LOLA. Just a brain fart. Sorry for any confusion!
The sphere measurements I've seen on led lights (see various Arc threads) indicate that the 35% loss is about the same for leds.
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Excellent post explaining why the lumen science can't be specified as an exact figure, but rather a "ballpark" figure. I also took the original post to mean the same thing whether the OP meant it that way or now.
With respect, I also question the validity of these theories as well as the percentages, despite their seemingly logical premises. Since I have been reading more about the various terms used to describe light from various sources, I'm not sure about most of the widely accepted terms, let alone the 65% out the front incan number. I'll just register my objections because the more times information like this gets repeated, the less people stop and question its accuracy. :tinfoil:
mdocod
Flashaholic
I can draw a simple diagram to prove it. but not tonight, i'm going to bed now.
adamlau
Flashlight Enthusiast
Perhaps a P7 off 1x18650. The Dereelight prototype P7 D26, for example.
milkyspit
Flashlight Enthusiast
I recently built a KL4-P7-DD for Yankeefist that ought to reach or exceed 500 torch lumens. It was designed to run on a 17670 cell, so it wants to run in a standard L4 configuration... but the head could also run on a 1x123 body with a single RCR123. I do NOT recommend this, but if the owner were so inclined and is willing to bear both the safety risk and the likelihood that his RCR123 will tank after a handful of chargings, he could indeed run like that for an insanely bright, absurdly small package.
My guess is the torch lumens on 1x17670 are around 600-650 lumens, and torch lumens on a freshly-charged RCR123 are around 500 lumens.
Anyway, the thread is over here.
+1 regarding the sentiments of another poster, that we're on the way toward 1000+ lumen pocket-sized lights in the not-as-distant-as-one-might-have-imagined future... that's one heck of a bump to the performance of a device that was basically stagnant for decades prior to introduction of the high-output white LED. At some point the question will become, how many lumens does one need to accomplish the task at hand?
My guess is the torch lumens on 1x17670 are around 600-650 lumens, and torch lumens on a freshly-charged RCR123 are around 500 lumens.
Anyway, the thread is over here.
+1 regarding the sentiments of another poster, that we're on the way toward 1000+ lumen pocket-sized lights in the not-as-distant-as-one-might-have-imagined future... that's one heck of a bump to the performance of a device that was basically stagnant for decades prior to introduction of the high-output white LED. At some point the question will become, how many lumens does one need to accomplish the task at hand?
Sgt. LED
Flashaholic
For me I'll quit when I can get 16,000 lumens for 8 hours off one 18650 size rechargable cell.
Assuming that was directed at my last post....OK, I can wait.
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+1 regarding the sentiments of another poster, that we're on the way toward 1000+ lumen pocket-sized lights in the not-as-distant-as-one-might-have-imagined future... that's one heck of a bump to the performance of a device that was basically stagnant for decades prior to introduction of the high-output white LED. At some point the question will become, how many lumens does one need to accomplish the task at hand?
Milky, your work, quality, friendship, hospitality, and knowledge is legendary. No question that LED's have made much progress. For me it is more than just asking your final question, which is a good one....but I don't believe that most people properly use or understand the term "lumens."
I do want enough lumens, but I also want the proper color, proper throw, proper focus/hotspot/spill to accomplish the task at hand. I have way too many practical scenarios where the 25 or so LED's I own just do not meet my needs.
tebore
Flashlight Enthusiast
Oh Lux you and your undying love of incans.
Not discounting what you said because it's true. Color and rendering something in it's true form is important. And it's too bad LED's aren't bright enough while achieving all that yet, and bright LEDs' can't do what you said that well.
But one day even you will have to give in when LED's have proper color temp, CRI and put out 500lumen for 1 hour in a pocket light.
And Lux I'm surprised you missed on the whole debate years ago about the 65% transmission factor. Most consumer level lights with your glass lens and aluminum reflector with an aluminum coating is only about 65% efficient. The number can be higher if you go to more exotic materials. I'll see if I can dig up the thread.
Not discounting what you said because it's true. Color and rendering something in it's true form is important. And it's too bad LED's aren't bright enough while achieving all that yet, and bright LEDs' can't do what you said that well.
But one day even you will have to give in when LED's have proper color temp, CRI and put out 500lumen for 1 hour in a pocket light.
And Lux I'm surprised you missed on the whole debate years ago about the 65% transmission factor. Most consumer level lights with your glass lens and aluminum reflector with an aluminum coating is only about 65% efficient. The number can be higher if you go to more exotic materials. I'll see if I can dig up the thread.
