Photon Rex (includes technical data; Rex overcharges its cell!)

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Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

Something weird just happened.
Since the Rex can charge from a source of up to 3V, I set my bench power supply to 2V and connected the leads to fill up the cell after a day of playing with it. Current immediately shot up to more than 800mA, and would have gotten higher if it wasn't that I always keep the supply limited to avoid miswired electronics blowing up.
So I set it to 1.5, and the current got to 750 something. In the three or four seconds that passed before I chickened out, the Rex was peacefully flashing despite the ginormous (relatively speaking) current draw.

I set the supply to 1.2, and it's back to a sane 140mA or so, and charging as I write. Which is still a bit weird though, since the first time I charged it with the bench power supply it was set at 1.3V and the draw started at 80 and ended at 50, and I figure I only used half of the cell's capacity, if that.

Is something wrong with my light? I don't think it's supposed to draw so much current...
 
Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

The issue is that the Rex is a tiny light with big output. If the light is run at a lower output, which is practical for many tasks, it can perform well and run suprisingly long.

If it is run at full output, which is comparable to a large flashlight, the battery simply cannot last long.
 
Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

I considered the Photon Rex... until I saw the runtime graph [here] @ the bottom of the page :green:

18 minutes to 50% on high is pretty decent considering the output and small size.

Are there any runtime graphs of the lower levels?

It definitely was not designed for search and rescue.
 
Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

Has anyone confirmed whether CFR is selling the GS at $19.95 or is it the older DS?
 
Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

Size, output, runtime. Pick two.

Until we manage to put a RTG in something the size of a coin cell, I'm happy with a runtime of 18 minutes on max when the flashlight outputs more light than my NDI does on medium and I can clip it to my keychain.

Besides, you don't have to always run it on full power. Half power is still brighter than a normal Photon, plenty to see where you're going and it'll triple (if not more) runtimes.

It charged correctly, by the way. Maybe it just does an exceptionally gentle charge on the first cycle? Dunno.

I've taken it apart and will post my findings soon.

Has anyone confirmed whether CFR is selling the GS at $19.95 or is it the older DS?
I bought it on gad-zooks. Paid $20 (without shipping), and it's definitely the GS version. Dunno about CFR...
 
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Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

true, most people don't run full power on this thing... here's a review +runtime graph of the photon freedom micro with 1 led.
the point is that these things are direct drive and uses pulse-wave-modulation for lower output levels, so a runtime graph at lower levels will look the same as maximum, just more stretched out over time.
:hahaha:it would be nice if someone can miniaturize a constant-current regulator for coin cell based lights.
 
Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

I have been using one of these on my keychain for about a month now and I am very impressed with it. It is extremely bright for a keychain light!

I didn't realize that it had such a low runtime, but I figured there had to be a reason that it was rechargeable.

The low runtime does not bother me, however. I just charge mine up on a single NiMH AA every few weeks.
 
Re: My curiosity got the better of me: ordered Photon Rex

Taking apart the Rex is easy. Just use a small screwdriver to undo the little clips on the bottom and the two halves come apart. Then slide off the GITD rubber cover, and you get at the guts of the light.


(the picture is clickable for a full-res version)

The LiIon cell is a tabbed LIR2450, rated at 140mAh (I didn't read the rating on the Rex's cell, but every other LIR2450 I can find with a Google search is rated at 140, so the Rex's should be too). Unsoldering one of the tabs from the circuit board allowed me to solder test wires and take measurements.

Draw on full power is 210mA or so from a freshly charged cell, but drops to 180 or so in a short while. I then set it to about the same level of a DX fauxton with fresh cells (judged very scientifically by shining both at a sheet of paper, with the Rex closer as it's more floody), and the draw was approximately 50mA. At minimum power (starting from off; for some reason, the minimum when lowered from full power is brighter) it only draws half a milliamp.
The Rex is a microprocessor-controlled light that is never truly completely off; the good news, however, is that the parasitic draw necessary to keep the microprocessor alive is only 4 microamps, with extremely brief spikes of 15 or so (my meter registers a spike but it's too short for it to accurately report it) every few seconds.

Charge current to the cell is about 90mA when the Rex is connected with the charging doodad to a freshly charged Hybrio NiMH. I imagine the current might change as both cells' charge levels change, but I'm not motivated enough to do a proper graph (and I don't have a computer-connectable meter, anyway).

We already know that full power battery life is about 18 minutes to 50%; this isn't what the numbers suggest, but it probably happens because the LiIon cell is so small. LiIon cells are usually good for a 2C discharge rating, but that's for ones of decent size. My theory is that smaller ones such as LIR2450s start to seriously sweat at 1C, and the ~1.4C discharge current of the Rex at full power beats them pretty seriously.
Lower modes shouldn't tax the cell so much, so we should expect fauxton-level brightness to last about two and a half hours. The lowest low should last more than ten days. If kept off, a fully charged cell would be drained by the parasitic draw in something like three and a half years if my calculations are correct.

Edit: The LiIon cell might not actually have a 140mAh rating; I've searched more extensively, and it would appear more serious (and more expensive) enterprises rate them at 90-100mAh. This probably means the ones I saw before are overrated, as is typical with cheap manufacturers.
If that's the case then the full power load is approximately 2C, or maybe even more, which would make a lot more sense with the full-power runtimes we know. Accordingly, medium power should run for about two hours, and low for 8 days.

I might just unsolder the cell entirely and see if it has a rating; as it is it's hard to read what's printed on it because you need to tilt the board too much, and you risk breaking the wires that connect it to the charging terminals. (end edit)

There is some bad news too, though. The Rex overcharges the cell. After a full charge on a Hybrio NiMH I let the cell rest, then measured cell voltage, and found it to be alarmingly high: 4.26V. While not enough to blow the cell, this is 0.06V over the safe margin, and would shorten its life considerably if allowed to happen at every charge cycle.
Even more alarming is that the charging voltage while the cell charges gets as high as 4.34V! This is very bad for it!
Also, I noticed that when the voltage is so high the Rex starts flashing irregularly. It flashes twice or three times, then stays off for a few flashes, then again flashes a few times, then off, and so on. I'm not sure why it does this.
And yes, I did rule out a bad multimeter by measuring with three of them. They all agreed.

In conclusion: the interface is great, and it puts out an amazing amount of light for the size, but the charging system sucks. I cannot possibly allow the cell to get so drastically overcharged; I'll solder a JST connector to the tabs and I'll charge the cell with my outboard charger, but I'm very disappointed that I can't use the nifty magnet thing to charge it anywhere. Based on these findings, I obviously cannot recommend the Rex to anyone.

Edit: I'm contacting the people at LRI, maybe they can suggest some way of repairing the existing charging system.
 
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Very interesting stuff, Fallingwater. Maybe you should send this data to LRI just to see how they dispute it, as I'm sure they would. I'm certainly not doubting your work or the conclusions. There are some folks that have had their Rex's for a while with no problems and the warranty sounds generous, so it would seem it is not a poor design. Maybe LRI figures people will not bother to send back units that die six months or a year down the road. Or, maybe you got a bum one to start. Impossible to know for sure. You've certainly done more than anyone so far to probe its mysteries. Thanks for your efforts.

I was just about to try a low level run, but I think I'll skip it. Don't want to wait 10 days.

Geoff
 
I just sent a link to that post to the LRI people. Here's the text of the message:

----

I recently bought a Rex; after little use, I opened it and found it severely overcharges its LiIon cell and behaves strangely when charging (irregular blinking). For more information, look at this post I wrote on the CPF board:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2804596&postcount=29

I never charged it with anything higher than 2V, and I've owned for only a few days, so it hasn't seen any very heavy use.

I doubt I'll get a warranty replacement since I opened it and unsoldered a lead in order to conduct current testing, so I'd like to know if this is a known problem/bug and if there's a way to repair it myself.
Thank you.

----

Let's see if they come up with something.

I thought about unsoldering one of the LED leads to determine how much current gets fed to each LED, but I think I'll skip that, because I'm unsure of my ability to reposition the LED correctly when I'm done, and I don't want misaligned LEDs.
 
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I've noticed the irregular blinking, too, but only when I was attempting to top it off using a worn down CR123. The couple times I've charged using a NiMH 1.2v after the light was showing definite dimming the blinking was steady and relatively bright. I might have noticed a blinking change then, but only just before charging stopped.

Thanks for sending that link to LRI. Btw, I like your new avatar. Not as cute as the old one, but it looks just like my dear departed Weston.

Geoff
 
Fallingwater,

Good work with your measurements.

That is one of the things that I really like about this forum; how passionate the members are about their lights.

I have never noticed mine blinking irregularly during charging, but then I do not watch it the whole time. It might not be a bad idea to run it on high for 30 seconds to burn off any excess voltage after charging.

You also meant to type 0.06V over the safe margin.
 
Btw, I like your new avatar. Not as cute as the old one, but it looks just like my dear departed Weston.
Thanks. Her name is Miki, she is my mom's owner :p and looks like she just ate a lemon in that picture. :D

Fallingwater,
Good work with your measurements.
That is one of the things that I really like about this forum; how passionate the members are about their lights.
Heh, I'll take measurements of everything :p I'm that curious...

I have never noticed mine blinking irregularly during charging, but then I do not watch it the whole time. It might not be a bad idea to run it on high for 30 seconds to burn off any excess voltage after charging.
Even if you do that the cell suffers. It shouldn't get overcharged to begin with.
I encourage other Rex users to open up their lights (very easy!) and measure their own cells after a full charge. I hope not, but there's a chance your Rexes are overcharging as well.

You also meant to type 0.06V over the safe margin.
Duh. Of course. Fixed now, thanks.
 
Even if you do that the cell suffers. It shouldn't get overcharged to begin with.
I encourage other Rex users to open up their lights (very easy!) and measure their own cells after a full charge. I hope not, but there's a chance your Rexes are overcharging as well.

Yes, I know how critical the 4.2V limit is.

I don't have a high end meter, but I will charge and check mine and report my voltage here.
 
Just a quick warning. I remember reading an old post where someone opened up their Rex and managed to break a tab or two. Tried to find the post, but gave up. Think I'll pass on checking voltage for now and just hope for the best.

Bryan Avery at Photonlight might also be interested in your data, Fallingwater. He seems to have a hotline to LRI.

Geoff
 
From what I've seen on my own Rex you'd have to be seriously violent to break the tabs. You only need to move them a tiny bit to open the light.
I don't want to force you into doing it, mind you, I'm just saying if the only reason is that you're afraid of breaking the tabs just be gentle and they'll stay in one piece. :)

I'll try sending a message straight to Brett, thanks.
 
The first two times I charged my Rex the cell was significantly drained, and when the charge stopped it just stopped blinking, it didn't blink in bursts. The next times I just topped up the cell, which had probably hardly gotten drained at all.
So I suspected the Rex's charging circuitry might charge correctly if the cell is relatively low on voltage, but overcharge if it's topped off.

So I unsoldered the cell from the Rex and hooked it to my RC charger, which I then set to discharge at 100mA; when it signaled end-of-operation 56 minutes later it reported having sucked 93 mAh out of the cell. Now, my charger is known for never discharging to 0%, instead cutting out at exactly 3 volts no matter the discharge current, so we'll assume it's been gentle with the LIR2450 and it really has a capacity of about 100mAh. This settles the capacity issue.

I then resoldered the cell back to the Rex and let it charge from a Hybrio, measuring charge voltage as it went. I stopped it when it was at 4.26 (and still flashing regularly). Oh well, so much for that theory.
 
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Just drained mine down to the point where it would turn itself off after just a few minutes on low. This time I paid closer attention while charging with a AA NiMH. It took just about 3 hrs. and stopped blinking without me noticing any irregular blink pattern at the end.

Also, noticed some things at the LRI site. Not sure how long it's been there, but they state a 2-4 hr. recharge time with batteries up to 3v. The pic in the recharge instructions PDF section shows yellow charge contacts instead of the white ones on my light. I guess some changes have been made in the newest models. I wonder where else.

Geoff
 
I'm impressed by LRI's warranty department. I explicitly said that I probably wasn't entitled to a warranty replacement due to having opened and tinkered with the light, but they told me to send it in anyway for a free replacement.

This would be great, if it wasn't that I'd have to wait something like two months to get the replacement, and pay for shipping to the US. If the light cost $200 I'd do it, but for $20 I really want to try fixing it myself. I may have an idea for that... it should be testable without disassembling the Rex further than I've already done, so if it fails I can always opt to send it in later. Stay tuned...
 
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