SureFire A2 and Streamlight TT 2L >>>>>

I know that these 2 lights are very similar, but from what I have read the 2L is a bit brighter with its LED, but with the XENON, the A2 is brighter and had better throw. My question is that what makes the A2 so much brighter and have better throw than the 2L. Techincally they both have 3 LED's surrounding a Xenon bulb so the reflector can only do so much for the throw, is the bulb on the A2 more better as in lumens ?? If so how much as I thought they were rated about the same ?? Thanks for any info. God Bless. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

The Twin-Task 2L uses a lower current flow bulb; less brightness, but around 2 1/2 hr. run time.

The Nuwai version uses a higher voltage bulb than the SL.

Another thing to consider is the XenErgy 3 in 1 (also called the Nuwai AL-606).

I like my Twin Task 2Ls just fine but if they were on the shelf next to each other, I'd go for a XenErgy.

Welcome to CPF!

The A2 has a regulated incandescent bulb. This means the bulb is fed just the right juice it is designed to require and therefore the bulb is designed to produce as much and as white light as possible.

An unregulated bulb has to be designed to handle the huge surge of juice from the batteries when the batteries are fresh. This surge is usually over very quickly and so the bulb is then quite a burden to the batteries for the rest of the time which is one of the reasons why they dim and yellow (The A2 does not do this and it has a "soft-start" electronics to protect its bulb).

Technically, the A2's bulb is not better than the TT 2L's bulb because they are designed for different powersupplies and would not work [at all, or well] if it were possible to swap them.
The A2's bulb is tuned to it's regulated powersupply and will likely have a far longer lifespan (I have personally put over 45 sets of SF123As through one of my A2's and the output is still as good as a new lamp).

The A2 and the TT 2L are not as similar as they may at first seem. They both have three LEDs and an incandescent bulb and are powered by two SF123A batteries. That's about it.
They are designed and intended for different applications, and they are designed with different features. The A2 has about the most advanced features of any incandescent flashlight yet released.

But that may not be important to you. Anyway, beams can be different for many reasons. They are the result of the interaction of the bulb and its filament, and the reflector and lens. The shape of the beam (and it's surround beam) is often the result of the reflector diameter and depth, the size of the filament and the type of reflector finish (mirrored or rippled etc).

Being a "task light" with a long runtime I would expect the TT2L's beam to be be quite broad making it useful to for general tasks. I get the impression that people tend to have this light for tool boxes or car glove boxes etc - for general use since it is quite large (perhaps too large for general carry on your person?). It likely does well for the applications it is intended.

The A2 on the otherhand is small and compact (it's bezel is quite narrow in diameter, the A2 has a PocketClip and can be disabled for transport and storage. It's two-stage TailCap switch make its use simple and reliable. You can "LockOut" the incandescent beam if required.

The A2 is called the "Aviator" because there was demand by Aviators for a flashlight that could be used for aircraft inspection and also in the cockpit for reading charts etc. The A2's incandescent beam is therefore designed to produce a beam that can illuminate all parts of an aircraft from the ground so it is quite intense and regulated white. The LEDs need to be quite dim for use in confined cockpits etc. SureFire are also preparing to release to the public a version of the A2 with special yellow-green LEDs for use in cockpits.

The differences between the A2 and the TT2L mean that in my opinion they can not be compared. The A2 has no equal.

If you do not feel you need what the A2 gives you then a better question to ask CPF would be,

"Which shall I get? The Steamlight Twin Task 2L (TT 2L) or the XenErgy 3 in 1 (also called the Nuwai AL-606)."

I hope you enjoy your time here on CPF!

Al

[ QUOTE ]
Size15's said:
Welcome to CPF!

The A2 has a regulated incandescent bulb. This means the bulb is fed just the right juice it is designed to require and therefore the bulb is designed to produce as much and as white light as possible.

An unregulated bulb has to be designed to handle the huge surge of juice from the batteries when the batteries are fresh. This surge is usually over very quickly and so the bulb is then quite a burden to the batteries for the rest of the time which is one of the reasons why they dim and yellow (The A2 does not do this and it has a "soft-start" electronics to protect its bulb).

Technically, the A2's bulb is not better than the TT 2L's bulb because they are designed for different powersupplies and would not work [at all, or well] if it were possible to swap them.
The A2's bulb is tuned to it's regulated powersupply and will likely have a far longer lifespan (I have personally put over 45 sets of SF123As through one of my A2's and the output is still as good as a new lamp).

The A2 and the TT 2L are not as similar as they may at first seem. They both have three LEDs and an incandescent bulb and are powered by two SF123A batteries. That's about it.
They are designed and intended for different applications, and they are designed with different features. The A2 has about the most advanced features of any incandescent flashlight yet released.

But that may not be important to you. Anyway, beams can be different for many reasons. They are the result of the interaction of the bulb and its filament, and the reflector and lens. The shape of the beam (and it's surround beam) is often the result of the reflector diameter and depth, the size of the filament and the type of reflector finish (mirrored or rippled etc).

Being a "task light" with a long runtime I would expect the TT2L's beam to be be quite broad making it useful to for general tasks. I get the impression that people tend to have this light for tool boxes or car glove boxes etc - for general use since it is quite large (perhaps too large for general carry on your person?). It likely does well for the applications it is intended.

The A2 on the otherhand is small and compact (it's bezel is quite narrow in diameter, the A2 has a PocketClip and can be disabled for transport and storage. It's two-stage TailCap switch make its use simple and reliable. You can "LockOut" the incandescent beam if required.

The A2 is called the "Aviator" because there was demand by Aviators for a flashlight that could be used for aircraft inspection and also in the cockpit for reading charts etc. The A2's incandescent beam is therefore designed to produce a beam that can illuminate all parts of an aircraft from the ground so it is quite intense and regulated white. The LEDs need to be quite dim for use in confined cockpits etc. SureFire are also preparing to release to the public a version of the A2 with special yellow-green LEDs for use in cockpits.

The differences between the A2 and the TT2L mean that in my opinion they can not be compared. The A2 has no equal.

If you do not feel you need what the A2 gives you then a better question to ask CPF would be,

"Which shall I get? The Steamlight Twin Task 2L (TT 2L) or the XenErgy 3 in 1 (also called the Nuwai AL-606)."

I hope you enjoy your time here on CPF!

Al

[/ QUOTE ]


Thanks for the welcome and very good info !!!! God Bless !! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

What Al said, especially the part about there being no comparison!

The SL TT 2L is a fine light for it's price and for certain intended uses, but it is just too large to be EDC'd comfortably. It would definitely NOT fit into a normal sized pocket.

On the other hand, I EDC my A2 in my front left pocket almost every waking hour, and sometimes I clip it to my belt.

In my opinion, the A2 is the single finest flashlight made, in the sense that if I had to choose only one light, the A2 would be it, hands down. The A2 is a wonder; a compact, perfectly designed, technologically advanced, very rugged and very useful light.

The A2 truly has no equal, just as Al said.

I'm sure what Al said is right on, as he has run about every SF light known and quite a few yet to be known. The two are about as comparable as a Yugo and a Corvette! You can guess which is which...

But, as a SL TT 2L owner, I can say that it is a very nice light for many uses. In fact, it is about right on for most every utility purpose. I have used it to sneak my way in/out of the dark woods carrying a bow or gun with the LED's only. It has enough light and burn time to track and field dress a deer with the incan, then use the LED's to guide your way out while dragging the deer.

The incan beam is supposed to be focusable, but really I just turned the head to get the beam to it's least objectionable point and have left it there. It ain't the best, but at under $30 it's good enough. The LED's are probably overdriven as they have a blue tint, but they do a nice job lighting up the path in front of you w/o taking your night vision completely away.

The big drawback is the cycle thru on/off function. It is;
on incan- off - on LED - off - on incan (repeat)
If you aren't careful, you will get the incan light when you are expecting the led. Or the other way around. But for ~$30... it's still a good general purpose light. Decent run time on incan and really good time with the LED's.

There are better lights that the TT 2L, and there are worse ones too! That's why we CPF'ers buy them all!

John_Bud

I have owned both lights, the switching on the SL is annoying, and it's beam uneven.
The Aviator was my favorite till I discovered McGizmo's Aleph range.
An even better tint, no globe to blow, custom tuned two stage operation all make the Alephs worth the extra 30% or so!

I own them both, and a 3C TT to boot!

Both are great lights, but the TT's are like a meat cleaver, they cut, but it isn't necessarily pretty!

The A2 is a scalpel, finely crafted, designed for a specific use, but capable of everything that the TT's can do and more.

The TT's get the job done, they are great little lights for the money, and dollar for dollar, probably the best buy out there. If they aren't, I'd like to know what is!

BUT...the A2 is in a class by itself when it comes to mass produced lights. There are only 2 other lights which I think belong in the same class, the VIP and the LiOnHeart.

The Alephs may also be there, but I haven't seen them so reserve judgement.

If someone wants me to evaluate one in comparison, though, I'll be more than happy to do so!!!

Bill

[ QUOTE ]
JDELUNA said:
I know that these 2 lights are very similar, but from what I have read the 2L is a bit brighter with its LED, but with the XENON, the A2 is brighter and had better throw. My question is that what makes the A2 so much brighter and have better throw than the 2L. Techincally they both have 3 LED's surrounding a Xenon bulb so the reflector can only do so much for the throw, is the bulb on the A2 more better as in lumens ?? If so how much as I thought they were rated about the same ?? Thanks for any info. God Bless. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

1st off DELUNA, disclaimer: I frequently disagree with reigning 'so called Hot-wire' guru's, especially what I would call enthusiastic hyperbole from js (of the monster TigerLight mod's fame) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/touche.gif . Sure it's fine for people to get excited about something they like, but you have to understand that their enthusiasm may not translate to anything remotely how you might perceive a light. Personally, I have very bad eyesight, and for whatever reason...want/need more than the puny 50 lumens output of the A2. Sure as Size15's points out, you can harness to a certain extent, the meager output of 50 lumens, and get a weak spot of light to throw a good distance. But a weak spot of light does no good for someone who wants to see clearly at distance. Same could be said for more of a flood at a shorter distance.

Let me link you to some instructive beamshots done by Kiessling to show you just how much beam patterns affect what you can perceive Gargantuan Real Life Shootout - PICS NOW ONLINE

A2's just cost way too much for what they do not do. If they had included a higher outputting lamp assembly, this would be a nice light. I will agree the quality is high, and size is fairly small; but we have other lights here on CPF that are of similar quality and size, that don't cost $180. Does wimpy 50 lumens constant output of light justify the hefty premium of the A2? Not IMHO. Probably good ideal to get yourself an insurance policy to cover loss of these expensive lights.

Still, if you use Li-Ion rechargeable (I hate using throw away batteries, and many CPF members and SureFire itself, are not very environmentally conscious) batteries you can get a nice relatively flat discharge curve where the voltage does not drop as rapidly as other battery chemistries. Since Li-Ion are at 3.7v nominally, an A2 that could use /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif , 2 R123's instead of throw-away CR123's, would be able to run 7.2v bulbs, or better still, 6v bulbs using a higher voltage regulator circuit (this would require additional circuitry for the LED's, but so what; the A2 already costs $180, there is enough profit built into it already).

In a class by itself, by virtue of regulation or high price? Not very impressive class to me, 50 meager lumens. I put a similar regulated circuit into my M*g2D, which has a much larger/longer throwing reflector and very useful beam changing focus/defocus mechanism. The 3.6v bulbs supplied with the Willie Hunt/Skip Langan 8AA-2D regulated adapter are rather disappointing in the yellow light they produce. Constant output, low output yellow light; hardly worthy of any hyperbole from me, sorry /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

So the A2 was supposedly purpose built to light up the outside of a Boeing 747, for inspection purposes? Huh, if my life depends on a quick outside inspection of a jumbo-jet I would prefer someone walk around the plane with a 2000+ lumens outputting, adjustable focus/defocus 35W HID like the X990, slung over their shoulder. 50 lumens of narrow light, does not give me much confidence, sorry /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

You can read my comments, and others ranting of praise on this light in js's A2 thread: Thinking of getting a SF A2. Opinions?

Oh yeah, and another counterpoint on the 'greatness' of engineering (more hyperbole???) in the similar voltage regulation circuit, employed in this light by Surefire engineer Willie Hunt: Regulated 8AA-2D adapter-W.Hunt/S.Langan


Soft start circuit - please explain...
[ QUOTE ]
Doug S said:
BTW, while it seems intuitively obvious that soft starting an incandescent lamp would extend it's life, the actual benefit is negligible. I personally have been involved in spending many $K in R&D on this very issue as well a many $K in patent attorney services. We were surprised to demonstrate that the benefit simply isn't there. BTW, there are many patents issued for apparati to accomplish incandescent lamp soft start.

[/ QUOTE ]

That being said, I'll agree with others; the SL TT2 is just too fat to carry in the pocket.

Can't speak for udaman or his eyes, I'm not an electronics expert nor do I have a degree in Physics or the study of light.

I like the A2 a lot. For my eyes it is nice and bright. I grew up on much cheaper and dimmer lights, so maybe I am easily impressed. I too do not like the price, but it didn't seem to stop me from buying 3 of them. It is perfect for me in spread and brightness around the house and in the car on low. On high I can easily spot a road sign or house number with it, and it does a pretty good job spotting critters in the woods.

It is small and very easy for me to carry, and I love the two stage switch. It takes care on nearly all my flahlight needs and is what I EDC. I carry a SC3 with extra bulb and 4 spare batteries.

If I judge the tenor of udaman's post correctly, I don't think I feel as positive as he does negative, but at this point it is the light for me. With such diverse opinions it might be a good idea for you to get your hands on one before you buy and see where in this 'spectrum' you find yourself.

Both have a 2-stage that goes from a blue-ish led flood to a more yellow incandescent throw.

An L4 with a 2-stage mod will cost about the same as an Aviator, and it will go from a small to a large flood with a more similar tint.

Again everyone I want to thank you for your experiences and opinions on the 2 lights. I got a Streamlight TT 2L the other day form Ebay for les than $30 which is not bad. As manyof you have said, the throw and the brightnes of the light is more of a FLOOD, which is not too bad IMHO, I liked it for the price and also that it has the LED portion. I plan on keeping this one in one of my cars glovebox. Will I ever buy an A2 ?? Probably not, but I say that now and just a few weeks ago I bought my first tactical light which was the Brinkmann Maxfire LX, now I have the Streamlight TT 2L and now a Dorcy 1 watt LED 3-AAA, where will it end ??? LOL !!!! So don't hold it against me if I do end up buying a A2 in the near future !!!! God Bless. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif