New Ra Lights products (Part 6)

[russtang]

So how do you find out about build quality, faults, failure rates etc.? The only information I could find was reviews on forums and discussions on threads? In the UK, you can't go to a superstore and look at a Surefire, Novatac, Nitecore etc. You're stuck with mail order, online reviews and discussion threads. I know from holidays that you can go to Bass Pro and catuallt handle and get a feem for Surefires, so I'd imagine you can do the same for a number of lights in the States if you know where to look. And I know that Novatac etc go to Shot Shows etc., but again, there is nothing like that in the UK. We're just stuck with the good old internet, and when you Google, CPF is where it's at.

CPF is where its at! :twothumbs
you can always find negative threads on a light. You just have to weigh them against the "good" posts, read reviews etc.
I also think that most of the people with positive experiences, don't post them.
I would say 95% of my purchase have been online without inspecting or holding lights in my hand first. I guess I have been lucky most of the time.

In your case, I think the fact that you are an international customer has added costs and problems that a US customer wouldn't have had.
I don't envy international buyers. I wish things were different.

Thanks for the honest statistics! Obviously that 4% can cause quite a ruckus on CPF. 4% might be a bit too high a risk for some and it seems that most RA owners own more than one which increases the odds.

Keep in mind everybody that the 4% is on past units sold. Most if not all of the problems have been addressed so current problem rates should be much lower.

My recollection is closer to 2%, but I didn't go back and do any research, so it is probably better than 4%.

Yes, I agree, when yours is part of the 4%, it is a HUGE percentage.

 

[turbodog]

... I would say that 96%+ of the RA lights have no problems. This is based on the amount of owners that have contacted me with a light that had a "problem". I can only think of 3 Clicky owners that reported a problem. ...

That's good news. I alleviates my concerns somewhat, in that Henry's return rate was much higher than this and that the groundswell of disgruntled customers would sink him.

There are still issues to resolve but hopefully they are being worked on.

 

[Ralls]

Whew! I'm glad this thread has calmed down a bit. In a way I'm sorry that I posted pics of my updated tail cap, as it seems to have added fuel to the fire, but at the same time it seems to have ultimately led to some sense of resolve, as well.

In regards to Henry's earlier post:

I was one of those who had a light with a unique problem and it took a while for my light to get back to me because he ultimately had to update the firmware. It went in with version 1.17 and came back to me with version 1.19. I eventually got my light back and Henry had forgotten to change out the tail cap. Again, it took a while before I got a replacement tail cap, but I assume he was waiting to be finished with the updated tail caps before he sent me a new one - fine with me, as I was one of the first ones with an updated tail cap and I was able to share pictures of it with all of you.

What's my point in sharing all of this? I guess it's that every cloud has a silver lining. While I missed my light, as it's my only light that isn't a headlamp, I was happy to provide a light to Henry with a problem that he hadn't seen before. I guess it was cool to feel like I was part of the process that ultimately lead to the Ra Clicky being a better light. As far as the tail cap is concerned, I would rather have waited longer to get an updated tail cap than get one of the old-style tail caps sooner. Make sense? In one or two of my emails to Henry during the process, I told him that once I got my light back, it wouldn't matter at that point that it had been gone and I feel the same today. I'm satisfied to have a fully-functioning Ra Clicky today - what's in the past is water under the bridge, so to speak.

As stated above, my Ra is the only light that I own that isn't a headlamp. I use it frequently at work to pre and post flight the company aircraft, so it was sorely missed while it was gone, as I had to use one of my somewhat anemic headlamps for back-up duty. I have owned several lights throughout the years and Henry's, IMO, is the best! Any light can be bright enough to light up the exterior of the aircraft, but few can be dim enough for use in the flight deck, once your eyes are night-adapted, as well.

Kudos to Henry for developing a finely engineered tool that is the Ra Clicky!

 

[sappyg]

WOW.... i missed a couple of days and just had a long read.
my personal experience:
started having switch failure on T clicky. e-mailed Ra ON MEMORIAL DAY... response to e-mail ON MEMORIAL DAY from henry.... WTF? why would anyone have the nerve to respond to my question ON MEMORIAL DAY?
my question was and is vallid. henry's response was completely unexpected given the holiday and completely reasonable and fair.
i do not feel slighted in any way that i have had an issue with one of my two clickys. it has come to pass that i have had issues with other lights of note here and the 3rd one was a charm. i like that light a lot.
this thread has always made note of both fault and vertue of Ra. this is a good thing. so far for me the good outweighs the bad. even now, i prefer a clicky above all other lights for daily carry. one small thing went sideways....... ok.... has anyone here never had an issue with car or truck? i dought it. ever had to take off work to get your truck serviced? how many of us have had to take off work to get our clicky serviced? it's a freakin' flashlight!
could it be better than it is? maybe... is it better than most other lights available? i think yes. i would buy another. i would skip over the 140's and start with the 170 though the 120 seems to be plenty for me.

 

[kromeke]

mbassoc2003, I see that your join date is March 2009. Did you read CPF prior to this?

It is a rhetorical question, the answer may or may not be relevant, I ask because if you are a recent reader of this forum, you've missed the complaints regarding Ra with the release dates, the many problems with Surefire U2 tailcaps, the endless wait (for some) for the Arc 6, the excellent reception of the old HDS EDC series, etc. etc. Have you kept up with the Nitecore tube failures? I see Eagletac has problems too, but I don't really follow them because I don't have an interest in their lights. Everybody has problems.

I'll admit, I'm a big fan of Henry's designs. Not as big as some people here, as evidenced from my modest collection. The mere fact that Henry is accessible is taken for granted by a lot of CPFers, in my opinion. Surefire, you hardly hear a peep from a rep, much less a designer/engineer. Novatac, very little representation, and usually of the non-technical variety. Gransee perhaps has overexposed himself here, but Arc has a following.

I have 4 of Henry's designs. The old HDS EDC Basic 42, which had a minor problem with the tailcap, which was replaced promptly (keep in mind I was a late adopter on that light). A Novatac 85P, which was pre-ordered and has been a superb performer. A twisty, which works great, but is seldom used, due to the twisty interface, I prefer a button. A Clicky Prototype, which again, I pre-ordered and was an early adopter on that one. Prior to shipping Clickies, there was a lot of public complaining here on this very forum. Some of you guys are way impatient for what I would consider a small producer of niche flashlights.

He has answered technical questions that I've asked via email, describing certain design elements that I asked because I'm doing mechanical modifications to the light. I had a problem with my Clicky prototype, but I've publicly held my tongue until now, and it is currently away awaiting repair. I had a problem weeks, possibly months ago, but I didn't bother Henry with it because I read about some problems with some of his latest series of lights, and I figure that I'm not in a hurry, because I'm not short by any means of a good EDCable light that I can use until I get my light back from him. But maybe I'm different, and I have no trouble sometimes being patient. To use words like anguish just seems ridiculous to me. I know it is a premium product, but it is still a niche product, most average people would be shocked at the prices some of us pay for some of these lights.

Anyway, good thread overall, some CPFers need to know when to chill in my opinion. I mean, if you can produce a better light, let's see it. (I'm not trying to single anyone out in this last paragraph, just saying) Some people on this forum really produce, and Henry is one of those people. There might be a handful of them represented here at CPF. Then there are a lot of fans, like me, who are very particular about where I spend my money, but I have no illusions that when I preorder a light, it might be a little too much on the cutting edge, and I am aware that problems may escape early on. I've been involved with complex projects. I do machining frequently at my day job. It isn't aways easy to produce a product, much less produce a product that is 100% right all the time.

 

[callmaster]

It's time for anyone with a personal agenda here to take a step back and handle their business privately. When you make things personal, you start to get off track and I hope this never happens again. Henry has always replied to my emails, always answered whatever questions I've had and has always taken the time to remain professional.

Never have I ever received an email which would be considered "Rude" and I don't like when someone goes out of their way because of personal issues to make it seem like it happens. When you have a beef with someone, everything becomes rude, and everything done by that party becomes unacceptable.

 

[oldpal]

I think it is time this particular dispute was now taken off the board. It was legitimate for mbassoc2003 to raise his concerns, and the extended series of posts on the matter might have been shorter and less disruptive to the thread if there had better communication between the parties involved.

HDS has now provided an answer. As a result mbassoc2003 appears to have withdrawn some of his allegations. This particular matter must now be pursued by e-mail or PM, so that the thread can continue.

Thank you very much. I was wondering when a moderator would come to our rescue.

Hugh

 

[gottawearshades]

Many of these posts seem to me should be in the "Jeers" area and not here. Of course it is just my opinion.

Hugh

Exactly.

Let's have some perspective. How many people bought SF L1 Crees when they first came out and had to return them? I went through three before I got one that worked. We know the issues that NovaTacs had. As far as I know, the flicker issue was never fixed.

Whenever Apple releases a new product, the Internet lights up with reports of people who stood in line to be early adopters, and then had to go into therapy because of issues with the new release. Anyone who works in technology will tell you if the product works after it's been serviced it's a good product from a good vendor.

 

[bmstrong]

Anyone have one of the Titanium Bezels offered third party on their Clickies now? Can someone shoot a picture of it? Are these bezels 6/4?

 

[eljuez]

I was hoping Henry would post and I'm glad he did. My own personal experience with my 170 has been flawless and if I can get a 200, I will.

 

[nudel]

Thank You.

CPF moderators make CPF one of the best forums on the net.
I apologize for my disrupting the talk about the lights.

Partly true but you didn`t have to bent over

 

[nudel]

Thanks for the honest statistics! Obviously that 4% can cause quite a ruckus on CPF. 4% might be a bit too high a risk for some and it seems that most RA owners own more than one which increases the odds.

Keep in mind everybody that the 4% is on past units sold. Most if not all of the problems have been addressed so current problem rates should be much lower.

I would say the percentage of "faulty" lights is much higher but most peoples (non flashaholics) who got this light won`t even use the locator flash for example so they won`t even find out it behaves strange. Others especially overseas who do recognise some problems in their light migh not want to send it back because it costs a hole lot of money or because it takes month to come back... if it even comes back. And least but not last Some peoples even on this board said that their lights have the locator flash problerm for example but don`t care enough about it to get it repaired. Sooo what I`m saying is just because few lights come back for warranty doesn`t necessarily say anything about the rate of "faulty" lights going out of the factory.

 

[:)>]

Thank you DM51 for weighing in! I have been consistently frustrated by this thread as each time I see it, it grows super fast and when I look to see what it might contain, I see that it contains the complaints and grievances of mbaassoc2003.

I have a ton of the Clickies and 2 of the Twistys and I have been so satisfied with them that I haven't bought other lights because, for me, other lights don't seem as relevant anymore; this is my experience with these lights and it does not invalidate anyone elses negative experience. I provide it to balance out the overwhelmingly negative direction that this thread has taken... I mean, come on, speculation that he is going out of business! Seriously.

There was a thread on CPF not too terribly long ago that asked what lights have failed the forum members in the past; I did not respond because in truth, the only lights that I could remember failing were a 27LT and an LS27; if it can happen to Don, it can happen to anyone. Don candidly discussed the challenges as Henry has and Don promptly offered to take care of the lights even though they do not come with a warranty. We afford Don a significant degree of good will, which he deserves, but some folks treat Henry completely differently; I guess that it is an unfortunate commentary on how folks are these days. I wish this was not the case but it seems to be.

One thing that should be said, is that Henry has conducted himself in a very honorable manner on CPF and in business. He honors his agreements, he speaks plainly and candidly, he supports his products (past and present) and he holds himself and his company to a very high professional and ethical standard. I trust him an awful lot and I have been very grateful to have gotten to know him. Folks on this board should bear in mind that he is a Flashaholic too and give him the opportunity to participate on CPF without all the nonsense that has been going on.

mbaassoc2003, I have no desire go back and forth with you in this thread but will be happy to address your thoughts on my post via PM or email if you would like; I am hopeful that you will practice restraint and take me up on my offer to converse privately.

 

[tsl]

One thing that should be said, is that Henry has conducted himself in a very honorable manner on CPF and in business. He honors his agreements, he speaks plainly and candidly, he supports his products (past and present) and he holds himself and his company to a very high professional and ethical standard. I trust him an awful lot and I have been very grateful to have gotten to know him. Folks on this board should bear in mind that he is a Flashaholic too and give him the opportunity to participate on CPF without all the nonsense that has been going on.

Goatee, I completely agree with you on this. I have two Clicky Prototypes. During my email correspondence with Henry over the several month wait to get # 1, Henry quickly answered all questions. He did the same with a couple questions about # 2. I think you can get a sense of a person from their words and actions, and Henry in my book is top notch.

 

[callmaster]

he supports his products (past and present) and he holds himself and his company to a very high professional and ethical standard. I trust him an awful lot and I have been very grateful to have gotten to know him.

That's a solid statement right there. I feel the same

 

[fairway1]

Let me add my own experience. I have 5 clickys and 2 twistys right now. My latest clicky that I picked up last week is a 120 EDCE. When I got it I quickly found out that the tail cap was malfunctioning. I sent Henry an email on 5/26, he quickly responded saying he would sent a replacement.

I took a tailcap off of one of my other clickys to play with this new one, and I thought it was exhibiting some odd behavior. I emailed Henry about it and he quickly responded with some questions. A few emails back and forth and realized it was just me, there was nothing wrong with the light.

Today 5/30, my replacement tail cap showed up in the mail. I was rather pleased at the quick service. I am very happy with Henry and Ra lights.

 

[:)>]

I am pretty sure that there will be some new products to talk about in this thread in the coming months:thumbsup:

mbassoc2003, thank you for the PM; I will drop you a line in a bit.

 

[sappyg]

woohoo.... my replacement T switch showed up today. right out of the bag you could see the Ra quality. the difference is between the new and the origional is perfect anno. not one single missing spec that i can see. i could be mistaken but the replacement might be just slightly stiffer.
thanks henry for taking care if this so quickly for me. it's actually better than the origional. :thumbsup:

 

[sappyg]

I am pretty sure that there will be some new products to talk about in this thread in the coming months:thumbsup:

no fair... you can't just come in here and make a statement like that w/o at least a hint.

 

[mbassoc2003]

the difference is between the new and the origional is perfect anno. not one single missing spec that i can see. it's actually better than the origional. :thumbsup:

Now that's good news.
I wonder if the anodizing issue on the old model had anything to do with having to press the two components together? Neither of mine had anodizing flakes in the body, just the tail cap. A tailcap with perfect anodizing would really finish off the package. Is it a raised or a flush button?