A "copy" ???

[jch79]

I really think the name-calling is going too far. People here seem to have a mental image of a bunch of fat cigar-smoking businessmen sitting around a conference table and having a good laugh at their tricky theft of Dave's design. Keep in mind that somewhere in China there is a machinist who spends his days figuring out how to program CNC lathes to make complex shapes like this, who is probably justifiably proud of his skill, and now he's being told that the past several months of his work will end up getting sold at a discount in some Third-World country with loose copyright laws, in an attempt to cut the company's losses.

Ok, I'll clarify my name-calling: I wasn't referring to the workers who made this or the employees of the store(s) who are selling this. I'm referring to the people who make the decisions to make and sell these.

Swiping Dave's design was a bad business decision. Don't make it personal.

You call it "a bad business decision", I call it stealing, and it's downright awful, as are the ethics (or lack thereof) of the people (or businesses, if you don't want to make it personal) who decided to do so.

 

[fyrstormer]

It was a bad business decision *because* it was stealing, so we do agree on the ethics of the situation.

 

[badtziscool]

I honestly can't think of a realistic use-case for a setup like that, especially on a light where the difference between low and high is how far you twist the knob, which takes a split-second regardless of which setting you're aiming for. When I used my Tri-V outdoors, I'd hold it "laying down" in my hand with my thumb resting on the knob, and if I wanted to instantly jump to the spotlight setting, I'd flip the light upside-down in my hand, rolling the knob along my thumb along the way; doing that, I could get to the highest setting so fast the other emitters didn't have time to turn on. A similar approach would work for "tactical use" with an infinitely-adjustable knob.

Honestly, if the SPY were available with an infinitely-adjustable knob as an option, I'd gladly forgo the programmable driver in exchange. As I said before, I never used that feature once in two years.

That's very true. I just wanted to say that part of the appeal of the Spy is the programmablity, whereas Niteye's rotary function wouldn't allow for it. You might not need the programmability part, but the fact that it's available can be appreciated. Of course, that type of discussion could get really lengthy. Just like whether titanium is really worth the price.

 

[scout24]

Not worth my time to have it fall on deaf, arrogant ears. Here, and Don's subforum, used to be the safe havens on CPF. First there, now here, not so much... :shakehead

 

[dudemar]

That's very true. I just wanted to say that part of the appeal of the Spy is the programmablity, whereas Niteye's rotary function wouldn't allow for it. You might not need the programmability part, but the fact that it's available can be appreciated. Of course, that type of discussion could get really lengthy. Just like whether titanium is really worth the price.

I guess it's personal preference. The STFu board is a marvel of technology.

Not worth my time to have it fall on deaf, arrogant ears. Here, and Don's subforum, used to be the safe havens on CPF. First there, now here, not so much... :shakehead

Agreed.

 

[nbp]

Not worth my time to have it fall on deaf, arrogant ears. Here, and Don's subforum, used to be the safe havens on CPF. First there, now here, not so much... :shakehead

What do you mean by that?

 

[Phil Ament]

What do you mean by that?

Yeah I was just thinking exactly the same thing too, as it sure appears to require some further clarification by the poster!




P.S. I am also truly hoping that it doesn't really mean what it actually appears to!

 

[scout24]

Gentlemen, PM's incoming deferring to the fact that I'm in Dave's house. If you'd like further clarification after that, I'll let fly here and take the time-out.

Phil Ament- your inbox is full.

 

[Phil Ament]

Gentlemen, PM's incoming deferring to the fact that I'm in Dave's house. If you'd like further clarification after that, I'll let fly here and take the time-out.

Phil Ament- your inbox is full.

Not anymore it isn't. My illustrious supporter subscription had just expired, meaning I was instantly out of PM space, however it has been rectified now!

 

[fyrstormer]

The STFu board is a marvel of technology.

It certainly is. It also happens to be wasted on me. :shrug: It's a necessary component of a complex light like the Tri-V, but for a simpler light like the 007, I'd personally be happy with a simple dimmer switch. (in fact, that's how I thought SPYs worked when I first discovered them.) The ZIP20 offered that. Unfortunately, Niteye didn't see fit to license the design instead of stealing it, and so the ZIP20 will probably never be available for sale in the US. That's not just a loss for Niteye, it's also a loss for Dave (who could've made some nice royalties), and for everyone who might've appreciated the chance to buy a "base model" SPY they could actually afford.

 

[scout24]

Perhaps a seperate thread in LED Flashlights or General Flashlight Discussion extolling the virtues of features and pricing would be a touch more appropriate than here in Dave's subforum?

 

[fyrstormer]

I see no reason why this information shouldn't be available to Dave for his consideration when designing future products. I did own one of his lights, and my feedback is just as valid as anyone else's, even if it doesn't consist entirely of praise. I'm sorry you disagree.

 

[nbp]

Perhaps a seperate thread in LED Flashlights or General Flashlight Discussion extolling the virtues of features and pricing would be a touch more appropriate than here in Dave's subforum?

Indeed. Or even just another thread within this forum, rather than this particular one. It's OT in this thread, and generally in bad taste considering this thread is for the purpose of condemning those who steal original ideas from our craftsmen, not praising them for their efforts. :ironic:

 

[fyrstormer]

If we're actually concerned about going off-topic, then since the product in question has already been pulled from the market due to the condemnation in this thread, the thread has served its purpose and might as well be closed before it 1) goes further off-topic and/or 2) turns (back) into an opportunity for people to chime in with pointless insults that are against CPF policy anyway. Keep in mind, this is not a "Jeers to Niteye" thread.

Alternately, we can discuss relevant topics such as: did the rip-off have any good ideas worth emulating? Did it appeal to a market segment the original couldn't reach? Can Dave leverage his existing reputation to capture the market segment the rip-off was trying to target? Etc. Or, I suppose we can just continue to have a poo-throwing contest, since that seems to be more fun. Or rather, you can, if you want. I've been shot down enough times, and I've lost interest in this thread.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Indeed. Or even just another thread within this forum, rather than this particular one. It's OT in this thread, and generally in bad taste considering this thread is for the purpose of condemning those who steal original ideas from our craftsmen, not praising them for their efforts. :ironic:

As nbp writes, let's keep this topic on track. No argument please re my post, please.

Bill

 

[Drywolf]

then since the product in question has already been pulled from the market due to the condemnation in this thread,

Did they really get pulled or maybe sold out?

 

[nbp]

Fyrstormer: here's a thread on the Zip where you can discuss its merits should you choose to.

 

[dudemar]

It certainly is. It also happens to be wasted on me. :shrug: It's a necessary component of a complex light like the Tri-V, but for a simpler light like the 007, I'd personally be happy with a simple dimmer switch. (in fact, that's how I thought SPYs worked when I first discovered them.) The ZIP20 offered that. Unfortunately, Niteye didn't see fit to license the design instead of stealing it, and so the ZIP20 will probably never be available for sale in the US. That's not just a loss for Niteye, it's also a loss for Dave (who could've made some nice royalties), and for everyone who might've appreciated the chance to buy a "base model" SPY they could actually afford.

I agree with you. I too would like a ramping 007 model, but I think the STFu is just as neat.

 

[mohanjude]

It is interesting to see Sysmax the owners of Jetbeam and Nitecore condemning Niteye and saying they are not related!

 

[Phil Ament]

It is interesting to see Sysmax the owners of Jetbeam and Nitecore condemning Niteye and saying they are not related!

I am not really trying to be either argumentative or stick up for them at all, however just to be completely accurate all that they did actually state in this thread is that they are "not the same company", which to be fair is just a little different than them trying to claim that they are not related to them at all! I am also not trying use semantics to try and cloud the issue at all, as I am trying to tell it just like it is, or at least that is how I see it!