Departments certainly should issue LEO's flashlights that meet the officers' professional needs. When you look at the cost of the uniform, the side arm, the 2-way radio, the handcuffs, the equipment belt, and (where applicable) the police car with all its equipment, skimping on flashlights is silly. A good flashlight might not mean a lithium-powered Surefire--LEO's use their flashlights a lot and rechargeables are probably the order of the day, but some non-waterproof plastic POS just isn't appropriate.
Department issue flashlight?
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PieThatCorner
Enlightened
[ QUOTE ]
dougmccoy said:
...
I believe that the issue and ownership of high end flashlights can be subscribed more to the risks in a potentially deadly force encounter than to the desire to own the best performing light?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes indeed, very much so and well put. From professional experience, I have noted there are departments whose personnel simply do not subscribe to the notion of force on force training, particularly involving lumen aided engagements where your very life will depend on every advantage you can seize to overcome a hostile threat. It is simply ridiculous that some officers are willing to drop six grand on a jet ski, but not willing to spend $70 for a three-cell Z3, or even less for the two-cell flashlight brethren. A single, deadly force encounter in a low-light/no-light situation is all it will take to prove the point. Unfortunately, by that time, the lesson may have been learned too late in the game.
[ QUOTE ]
paulr said:
Departments certainly should issue LEO's flashlights that meet the officers' professional needs. When you look at the cost of the uniform, the side arm, the 2-way radio, the handcuffs, the equipment belt, and (where applicable) the police car with all its equipment, skimping on flashlights is silly. A good flashlight might not mean a lithium-powered Surefire--LEO's use their flashlights a lot and rechargeables are probably the order of the day, but some non-waterproof plastic POS just isn't appropriate.
[/ QUOTE ]
Exactly. That's it in a nutshell.
-Jim
dougmccoy said:
...
I believe that the issue and ownership of high end flashlights can be subscribed more to the risks in a potentially deadly force encounter than to the desire to own the best performing light?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes indeed, very much so and well put. From professional experience, I have noted there are departments whose personnel simply do not subscribe to the notion of force on force training, particularly involving lumen aided engagements where your very life will depend on every advantage you can seize to overcome a hostile threat. It is simply ridiculous that some officers are willing to drop six grand on a jet ski, but not willing to spend $70 for a three-cell Z3, or even less for the two-cell flashlight brethren. A single, deadly force encounter in a low-light/no-light situation is all it will take to prove the point. Unfortunately, by that time, the lesson may have been learned too late in the game.
[ QUOTE ]
paulr said:
Departments certainly should issue LEO's flashlights that meet the officers' professional needs. When you look at the cost of the uniform, the side arm, the 2-way radio, the handcuffs, the equipment belt, and (where applicable) the police car with all its equipment, skimping on flashlights is silly. A good flashlight might not mean a lithium-powered Surefire--LEO's use their flashlights a lot and rechargeables are probably the order of the day, but some non-waterproof plastic POS just isn't appropriate.
[/ QUOTE ]
Exactly. That's it in a nutshell.
-Jim
Size15's
Flashaholic
The percentage of "normal police" issued with either a SureFire WeaponLight or TacticalLight is far less than the percentage of "SWAT" (etc) issued with either WeaponLights or TacticalLights.
When the number and diversity of "LEO" (etc) in the USA there are bound to be exceptions to my broad-sweeping comments.
With regards to UK Police - I think we have a whole different approach to policing due to significant cultural differences. That said, I think the ability to use light to their advantage in a lowlight/nolight situation should be one of any Police Officers skills.
Al
When the number and diversity of "LEO" (etc) in the USA there are bound to be exceptions to my broad-sweeping comments.
With regards to UK Police - I think we have a whole different approach to policing due to significant cultural differences. That said, I think the ability to use light to their advantage in a lowlight/nolight situation should be one of any Police Officers skills.
Al
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PieThatCorner
Enlightened
[ QUOTE ]
The percentage of "normal police" issued with either a SureFire WeaponLight or TacticalLight is far less than the percentage of "SWAT" (etc) issued with either WeaponLights or TacticalLights. ...
[/ QUOTE ]
Admittedly, and sadly, this is true as well -- as I mentioned, some agencies hold a completely different philosophy to the possession and use of this type of equipment. Since the late 1980's, the Fraternal Order of Police and the California Peace Officers Association have continually fought for and documented this as a budget, as well as a training issue that is seen as a high-end shortcoming (sorry for the oxymoron) in officer safety practices from one agency to another. For various entities, the haves and needs rest with the units that have a critical requirement for such equipment (i.e. Special Weapons And Tactics, Special Response Teams, etc). It's a difficult argument to accept, but it reflects the truth when speaking of a budgetary item.
It's obvious this has been somewhat of a crusade on my behalf to educate and encourage the use of proper equipment amongst all of my colleagues. I'm not unique in this standing as I have been more of a follower in this endeavor. I unfortunately do not possess the time, skill, and true expertise to pursue this as well as the likes of Ken Good, Don Weber, Bill Murphy, to name a few.
-Jim
The percentage of "normal police" issued with either a SureFire WeaponLight or TacticalLight is far less than the percentage of "SWAT" (etc) issued with either WeaponLights or TacticalLights. ...
[/ QUOTE ]
Admittedly, and sadly, this is true as well -- as I mentioned, some agencies hold a completely different philosophy to the possession and use of this type of equipment. Since the late 1980's, the Fraternal Order of Police and the California Peace Officers Association have continually fought for and documented this as a budget, as well as a training issue that is seen as a high-end shortcoming (sorry for the oxymoron) in officer safety practices from one agency to another. For various entities, the haves and needs rest with the units that have a critical requirement for such equipment (i.e. Special Weapons And Tactics, Special Response Teams, etc). It's a difficult argument to accept, but it reflects the truth when speaking of a budgetary item.
It's obvious this has been somewhat of a crusade on my behalf to educate and encourage the use of proper equipment amongst all of my colleagues. I'm not unique in this standing as I have been more of a follower in this endeavor. I unfortunately do not possess the time, skill, and true expertise to pursue this as well as the likes of Ken Good, Don Weber, Bill Murphy, to name a few.
-Jim
Size15's
Flashaholic
I'm not basing my comments on statistics - only from what I have seen and heard from various sources.
I am not qualified to develop my thoughts on policing - I have not researched the matter.
Al
I am not qualified to develop my thoughts on policing - I have not researched the matter.
Al
Seppo_Vesala
Newly Enlightened
[ QUOTE ]
shiftd said:
LEO = COPs = Police
Right? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif
If yes, why people prefer to be called LEO
[/ QUOTE ]
"LEO" sounds more "official" and professional than "cop".
LEO - cop
vehicle - car
apprehend a suspect - arrest a criminal
and so on... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
shiftd said:
LEO = COPs = Police
Right? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif
If yes, why people prefer to be called LEO
[/ QUOTE ]
"LEO" sounds more "official" and professional than "cop".
LEO - cop
vehicle - car
apprehend a suspect - arrest a criminal
and so on... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
sotto
Flashlight Enthusiast
I check out the duty belts of any officer I see around here (LA) and most seem to have SL Stingers, although I did see a tiny female officer who also had an SL-20 sticking out of her front pants pocket. I asked her about it and she said she didn't use it for light! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/naughty.gif
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