Fenix use on Glock

[thiswayup]

One thing's for sure, my Surefires work; even if covered in mud. And here's some proof about how well a Fenix light would work, after encountering some dirt....

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/176954

Nonsense.

An isolated, selectively quoted product failure doesn't prove anything other than that a product isn't literally perfect. Applying this standard to Surefires would suggest that they are junk - look at all the posts about L1's that have have failed without being exposed to anything like this.

More, if one reads the thread:

I found out later the contact points were dirty and needed some wipe off my shirt. Got the lights back on but no more attention from my fellow cavers.

Hmmm. Cheap light, poorly maintained, fixed with a shirt-wipe vs expensive light, treated like gold, has to go back to factory. I know which I'd find more annoying - and likely to be fatal if pot holing, as that poster was.

In fact, do Surefire even quote a protection level against dirt and water ingress? Fenix do - and it's a very high one.

 

[NA8]

I've got a little L1Tv2 and didn't have any problem opening doors with it in my hand. YMMV.

 

[DanielG]

This point I'll stand pretty firm on. And in fact the law requires retreat before use of deadly force if possible. And from distances beyond "realistic self defense distances", it's the better choice anyway. In a life or death situation, 20 yards with a handgun is out of range for most shooters. Flight rather than fight is usually the ticket at such a distance (or greater). And it would be an unusual instance in which at such a distance it isn't possible to at least find some kind of cover if a clean getaway isn't possible.....at least that's my impression...from both training and observation

Your fact of law is wrong if you're in FL. You do not have to retreat if you're in any place you have the legal right to be.

That said, I've still got to mount my Fenix P3D on a shotgun to see if it can handle the recoil. I much prefer the flashlight in the other hand. You can shine it in places without pointing a firearm at what you're looking at.

For a handgun, I agree with the ones saying get a dedicated weapon's light. There are clamps and whatnot, but the ones whose whole mission in life is to be mounted on a pistol are the best bet there.

 

[Monocrom]

Nonsense......

Oh! Hello again.

Normally, this is the part where I would post a detailed response to another CPFer who disagreed with the points I brought up..... However, judging by your behavior in the other thread, (especially the part where you were oh so quick to label me a racist; based on no evidence at all) it is quite clear that you are nothing more than a troll, trying desperately to start up a flame war. Your use of the word "nonsense" when you sometimes begin a response, is further proof of trolling.

Sorry, but I shall not be assisting you in your endeavors. Feel free to look for another CPFer willing to play your games. I doubt you will have much success in convincing another Regular to play, but I'm confident you'll try anyway.

Some forums enjoy a good flame war. CPF isn't one of them. Good day, Sir.

 

[Delij]

Your fact of law is wrong if you're in FL. You do not have to retreat if you're in any place you have the legal right to be.

.

yes, I stand corrected. The 'castle doctrine' has recently been expanded to include 'any place you have a legal right to be" - as opposed to the previous limits of home or place of business. Too new a rule to be part of my thinking.

But just because you now have a right to stand your ground without a civil suit, this does not mean that you have a right to stand your ground just because you'd rather fight than leave. At least that's how i understand the change in the law....it applies to civil liability. The criminal determinations of a justifiable use of deadly force remains (I believe) the same. Even in your home you are not justfied to shoot an intruder just because they broke into your home. A reasonable expectation of the need for using deadly force still exists. I don't know if Colorado still has their 'make my day' law, but Florida has no such thing. You cannot just shoot someone who illegally enters your home unless they present a reasonable threat. A drunk from next door gets his house confused with yours and walks into your (unlocked) house by mistake.....you don't want to be shooting the guy.

patriot....

i thank you for our discussion...very interesting and thought provoking. Too bad we did hijack the thread. But as I said and as I think we both would agree, maybe - hopefully - we got out some perspectives for both ourselves and others that transcended the importance of whether a Fenix light is appropriate to be modified (duct taped? lol)to a handgun. (I'd bet the ranch that Fenix's legal dept. would tell anyone NOT to attempt to use their lights for such a purpose).

it's always productive IMO to put forth and discuss even the most unlikely scenarios when it comes to self defense. Because as you said....no matter what the statistics are, anything at all is possible. Expect the unexpected.

And i appreciate your views on that....i know i should consider more unlikely scenarios, but i guess i mostly don't because i feel that there's a level at which being armed and prepared begins to interfere with normal life. So I carry an 8 round little .32 caliber kel tec rather than a 14 round .45 just for the sake of comfort and convenience. It may cost me my life, but as they say, anything is better than nothing. And I'll prefer to go by the statistics again -which say most incidents happen within a few feet.... and here a little .32 stuck in someone's nostril will be effective enough. Sights? I don't need no stinkin' sights! LOL

Seriously......you made some great points and i appreciate the time you took to express them.

peace,
D.

 

[DanielG]

Even in your home you are not justfied to shoot an intruder just because they broke into your home. A reasonable expectation of the need for using deadly force still exists.

Yes, you are justified per law:
http://law.justia.com/florida/codes/TitleXLVI/ch0776.html
776.013 Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.--

(1) A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

(a) The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that person's will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and

(b) The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.
______________________________

Is it a good idea? Probably not, but if someone's in your house, they're fair game. You're also immune to lawsuit for it.

Still, this is about flashlight, so I'm holding to the way I know how to do it, flashlight in one hand, gun in the other. It's worked for me for about 20 years. I'll let others train and get good with gun lights, but I still don't feel right having to point a firearm at something just to see what it is.

 

[Monocrom]

So basically you are saying you pulled your conclusion out of thin air, based solely on your personal opinion.

Not at all.

My comments are based on experience, the experiences of others, (with regard to Fenix quality) and three clear facts:

1. Fenix makes no dedicated weapon lights.

2. Fenix makes no adapters to convert any existing model into a weapon light.

3. Fenix does not advocate any of their lights be used as weapon lights.

However, I think DanielG has the right idea. I will be getting a P3D soon. It would be no trouble for me to go to the range, rent a 6-inch barreled .357 Magnum; and test how the light will perform.

I'll be using plenty of tape to attach the light to the underlug since, realistically, there's no other way to do so.

 

[thiswayup]

Oh! Hello again.

Normally, this is the part where I would post a detailed response to another CPFer who disagreed with the points I brought up..... However, judging by your behavior in the other thread, (especially the part where you were oh so quick to label me a racist; based on no evidence at all)

Really? I can't remember that. I can remember laughing at your claim that your expertise on self defense outweighed that of the FBI, LAPD, NYPD, and even the NRA (who had actually applauded the book whose statistics you disagreed with). May be you said something else that was racist - I really don't make an effort to remember your posts.

it is quite clear that you are nothing more than a troll,

Mono- if you believe that you condemn an entire brand of flashlight (and remember: some people here make part of their living here selling those lights) on the grounds that one failed, once (without mentioning the fact it was poorly maintained, and fixed in seconds) while ignoring that the brand you are promoting has had lights that have failed out of the box (which might not mean anything, because we don't what percentage) then yes, you are speaking nonsense. Let's count the ways:

1. Selectively sampling - you've made no attempt to control for the number of lights.

2. Unfair comparison - Fenix failures are significant, SF are ignored.

3. Significant omission - failure to mention that poor maintenance was the cause, and the problem was fixed in seconds by the user.

There are probably more. This isn't a difference in opinion - e.g. SF better than Fenix - but an utter failure of basic logic on your part. The word for that (the polite word) is nonsense - i.e. literally, no-sense.

Finally, there is a big difference between criticizing what a poster says, and criticizing the poster.[/i] Note that I criticized your words - they were, as I've itemed
multiply ridiculous - that's very different to resorting to personal abuse as you have.

Some forums enjoy a good flame war. CPF isn't one of them. Good day, Sir.

Nice attempt to take the high road, while putting misinformation on the forum that boosts your ego and may hurt other posters businesses.

 

[DanielG]

However, I think DanielG has the right idea. I will be getting a P3D soon. It would be no trouble for me to go to the range, rent a 6-inch barreled .357 Magnum; and test how the light will perform.

I'll be using plenty of tape to attach the light to the underlug since, realistically, there's no other way to do so.

ACKKK! NOOOOO

There are some clamps that will hold it onto the trigger guard. I wouldn't go for more than a few cylinders before checking it's tight again.

http://www.tickbitesupply.com/tac.html

My way is to keep it in your offhand, personally :thumbsup:

 

[Vinnyp]

Just curious, how many of you saying fenix won't work have actually tried it and found it to be lacking, instead just repeating what the previous guy said?

No idea if the fenix will work but to say it's not "rugged" enough is a non issue. We used to use incan Surefires like everyone else until recently. No matter how tough the unit and mount the bulb unit is no way as reliable as the least reliable LED so ruggedness is never going to be an issue after that. If the shock on the light is not enough to break an incan then forget it causing any isses for a Fenix or whatever, remember whatever "shock" they have to withstand is the same shock your hand takes, ie not very much in a glock.

However an L2T is way to big for a handgun mount and very tricky to operate I'd imagine. The Streamlights are very good, but, if you don't want a laser, the SF X300 is very nice indeed.

 

[WadeF]

+1

I don't think ruggedness is the issue with Fenix lights being used as a mounted weapon light, but ergonomics, UI, etc, maybe.

Weapon mounted lights up until recently were motly incan, so they had to be built to prevent the shock of the recoil from damaging the bulb. LED's don't have this issue and are much more shock resistant than any incan.

I've dropped my Fenix P2D onto a hard tile floor with no ill effects. I keep my Fenix's well maintained, cleaned, properly lubed, etc, so I don't expect water, mud, or dirt to be an issue.

 

[Patriot]

Delij

i thank you for our discussion...very interesting and thought provoking. Too bad we did hijack the thread. But as I said and as I think we both would agree, maybe - hopefully - we got out some perspectives for both ourselves and others that transcended the importance of whether a Fenix light is appropriate to be modified (duct taped? lol)to a handgun. (I'd bet the ranch that Fenix's legal dept. would tell anyone NOT to attempt to use their lights for such a purpose).

it's always productive IMO to put forth and discuss even the most unlikely scenarios when it comes to self defense. Because as you said....no matter what the statistics are, anything at all is possible. Expect the unexpected.

And i appreciate your views on that....i know i should consider more unlikely scenarios, but i guess i mostly don't because i feel that there's a level at which being armed and prepared begins to interfere with normal life. So I carry an 8 round little .32 caliber kel tec rather than a 14 round .45 just for the sake of comfort and convenience. It may cost me my life, but as they say, anything is better than nothing. And I'll prefer to go by the statistics again -which say most incidents happen within a few feet.... and here a little .32 stuck in someone's nostril will be effective enough. Sights? I don't need no stinkin' sights! LOL

Seriously......you made some great points and i appreciate the time you took to express them.

peace,
D.

I enjoyed the discussion also And btw, I also carry a green framed, black slide, Keltec .32 in my back pocket while mountain biking in the desert, along with a large folder. I'm with you...way better than nothing as you say. Anything bigger wouldn't be practical for that activity. Thanks for sharing some great opinions and your time. In the end, the thread still turned out ok despite us...lol

Later