"Flashlight Etiquette" for Cyclists

[rockhopper]

Over here (the Netherlands) where bikes are more numerous than cars I dont get blinded by bikes much (if at all). I'm far more annoyed by the cyclists I dont see especially with aforementioned dark clothing. I use a dynamo-fed Philips Saferide 60 (though maybe it's a 40 after repairs, it seems less bright than my first copy) myself and the superb rear light: Philips Lumiring. Since it's my thirds copy of the front light I'm actually looking for replacements but I see these big numbers (lumen-wise) on the likes of Fenix BT20/10 with dual beam and what-not, and I can't help but wonder how blinded people will get. I know you have to properly aim your headlight but there's so little info about the products. All the shops only promote the big numbers and seem to mostly disregard issues like "will it blind others?" "will you loose your night vision?". It's interesting to see that I'm not alone in this.

 

[zespectre]

Subwoofer, looks like you were confronted with a typical exemplary of reckless, road rage-stricken, overreacting idiot, and that kind is abound these days.
Tam

Either that or a case of distracted driving. I can't tell you how many delivery trucks I've watched run off the road onto the shoulder and then jerk back onto the road because the driver was texting, or on the phone (to dispatch or the customer?) or fooling with the GPS or reading their routing sheet or whatever. Still, regardless of the cause I'm glad Subwoofer is okay!

Anyway, back on the topic, I think I've found the insane light that Mr. Inconsiderate has been using which is a Niterider Pro 3000. If that isn't the light then it is very similar. According to the specs it does have multiple light levels. Now if I could just get this guy to use them <sigh>.
[h=1][/h]

 

[RI Chevy]

I am a cyclist. I obey and abide by the same traffic laws that a motor vehicle obeys. I stop for red lights and stop signs, use hand signals, etc. I also make sure that my lights on my bicycle do not blind oncoming vehicles. It comes down to common courtesy. Simple as that.

 

[Etsu]

Subwoofer, looks like you were confronted with a typical exemplary of reckless, road rage-stricken, overreacting idiot, and that kind is abound these days.

Yes, there are plenty of drivers that simply hate cyclists on the road. I doubt it had anything to do with the light. He just hates cyclists, and will do anything he can to scare them off the road. Night provides a good, cowardly way for drivers to take shots at cyclists. Little other traffic to ID him, and license plate obscured by headlights.

I'm less concerned about angry sociopaths that carry guns, than I am about angry sociopaths that own a car.

 

[RCS1300]

Reality versus perception.

I ride pre-dawn for several hours 4x/week. Here is my take.

Overall, very good idea. First, find out what the collective local laws say about light beam strength for cars. Use that as a guide in making suggestions for cyclists. Also, regular car light beams are slightly pointed down and to the right. That should be the second suggestion.

Edit add: The laws seem to talk about ensuring the head lights are aimed in such a way that they never directly hit the windshield of an oncoming vehicle. I found nothing regarding maximum brightness limits.

Now, my rant. There are many drivers that believe that only children should be riding bicycles on the sidewalks. They believe that grown adults should not be riding bicycles and should not be riding in the streets where cars belong. I have come across some of these individuals in my 30 years of cycling over 150,000 miles. You will never appease these individuals as they believe that cyclists should not be on their streets and, of course, not be using lights that may impact their driving.

 

[LGT]

I've seen some bright lights on cyclists, but I find them no more intrusive then the xenon lights on more and more vehicles. A simple solution is to not stare at them. Keep your vision slightly to the right as you should do with a vehicle coming towards you with high beams on.

 

[PCC]

Lights that "aren't expectable" is what I try for.


I've ridden at night for half a century, including police bike patrol. I also ride a horse at night, the concepts are similar, to me.


Motorists, particularly in the city, see a gazillion points of light while they're driving down the street, texting, yacking on the cellphone, changing the DVD for their kids in the back seat and all that other distracting stuff. Out of their direct or peripheral vision they see porch lights, lawn and garden lights, street lights, business sign lights, other cars head/tail/side marker lights. Motorists EXPECT to see red lights in front of them going the same direction and they EXPECT to see white lights in front of them going the opposite direction. If they're in the far RIGHT lane, they don't expect to see any vehicles on their right. A tiny light (my bike) on their right doesn't register as something to look out for. It registers as "oh someone's mailbox reflector" or whatever. It doesn't register as something moving.


So...I try and make my lighting something that their subconscious and distracted motorist brain will see and say "Hey, this isn't a car or a porch light, pay just a little more attention to it".


With that in mind, I use lights that MOVE. Ever see a policeman several blocks ahead waving his flashlight from side to side? That grabs your attention a lot more than if that light were sitting still, regardless of color or brightness. So on my bike I have 1 constant white facing front to illuminate, one constant red rear to satisfy the ordinances, then I have a velcro strap on leg light with low output white front/red rear. It goes on my LEFT (traffic side) calf. As I pedal, it moves up and down...it's UNEXPECTABLE.


One big problem with any kind of bike light, especially like mine mounted low on my leg, is that it is likely to be out of the field of vision for lots of drivers. With a horse, it's not a factor. Lights on my calf are ABOVE or at least LEVEL WITH the windshield of nearly every vehicle. On my cop bike I had tiny red LED clusters on the rear of my helmet. Drivers could see those. They'd never blind anyone. I never wore one but I always thought a white headlight would be a great thing. It allows you to flash a light in the direction of pending danger.


Ride like NO motorist sees you. Never demand the right to share "their" asphalt. You'll lose. Bikes are NOT a danger to cars. We're not telling motorists to look out for THEIR safety. We're asking them to give up a little space for OUR safety.




Sgt Lumpy

Though I haven't ridden after dark in years, here's my take:

Up front, I have two headlights mounted on the bars pointed down the road about 30 feet, the drive side light is a blinker since people see a blinking white light and should think "cyclist". On my helmet, mounted on my right side, is a 150-ish lumen light with a tight beam used for identifying obstacles in the road or to aim at drivers that need to know that I don't want to meet them by accident. I am, however, extremely careful where I point it, trying very hard not to blind anyone accidentally.

On the back I run both a steady and a blinking red tail light. Again, the blinking rear light should identify me as a cyclist. Also, the steady light makes it easy to judge your distance from me and the blinkie gets your attention. In addition to this I've placed highly reflective tape on my rims, hubs, pedals, crank arms, etc, to provide that movement that gets people's attention. Worked really well for me.

Personally, I'm more irritated by ninja cyclists with no lights and dark clothing as I seem to come across them more often than people with excessively bright lights.

I almost had a head-on collision once with a bike ninja riding on what he would consider to be his left shoulder (against traffic) while I was on the right shoulder (with traffic). I'm pretty sure I blinded him when I put my headlamp on his face when I realized that he was there (about 5 feet away and closing, in the fog, riding uphill).

 

[Mr Floppy]

Outlining the rider and bicycle with that neon glow stuff would look kind of goofy but might be the ideal kind of approach. It's probably a little too pimp for most serious riders. But we can move toward the same effect by using a couple of lights to "outline" our general shape. Helmet, calf and bike seat/rack tail would do a pretty good job of that from the rear. Rear is the most dangerous side for a bike.

As a driver, I really appreciate the neon vests. Even highly reflective vests are good.

 

[neonnoun]

As a bicyclist, I do use plenty of reflective stuff. That said, it's always the car turning onto the street (ie cross traffic) I'm coming down that cause most of my near misses. Since I'm moving straight across their path and their lights are aren't focused on me, the reflective materials don't do me (or them) any good until it's way too late.

That's why the front headlights are absolutely critical for my safety. I run one h600 on the bars focused down on the street about 15 feet in front. I also use a similar helmet mounted light (more throw than flood) focused out about 20-30 feet, depending on my speed.

With the focusing of the lights, there is no way I'm brighter or more blinding than the headlights of the cars shining into my eyes. When on the road with cars, that will remain one measure of if my lighting is "too much". However, I will continue to weigh that against when my lighting is "too little" which I measure as when cars still don't see me, which still happens. Frankly, I'm lucky to be alive following one near miss. When I do feel like I'm not being seen, I do change one of my lights to flashing mode, which always helps. I don't like it as a driver or a cyclist, but after using it, you can't argue with how much of a difference it makes.

MUP and trail etiquette is entirely different, of course.

One issue the OP raised was: "I'm not sure how to address headlamps (worn on the head). I completely understand why a cyclist would use them, but they seem to be the WORST offenders for blinding others so I would welcome some ideas."

On that issue, my headlamp is probably the best "to be seen" light I have. The reason for this is that I'm riding in a bike lane, next to all the garbage cans, parked cars, bushes etc. Due to being pressed into the outside of the road, my handlebar light is often blocked from the view of the cross traffic. My helmet light, however, often can be seen above the obstructions and I can even swing it towards a car that looks like it hasn't seen me. I know this can be blinding, so I only do it if I'm scared they are going to pull out in front of me. One thing to remember in your (the OP's) talking points is that some of the behavior that might be considered rude by a driver is perhaps the only realistic option left to a bicyclist trying to get noticed. In other words, you won't be well received if you brush over a cyclist's behavior without providing equal or better safety.

Personally, I don't believe it's a brightness issue, I think it's an aiming issue. Cars have fabulously bright lights, comparatively, but they are angled downward. The same should work for bikes (and it does, for me).

 

[Bandgap]

I very much agree with you Zespectre.
And I am encouraged by so many reasoned and informative responses

Mega-bright lights can be dazzling, flashing mega-bright lights are so distracting that it is tough to look away from them.
They make the carrier extraordinarily safe, and make every other road user unsafe. It is just plain selfish.

I put similar views on another blog and got flamed by someone who told me I had it in for cyclists (I am a cyclist).
My solution is to make light manufacturers include a non-flashing 'road mode' that does not exceed national car and motorcycle regulations for above-horizontal output. A voluntary agreement would help back-off laws that will surely follow as more and more cyclist get such lights.
The use of these lights on the road is already illegal here in the UK. Where, like in the US, Europe, and Japan, sensible neighbourly vehicle lighting regulations have built-up over years of experience.

Surely no one could say normal car lights are not sufficient 'to be seen by'.

My favoured solution is to have 'main' and 'dip' bike lights - just like a car - it works well for me.
Producing good road 'dip' beams was my reason for starting this thread:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?214561-Let-s-design-a-road-front-light-beam

The trouble is, most light manufacturers have poor optical design skills and could not produce a light that doesn't dazzle, but does put enough light on the road to be useable.
There are physics limits too. To get a non-dazzle beam with a 1mm LED die requires optics of at least a certain diameter, probably more than 40mm. With an XP-G, afaik, it goes up to over 50mm.

As an interim, maybe high-power light manufacturers could mark their products, say with a white spot, that is to be vertically above the handlebar when the light is used on the road - so swivel up for off-road use, swivel around the handlebars down till the mark is at the top for road use.
Maybe it would have to say 'use brightness setting so-and-so on the road' too.
Trouble is, the light would be pointing down at quite an angle - at least the user would have to think about dazzle.

Bandgap

 

[zespectre]

Update on the "town meeting"

The meeting at the bike shop was Monday night and I have to say that I'm surprised at how well attended it was. We combined a discussion on why active lighting is far better than just reflectors, and segued that into a discussion of automobile light regulations (with regard to aiming and low beams and so forth) and how a parallel might apply to bicycling so as to avoid blinding incidents that might result in accidents/injury with other cyclists, pedestrians, and automobiles.

The attitude was mostly open and positive although there was a significant discussion about the risks of taking your hand off the handlebars to change light levels, especially at night. This led to a discussion of both headlight models that have remote handlebar switches, and modifications that could be made to other lights to add such a switch. (as a side note, I may have found a "cottage industry" making those modifications <grin>)

The bike shop did a door prize of a nice DOT rated safety vest and I think people enjoyed the evening.

Thanks to everyone who participated on this thread, the comments and attitudes helped me make the evening informational and non-confrontational.

 

[Bandgap]

I do believe that when bike lights start reaching car headlight output levels, that there ought to be some regulations put forth as to how high they can be aimed, how much light can be used for bike visibility, etc.

It already happened
NiteRider 'Pro 3600 DIY' makes a 3,600 lm light, and has a flash mode.
Car H7 halogen 1500 lm (normal car headlamp)
Car H9 2100 lm (possibly brightest normal car headlamp, rare)
Car xenon HID 3200 lm (Those blueish super-bright headlamps on cars)

Bandgap

 

[Steve K]

That's pretty surprising/remarkable!

Is the Niterider Pro 3600 intended for road use? Well, even if it is, I'm assuming that they haven't designed it with an asymmetric optic designed to avoid putting light into the eyes of oncoming traffic.

The weather this morning was heavy fog, so I drove my car instead of riding my bike on the narrow road to work, where traffic moves at 60mph. Coming from the other direction, there was a bike with a flashing headlight that I could see about 1/4 to 1/2 mile away. Hard to say what headlight he was using, but it was a small-ish handlebar mounted unit. Maybe a PlanetBike 2W light? I didn't get a look at his taillight, which is what I worry about myself. I've got a steady homemade taillight, plus a Cateye LD1100 that I use in flash mode on days with poor visibility.

 

[Bandgap]

Is the Niterider Pro 3600 intended for road use? Well, even if it is, I'm assuming that they haven't designed it with an asymmetric optic designed to avoid putting light into the eyes of oncoming traffic.

Hi Steve
In the photos, it looks like a symmetric optic.
I am not sure if some folk question what their lights were intended for.
Some I see on roads near me are bright enough to suggest they are intended for down-Everest racing - I do live near near London's mountain bike playground.

Bandgap Steve

 

[Torchguy]

As a cyclist on unlit roads, including some fast downhills, I need all the light I can get. However, I mount the front light under the handlebars, and shade it with my hand when a car is approaching, which works very well. If I forget, they often flash their headlights at me!

I also wear light-reflecting bands around both ankles, which are impossible for motorists (with their headlights on!) to miss from any direction, and definitely distinguish me from the "visual noise" on a busy street.

During the day I use a 500lm flashlight on SOS mode (nobody sees it long enough to register the morse code) in front, and the same at the back with a traffic wand. I think it works better than a regular rear bikelight.

 

[Bandgap]

A flashing 500 lm in the daytime?

What is it like when you look at it?

Bandgap

 

[STiFTW]

A flashing 500 lm in the daytime?

What is it like when you look at it?

Bandgap

They draw a lot of attention. I run lights anytime I am on the bike, especially in the daylight. Everything I can do to be 'seen', with a flashing light during the day it really grabs your attention and causes you to take notice. They are more visible than you would think.

 

[Torchguy]

They draw a lot of attention. I run lights anytime I am on the bike, especially in the daylight. Everything I can do to be 'seen', with a flashing light during the day it really grabs your attention and causes you to take notice. They are more visible than you would think.

x2

 

[radiopej]

Lately, a lot of cyclists in Sydney have been using strobe lights as their front light. I can't imagine them getting much use visually from these. On top of that, they are horrible on the eyes. My friend has almost crashed twice now, because the lights make her feel sick within a few seconds of hitting her eyes. I really don't see the point of a strobe on a bike. A nice little blinking red light on the back is great, but a constant-on light on the front will be better for them and for drivers.

 

[Skimo]

I disagree, strobes increase awareness by breaking the monotony of constant output lights.