flashlight for long hiking and expeditions

[kelmo]

...5. I lean towards the Tikka XP2...

Welcome to CPF!

I've got a Tikka XP2 and it is a really useful light. I would recommend it. The red LED is really useful for moving around and not waking people up.

Petzl has a Pixa series of headlamps out. They look interesting.

Have a great time on your hike!

kelmo

 

[Lone]

The question is : how many spare Eneloop do you have to take for the same runtime than a 18650 ?

Was that a question? if so i don't know, how many?

i do not carry any electrical devices. so it's only the batteries.

Kelmo, well i know the petzl's are good but the dry specs are in favour of the zebralight. brighter , lasts longer, more versatile. more resistant to water.

 

[taratata]

Yes, this was a question, because i don't use Eneloops.

But i can ask this another way (to Eneloops users) :
Are Two Eneloops providing same runtime than a 18650 ? (just comparing equivalent weight)

I don't say Lone has to choose 18650 over Eneloops, both are good choices and depends of his criterias.

I personally do some one week long hikings, and have myself a Spark ST6. I think the "T" form factor of the ST6 is not ideal for long use, perhaps "SD" series are better in term of stability.
If i compare specs given on the spark website, between the SD6 (18650) and the SD52 (2xAA), the runtimes are much better with the 18650.

On (semi-)long term hiking, weight is THE point you have to master. A good headlamp and a tiny backup (a Photon or like) is the way to go for me, just adjust the number of spare batteries to your trip.

 

[yellow]

has already answered:

AAA is Ni-Cd/Ni-Mh with 1.2 Volt and 800 mAh
AA is Ni-Cd/Ni-Mh with 1.2 Volt and 2100 mAh
18650 is Li-Ion with 3.7 Volt and 2.900 mAh
so to compare to the power of one AA, one would roughly "need" three AAAs, or
to compare to the power of one 18650, one would roughly "need" to use three AAs, or nine AAA
(reason: much wasted space with increasing number of round cells and their outside wrapping)

As long as You dont use the high levels of the H600 often, the number of cells "needed" for the small(er) lights to equal the power of the 18650 is definitly a pain.
But their only positive point remains: AA and AAA can be purchased everywhere (hopefully) and be used as single-use cells


I would rethink the time the hike lasts and thus the time the light will be "needed" (which in real then is probably 1/5 of what one thinks to "need" a light),
+ as well as how often such hikes will be done in the future
+ as well as how often a way more powerful headlamp (for biking f.e.) will be "needed" later - in areas where recharging power is available
then decide on the powerful-but less-runtime H600 and the "safe" normal batteries H51W
--> to be on the safe side: still the H51W ... with the Energizer Lithiums, which is a great tip,



PS: I am pretty certain that I would be able - at a normal hike with not too much night hiking - to come trough with a H600 and just ONE 18650, where the typical Tikka user needs 5-10 battery changes. So one spare would give me way enough safety.
The key were to use the high levels very shortly.
For hiking medium 1 (55 Lumen / 18 hours) and even medium 2 (18 lumen / 50 hours) are enough in unlit areas.
... for that time scale I do calculate with a maximum of FIVE hours for a battery change needed with the Tikka - when compared to med1, or 10 hours (not a minute more) when its med2 of the H600.

But my primary use for the headlamp is additional light support for mountainbiking!
If I were hiking only, the H51 - with its widely available AA size batteries - is my choice

PPS: I am still quite interested in You findings while/after the hike ... what the different lights encountered, the time light is needed, availability of spares, the region itself ... is concerned

 

[Lone]

Dear friends. i truly appreciate all of your feedback.
so are we all in agreement that Zebralight is the company to go with?

if so i will start making my spreadsheet . when i have all the details i can decide while seeing the whole picture.
the parameters i will include will be:
1. Lumens
2. Beam Distance.
2. Runtime
3. Weight.
4. Max and Minimum power.
5. Light Tint

anything i am missing?




p.s are the H51 and H51W lithium compatible?

 

[taratata]

Accordingly to ZL website :
"Operating Voltage Range: 0.7V - 2.5V"
"Battery: One 1.5V AA (NiMH, lithium or alkaline). 14500 Li-ion batteries are not supported."

So it seems that you can't use rechargeable li-ion batteries (3.7V nominal batteries, 4.2V fresh charged).

 

[taratata]

Personnaly, for hiking use, my requirements would rather be :

1: Runtime
2: Led tint
3: Weight
4: Max and Minimum power = number of levels and accessibility of them, impact runtimes
5: lumens (same as precedent)
6: Beam type (pure flood, pure throw, flood and throw...)

Saying you've already choose the battery type (AA, RCR132/cr123, 18650).

 

[Outdoorsman5]

I'd agree with the recommendation to get the Zebra H51w (great neutral tint) and I'd recommend you use AA Energizer Lithium batteries for your trip. I would not want to tote a charger & solar panel while on a long hiking trip (if I could avoid it.) The energizer lithium batteries have more capacity than an alkaline, perform better in colder temps if needed, and are the lightest of the bunch (an AA energizer lithium weighs .51 oz., an alkaline weighs .84 oz., an AA eneloop weighs .93 oz., and an 18650 weighs 1.64 oz.) The 18650's have a lot more capacity though (4 x one alkaline AA,) and may be what I'd use if I knew I would not be able to get any other batteries on my trip. However, since batteries will be available on your trip I'd stick with AA lights and run em on AA lithium batteries when possible.

The Zebralight H51w is the best all around headlamp (output, multi-levels, UI, runtimes) especially if you are going to be taking night hikes & need some decent throw. The H51w definitely provides enough throw to see up trail, so I'd recommend it as the best general use headlight. **Side Note....When not in use and tucked away in your pack or pocket, you will need to remember to twist the tail a little to lock the light out. This avoids accidental activation (accidentally bumping the switch.) The switch just takes a light touch to activate.

I also agree that you should have a backup light, and would recommend a floody headlight for this roll (like the soon to be released H502w.) I've used the now discontinued Zebralight H501w for a while, and it is my favorite camping light (not my favorite for the trail though since it is all flood.) A floody headlight is easier on the eyes, and easier for reading or any other close up tasks - cooking, cleaning, pitching a tent, & general campsite stuff. Everything within 30 feet or less is evenly lit which is very nice. There's no annoying hot spot right in front of you for the close up stuff (especially when reading.)

Good Luck.

 

[127.0.0.1]

IMHO

no matter what you get, also get a PAK-LITE

it is the ultimate in runtime and portability. snaps on top of a 9-volt,
runs almost forever. it makes a great '2=1 1=none' backup light

 

[M@elstrom]

4: because ANY light - over a certain and very low level - ruins night vision, no matter what color.
Close one eye while using any light for preserving night vision

Whilst this is indeed true, red wavelength light will photo-bleach the Rhodopsin at a lower rate than white light and thus our genetic night vision ability will be regained faster using this light source in preference over white :thumbsup:

 

[BenChiew]

You should also consider surefire's minimus headlamp.

 

[Dave H]

You should take a look at the latest black diamond icon. They are now made with an aluminum case. It has a 3watt 220 lumen spot, 2 small white leds and 2 small red leds. It has 3 levels of brightness for each. It is powered by 3 AA batteries or an optional rechargeable battery pack. The batteries are located in the back so you have a good balance. I always use lithium AAs in addition to the longer life the weigh much less. My favorite headlamp so far.

 

[Outdoorsman5]

I have another suggestion. Instead of buying a light that has a battery pack on the back of your head, buy the Zebra H51w (for throw) and the H502w (for flood) and wear them both on the same headband (one in front & one in the back.) This would be more lightweight than almost all of the lights out there with headlamp up front & 3-cell battery pack in back. I have worn my H51w & H501w this way, and liked it. I just rotated the headband around depending on which one I wanted to use.

 

[Lone]

Replies:
1. Dave H, the Black Diamon Icon weighs 220 grams which is very heavy for me. plus i don't think it introduces any advantages over the Zebralight models.

2. Benchiew, about the Surefire minimus, weighs 170 grams. also too heavy although looks like a really high end headlamp.

3. Outdoorsman5, 2 Headlamps are a total over kill for me. plus i don't really need the flood mode if the spot has a good spill. which i really hope it does.

 

[hazna]

Another vote for going with lithium primary AA batteries. They're much lighter weight and will last you longer alkaline. AA batteries are easier to source. I'd hesitate to recommend 18650 unless you read up on precautions on using them. The chargers (and possibly DMM) are additional weight. you'll also need access to places where you can charge them overnight.

To be devils advocate, I don't think zebralight's build quality is that amazing. They are subject to failure just like any other light. Sometimes when electronics become more complex, there are more parts that can fail.

One thing that has not been fully addressed was you preference for a light that can do both flood and spot. I have a spark st5, which I assume would have a similar hotspot and beam to the zebralights (it's a similar sized reflector and xpg). While I can use it to read books, the beam isn't fully diffused and I do need to occasionally move my head/book so the hot spot is on the area I am reading. There is enough spill to light up most the book, so if you read using the spill + hotspot, it might not be an issue, but I prefer to have the hot spot focused on the area I am reading.

With the spark st5 you can change the front lens to a frosted one for more flood, however it's not as convienent as a flip up/down diffuser. I do prefer the spark headband over the zebralight headbands, as it has the additional vertical strap and provides more support. I do feel the zebralight UI is slightly better than the spark UI

All up, for your purposes I'd probably recommend:
If you can carry two torches - zebralight sc51w and zebralight 502/h51f (one spot flashlight, one floody headlamp)
If you can only carry one - zebralight h51w (And for emergency backup bring a photon freedom along with it's hat clip. weights nothing, and if you clip the freedom to your hat, it'll do as makeshift headlamp)

 

[Lone]

Hazna, first of all thank you for the feedback.

yes, i do understand now that lithium batteries are the way to go if i go the AA way.
what are the Zebralight models which support lithium batteries?

what do you mean by "precautions" of using the 18650 batteries and where i can read about them? i thought they just another type of rechargeable batteries with longer run times. actually thought about the idea of buying the 18650 zebralight model and living with the weight of the recharger for the longer run times.

are you saying the ZL models are more prone to failure due to complex build? if so i am very surprised you are the first to give this kind of opinion.

 

[reppans]

what do you mean by "precautions" of using the 18650 batteries and where i can read about them? i thought they just another type of rechargeable batteries with longer run times. actually thought about the idea of buying the 18650 zebralight model and living with the weight of the recharger for the longer run times.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?329321-Li-ion-beginner-primer

If I were off-grid camping for a month and only had a light, I could quite easily live off 2 lithium AAs in a ZL, using it continuously at night mostly on moonlight and low for general camp chores (ie, not hiking). However, if I had other AA electronic devices with me like UV water purifier, cellphone, GPS, Radio, then I'd probably go with my Powerfilm AA solar charger which is weights ~ 4 oz (or 4 batteries) and is the packed size of 2 packs of cigarettes. It would probably be good for charging 2xAA per day just strapped to your pack.

 

[hazna]

Hazna, first of all thank you for the feedback.

yes, i do understand now that lithium batteries are the way to go if i go the AA way.
what are the Zebralight models which support lithium batteries?

what do you mean by "precautions" of using the 18650 batteries and where i can read about them? i thought they just another type of rechargeable batteries with longer run times. actually thought about the idea of buying the 18650 zebralight model and living with the weight of the recharger for the longer run times.

are you saying the ZL models are more prone to failure due to complex build? if so i am very surprised you are the first to give this kind of opinion.

Hazna, first of all thank you for the feedback.

yes, i do understand now that lithium batteries are the way to go if i go the AA way.
what are the Zebralight models which support lithium batteries?

what do you mean by "precautions" of using the 18650 batteries and where i can read about them? i thought they just another type of rechargeable batteries with longer run times. actually thought about the idea of buying the 18650 zebralight model and living with the weight of the recharger for the longer run times.

are you saying the ZL models are more prone to failure due to complex build? if so i am very surprised you are the first to give this kind of opinion.

There is sometimes confusion between primary lithium AA batteries (such as engerizer ultimate batteries) and lithium ion (li-ion) batteries. energizer ultimates are single use and have a voltage around 1.7V when fresh, they are NOT rechargeable. li-ion batteries are rechargeable, they usually have voltage of ~4.2V when fully charged. enegerizer ultimate (and other brand equivalents) should be safe to use in all zebralight AA flashlights and headlamps. Zebralight do not recommend using the 4.2V li-ion batteries with their AA flashlights/headlamps. But having said that, people have used li-ion in AA zebralight without immediate issues.

There's lots of information on batteries and electronic subforum about the precautions using li-ion batteries but here are a few links to get you started:
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/lithium_ion_safety_concerns
http://www.redilast.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=51&Itemid=85
They're really not that scary to use, but I feel you need to understand what your getting into before getting started.

I'm not saying in particular zl models are more prone to breaking, but I keep reading where people imply that it's build quality is amazing. They do feel solid, but they can fail like any other light. I'm starting to have issues with the switch on my sc600 and need to send it back to the factory to get fixed.

 

[Dave H]

Lone,
The 220g refers to the headlamp with 4 duracell akaline batteries if you switch to lithium you drop about 50 grams. Your run time over the zebralights goes up significantly as well. I understand if you don't want that much weight though. I like it because it balances the front part of the light and stay put on my head better.

 

[Lone]

Finally got an internet connection after a whole week without.

so i am a month away from flying to the Alps.
still thinking through the headlamp issue. but i think i'm close to figuring it out.

my thoughts so far:
1. the chance of ever finding a 18650 battery in a mountain vilage, mountain basecamp is close to zero. so i think i "stuck" with the AA headlamps.
2. Pure flood Headlamp is good for camp chores but not for night walking, climbing so i need a spot headlamp with the ability to go to Low outputs.

that's about it. i think either the H51 or the H51W. what say you?

btw what's the deal with this one http://www.zebralight.com/H501w-Neutral-White-w-new-UI_p_13.html
what are the updates?