I need help helping an overweight friend, please

[Illum]

1) Don't eat after 8pm.

I get off work at 9PM, eat at 10 its been about a year with no significant weight gain... [I'm 6'5, weights about ~180, never reached 200].

one thing to note though, DO NOT SLEEP RIGHT AFTER EATING, OR EVEN LAY DOWN...I was told that this risks serious health issues, but I suppose everyones unique to his own style

 

[z96Cobra]

That's probably why the diet works so well.

The inventor of that diet plan died.... weighing nearly as much as a whale!

I know it works for me, even without the exercise. The exercise makes it work quicker. Walking 1 mile 3-4 times a week isn't going to drop my weight over 50 lbs. in just a few months time. My eating habits had to change for this to work.

Atkins died after being in a coma for a week or two, after falling on the sidewalk and hitting his head. He was 6' tall and weighed around 200 lbs. when he was admitted to the hospital, hardly "weighing nearly as much as a whale!".

If you've never tried it, give it a shot and see if it works. If it doesn't work for you, try something else. If it does work, great! If you don't need to diet, why criticize something you don't have any experience with, when it may be helpful for someone else? No matter what "diet" you choose, there are going to be critics (with their own "scientific data") to tell you how bad it is.

Roger

 

[jtr1962]

I do my own version of "Atkins" and I eat mostly chicken and fish (tuna mostly). I eat lots of vegetables (green leafy vegetables work best) with my meals.

A common denominator with a lot of diets is to increase your consumption of fruits and vegetables. Now here's the problem. First off, that stuff isn't cheap anymore. Second and more important, all the stuff you get in the store tastes disgusting. Maybe that's the reason people find it hard changing to this type of diet. Natural, fresh fruits and vegetables might indeed be very tasty. Problem is unless you grow them yourself you probably don't have access to them at all, or at least not at reasonable prices. Forget all the "organically grown" stuff in health food stores. Maybe if you're a stock broker you can afford that stuff. I know I can't. So unfortunately even though I exercise, my diet consists of things I can afford. Sadly, it's mostly things which are not healthy in the long run such as Ramen soup or frozen $1 pizza. I think that's one reason a lot of people get overweight or unhealthy. Food choices are very limited if you're on a budget. I'm wondering how much exercise and vitamin supplements can compensate for a lousy diet.

 

[Monocrom]

Atkins died after being in a coma for a week or two, after falling on the sidewalk and hitting his head. He was 6' tall and weighed around 200 lbs. when he was admitted to the hospital, hardly "weighing nearly as much as a whale!".


Roger

I had heard he was heavier than that.

No problem losing weight for me, despite being a bit overweight and not dieting or exercising. It's not a magic weight loss pill. Fact is, my condition isn't something you'd want, no matter how overweight a person might be.

 

[Pila_Power]

Hi Pyd, just be sure tell him you love him before you get to the heavy stuff. (Seriously, no pun intended - sorry)

Even though you have been friends a long time, this will remind him of how you feel and why you put your friendship on the line to help him.

I'm sure you'll think of the right things to say at the time.

 

[Gaffle]

Body-For-Life. Best book when it comes to a change of life. Bill Philips also has a book called Eating-For-Life. Once a person commits to the workout and the eating you can buy the Success Journal. Kind of like having a business plan for your body.

 

[Max]

Atkins died after being in a coma for a week or two, after falling on the sidewalk and hitting his head. He was 6' tall and weighed around 200 lbs. when he was admitted to the hospital, hardly "weighing nearly as much as a whale!".
Roger

According to The Smoking Gun, the medical examiner's report said that he weighed 258lbs. That's not of whale proportions, but it is fatter than the Atkins people would like to admit.

 

[geepondy]

I work in a reasonably large company and interface with a lot of different people on a regular basis. As Atkins has been out and popular for quite some time now, I know several people who have successfully lost weight while on it, some of them a lot pretty quickly. However long term, keeping the weight off, the success rate has been varied. Many reverted back to older habits and put the weight right back on. One example is a fellow co-worker that I go out on field trips with. We go to eat lunch at a mall eatery and both get hamburgers, only he completely discards the bun and a lot of the trimmings. I'm thinking to myself, how long is this really going to last?

 

[Monocrom]

I work in a reasonably large company and interface with a lot of different people on a regular basis. As Atkins has been out and popular for quite some time now, I know several people who have successfully lost weight while on it, some of them a lot pretty quickly. However long term, keeping the weight off, the success rate has been varied. Many reverted back to older habits and put the weight right back on. One example is a fellow co-worker that I go out on field trips with. We go to eat lunch at a mall eatery and both get hamburgers, only he completely discards the bun and a lot of the trimmings. I'm thinking to myself, how long is this really going to last?

Hopefully not too long.... Cause after awhile you run the risk of protein poisoning.

 

[z96Cobra]

According to The Smoking Gun, the medical examiner's report said that he weighed 258lbs. That's not of whale proportions, but it is fatter than the Atkins people would like to admit.

He was around 200 when admitted to the hospital, which is what I stated. The 258 lbs. was after he died. I don't know if "around 200 lbs." is 205 or 225, but that is what I read. After being in the hospital for a couple of weeks, in a coma, a lot of people will gain weight (mostly water retention) from all of the meds/IVs. Could he actually retain around 60 lbs. of water in a couple of weeks? I doubt it, but who knows.

It doesn't really matter which "diet" someone chooses, there will always be others to tell them how unhealthy it is. For me "Atkins" is easy, and it works. Two guys I work with started it about 2 months ago, because they saw how it worked for me. One is in his early 50's and has lost 23 lbs. with no exercise. The other is my age (31) and lost 34 lbs. with some exercise. Instead of eating pizza and burgers at work (our normal lunch), we usually eat salads with grilled chicken. Instead of snacking on chips, candy bars, and Coke, we drink water and eat pork rinds, or sugar free Jello, or pepperoni and cheese chunks. It might not be the best diet, but we are eating healthier foods than we used to eat. Some food is a lot healthier, some is just a little better.

The main reason I think the low carb diets work for me is because after you do it for a few days, you lose the cravings for all of the snacks. Now when I eat I feel full, quicker. I'm also not hungry all of the time, unless I cheat and eat some stuff with tons of carbs. This just makes me consume fewer calories, and that is how you lose weight. You have to eat fewer calories than you burn during a day. Or you can eat the same and do a ton of exercise to offset the difference. I'd rather eat a little healthier and do some exercise, for the biggest "gains". Would I like to eat a large pizza, and then a whole gallon of ice cream, washed down with a 2 liter of Root Beer? HELL YEAH! Will I do that? NOT ANYMORE! Now, after I'm on the "diet" for a month, I will splurge for a day (sometimes the whole weekend) and eat whatever I want. This gives me a reward to look forward too while I'm eating food that is better for me (but isn't exactly my first choice for taste) even though I would rather be eating a Baconator and large fries from Wendy's.

Hopefully not too long.... Cause after awhile you run the risk of protein poisoning.

Not if you follow the diet correctly. You need to eat some fats with this diet, and you also need to drink lots of water. Protein isn't stored in the body (like carbs after they are converted), so if you are constantly dehydrated, you will overtax your kidneys and end up with problems. If your body doesn't need the protein to build muscle, it gets rid of it. You would have to eat basically no carbs and very lean meat, for a long time to even begin to see the effects of protein poisoning. This is just what I've read from researching the diet before I started it.

Roger

 

[CodeOfLight]

What is it with people with the weight gain?

Who controls his arms? Who controls his mouth? Who is putting the food in his mouth? The bottom line here is that he needs to stop eating nearly as much food. PERIOD. Anything else is HIS CHOICE. When I get overweight, I use the simple but highly effective PTFD diet. PUT THE FORK DOWN. What is really happening here is that he has NO self control. I do not have a lot of respect for people who allow themselves the indulgence of overeating CONSTANTLY, and then wonder why they are gaining weight.

Perhaps he likes the attention he is garnering by being overweight. If he makes those choices, he has to live with the consequences. Just like all of the rest of us.

 

[jtr1962]

Who controls his arms? Who controls his mouth? Who is putting the food in his mouth? The bottom line here is that he needs to stop eating nearly as much food. PERIOD. Anything else is HIS CHOICE. When I get overweight, I use the simple but highly effective PTFD diet. PUT THE FORK DOWN. What is really happening here is that he has NO self control. I do not have a lot of respect for people who allow themselves the indulgence of overeating CONSTANTLY, and then wonder why they are gaining weight.

There are some cases where a person has hormone imbalances or other health problems which lead to substantial weight gain, but in general you're correct. Seeing how much I've had to eat just to get to the point I am now (5' 9½", 195-200 pounds), I couldn't imagine the eating binge needed to get to ~400 pounds. Unless this guy has severe health issues causing the weight gain, he has to be eating like a pig to get to/maintain this kind of weight, even if he's fairly sedentary. And BTW, it's a miracle he can even function well enough to work at that weight. I can feel the drag carrying just the extra 30 or so pounds I am now. If I was 400 pounds I doubt I could do much more than just walk from the bed to the bathroom. Since this guy can still function marginally at that weight, he must be from very strong stock. As mentioned by CodeOfLight, he most likely just needs to reduce his portions to normal size and he'll be OK.

 

[Monocrom]

.... As mentioned by CodeOfLight, he most likely just needs to reduce his portions to normal size and he'll be OK.

Things aren't always that simple. Sometimes it's like a skinny person wondering to himself, "If someone is fat, they should just eat less."

Sometimes, it's not that simple. I've found that just a bit of exercise and a very gradual reduction in portions can lead to good results, later on down the road. Problem is, folks generally want results NOW!

I'm not on Atkins, and I've found that the above works well for me. (Have to admit, Manhattan is rather interesting to walk through. So that helps). Went to take a physical yesterday as part of a requirement for a new job-assignment. It was a few miles away from the Home office, so I just walked there. Turns out, I lost even more weight than I realized.

I also have a condition that causes me to lose weight without much effort. (It's definitely not beneficial though). Still, I have a feeling that the exercise and reduced portions were a big help in my weight loss.

 

[CodeOfLight]

He did not get to be the Vice President of a company by being a mental lightweight. I do not care WHAT kind of a "hormone imbalance" you have, you CAN eat little enough to maintain ANY given weight. People just don't like having to conform to any kind of guidelines if it is not comfortable. Well, that's just tough. DO IT ANYWAY, or don't come looking for help when YOU are causing the problem. There is no such thing as an addiction to food. PERIOD. If that is the case, then we are ALL addicted to food since we have to have it to live. "Food Addictons" are nothing more than a lame excuse on which blame a profound lack of self control. Everybody instinctively knows what to do to get the pounds off. That THEY are unwilling to do it is NEVER going to be MY problem.

Yes, things really ARE that simple. Our efforts to say that they are "complex" is just a rationalization of poor self control. They are elaborate fictions people have constructed around thier lack of discipline - in order to make thier lack of discipline less obvious. Unless someone is hypnotized into eating a bunch of high fat foods, or a large quantity of food that they do not even remeber eating, then THEY are at fault. Not "depression", or "hormones", or "too many snacks around" or any of the other common excuses poeple use for being fat. I can have a hormone problem, be depressed, and be surrounded by ice cream and pork chops. Unless I reach out and start eating a lot of those things, MY CHOICE, I will NOT gain any weight. What would cause me to start gaining weight would be when I lost CONTROL OF MYSELF, and decided to stuff myself beyond what would sustain me.

Bottom line: All of you know this is true. It's not even debatable. Exceed the amount of calories necessary to sustain you, you will gain weight. Eat less than the amount of calories needed to sustain you, you will lose weight. This is a fact. The only person who controls that rate of calorie intake is - YOU. Diets are mechanisms by which we try to do what we all know we must do without being quite so uncomfortable.

 

[z96Cobra]

I do not care WHAT kind of a "hormone imbalance" you have, you CAN eat little enough to maintain ANY given weight.

You should learn more about hypothyroidism, before you make statements like that. It is entirely possible to have a "thyroid condition" and limit your meals to almost nothing, and still gain weight. For some, eating less actually slows the metabolism down even more.

Roger

 

[jtr1962]

Things aren't always that simple. Sometimes it's like a skinny person wondering to himself, "If someone is fat, they should just eat less."

My main point is that in most cases of morbid obesity the sheer volume of food consumed to get to that point is staggering. I saw something on TV where four morbidly obese people were consuming anywhere from 16,000 to 30,000 calories daily. It's physically impossible to burn that much off. Consuming that many calories also means pretty much your entire day revolves around the consumption of food and elimination of waste. Do you have any idea how much food even 10,000 calories is? Long before you even get to this point you'll still have to devote a good portion of the day to eating. I just couldn't imagine any working person not having enough other distractions which would prevent them from devoting the needed time towards food consumption. And there are other issues such as how on earth can one consume this many calories without vomiting.

I know some of what I do from personal experience. My dad's weight (~285 pounds) and sedentary lifestyle basically killed him. To get to and maintain that weight, even being very sedentary, he had to consume an enormous amount of food. Of course, in his mind he hardly ate a thing. The reality was that everytime I saw him awake, the mouth was chewing on something. Whether through boredom or depression he got fat because he just couldn't control his food intake. So it is as simple in most cases as just eating less. It can even be expressed mathematically: weight gained(lost) = (calories in -calories expended) /3600. The big problem is changing a person's state of mind so less feels normal.

Maybe there's a hormonal issue here. It is a remote possibility, which is why he needs a thorough checkup. Most likely it's just a mental issue where the food consumed is replacing something else missing from this person's life. The only thing known here with certainty is if he doesn't start his weight heading in the other direction, his prospects for a long healthy life are very slim (no pun intended).

 

[Monocrom]

He did not get to be the Vice President of a company by being a mental lightweight. I do not care WHAT kind of a "hormone imbalance" you have, you CAN eat little enough to maintain ANY given weight. People just don't like having to conform to any kind of guidelines if it is not comfortable. Well, that's just tough. DO IT ANYWAY, or don't come looking for help when YOU are causing the problem. There is no such thing as an addiction to food. PERIOD. If that is the case, then we are ALL addicted to food since we have to have it to live. "Food Addictons" are nothing more than a lame excuse on which blame a profound lack of self control. Everybody instinctively knows what to do to get the pounds off. That THEY are unwilling to do it is NEVER going to be MY problem.

Yes, things really ARE that simple. Our efforts to say that they are "complex" is just a rationalization of poor self control. They are elaborate fictions people have constructed around thier lack of discipline - in order to make thier lack of discipline less obvious. Unless someone is hypnotized into eating a bunch of high fat foods, or a large quantity of food that they do not even remeber eating, then THEY are at fault. Not "depression", or "hormones", or "too many snacks around" or any of the other common excuses poeple use for being fat. I can have a hormone problem, be depressed, and be surrounded by ice cream and pork chops. Unless I reach out and start eating a lot of those things, MY CHOICE, I will NOT gain any weight. What would cause me to start gaining weight would be when I lost CONTROL OF MYSELF, and decided to stuff myself beyond what would sustain me.

Bottom line: All of you know this is true. It's not even debatable. Exceed the amount of calories necessary to sustain you, you will gain weight. Eat less than the amount of calories needed to sustain you, you will lose weight. This is a fact. The only person who controls that rate of calorie intake is - YOU. Diets are mechanisms by which we try to do what we all know we must do without being quite so uncomfortable.

I think you're a shoe-in for "Angriest Post Ever on CPF."

Whatever is behind it, you clearly have no clue what's like to be addicted to food. I can tell you from experience that food addiction is very much real. At least with other addictions, you have the option of detoxing and just staying away from the booze or drugs; since you really don't need those things to survive. But, as you yourself have pointed out, doesn't work that way with food. Despite having lost weight, mostly through a bit of exercise and cutting back on portions gradually, it was far from as simple as you described it. It is indeed complex sometimes. But if someone has never had to struggle through a food addiction for years; I would not expect that person to understand what it is like.

I've never tried cocaine, have no clue why folks become so addicted to it. But at the same time, I'm not going to try to make someone feel like $#^% because of their addiction.

I have no idea why you're so upset. It's not as though your tax-payer dollars are being used to fund a program to help folks lose weight.

 

[CodeOfLight]

I am not angry or upset. I just have a lot of years of experience living with a lot of overweight people. I also have spoken at length with medical professionals about the issue. (I work at a hospital.) There is no such thing as a food addiction. It is a medical impossibility. There are NO withdrawal symptoms from cutting down your intake of calories, other than being hungry. We have all been hungry before. To control my weight, I have at time gone hungry most of the time. I ate, but not enough to to alleviate being hungry during the time I was trying to cut down my weight. It was tough. I was not comfortable.

I have watched my wife, an overweight person, swear up and down that she is not eating a whole lot. I then watch her drink a 22oz glass of milk with every meal, and sometimes in between. I remind her that this is bad if she wants to lose weight. She still chooses to do this.

I am not saying that people do not suffer from a lack of self control. There may be reasons why that control is not there, but the presence of that self control is ALL that is required.

 

[jtr1962]

It's not as though your tax-payer dollars are being used to fund a program to help folks lose weight.

Actually that's not 100% true. Who supports these 500 pound people who can't work? I even heard that severe obesity classifies as a disability, making one eligible for all sorts of help. And who pays for the firemen to break down a wall when these people need to go to a hospital? For that matter who enables this behavoir to begin with by bringing these people large quantities of food once they're no longer able to get it themselves? The health care industry is more than happy to take lots of taxpayer dollars to care for these people. The home health care industry is happy taking money to make them get fatter. They are in essence cash cows (no pun intended-that came out really wrong :green. Who helped this guy get to 1234 pounds (WARNING: Gross human elephant pictures)? He certainly couldn't prepare his own food once he got much past 500. The enablers are as much to blame as the overweight person.

When my dad's weight was going up, my mom and I both agreed that once the time came he couldn't get out of bed, he would be losing weight very fast. There's no way we would continue to overfeed a bedridden person so they can become even fatter. Those 800 pound people you see on TV definitely are not solely to blame for their condition. Even before a person is completely bedridden, the time will come where they can't easily go out to buy food. That's when those living with them can put a stop to it. Just don't have much more than a normal day's food within easy reach. Disconnect the phone so the person can't order food. Do whatever you can on your end to see that the person's cravings for abnormally large amounts of food aren't satisfied no matter how much they complain. They'll thank you for it in the end.

 

[jtr1962]

I have watched my wife, an overweight person, swear up and down that she is not eating a whole lot. I then watch her drink a 22oz glass of milk with every meal, and sometimes in between. I remind her that this is bad if she wants to lose weight. She still chooses to do this.

This sounds like the situation between my parents. In the end no amount of prodding, talking nice, talking not so nice, yelling, or anything else would get my father to eat better. He paid the ultimate price for his stubborness. I can only hope by relating his story that it helps others to not follow the same fate. His was a 100% preventable death. He could have lived to 90 or 100 instead of only 71 had he listened to us.