Led Lensers

[GMLRS]

What bugs me about LED Lenser lights are the switches, if you put them in your pocket or touch them to anything they will stay on. I doubt they are very efficient, get something with a Cree LED. They just announced they have a 160 Lumens per watt LED. Just bought 2 Fenix LD20s, 2AA, 180 lumens. the new one is 205 or 210 lumens. I am very very happy with them, 71 hours at 9 lumens.

ITP A6 Polestar, Cree MC-E, 6xAA, 700 Lumens. 80 US$

Get something with a Cree LED, or something as efficient and versatile. :shakehead :shakehead

 

[AmperSand]

What bugs me about LED Lenser lights are the switches, if you put them in your pocket or touch them to anything they will stay on. I doubt they are very efficient, get something with a Cree LED. They just announced they have a 160 Lumens per watt LED. Just bought 2 Fenix LD20s, 2AA, 180 lumens. the new one is 205 or 210 lumens. I am very very happy with them, 71 hours at 9 lumens.

ITP A6 Polestar, Cree MC-E, 6xAA, 700 Lumens. 80 US$

Get something with a Cree LED, or something as efficient and versatile. :shakehead :shakehead

Last time I checked all the current range of LED Lenser flashlights use Cree LED's.

 

[JaguarDave-in-Oz]

What bugs me about LED Lenser lights are the switches, if you put them in your pocket or touch them to anything they will stay on.

I put up with this issue in my P7 for about twelve months until I went exploring inside the tailcap. Turns out that one can adjust the tension of the pushbutton spring by removing the battery pack/switch to access the retaining ring for the pushbutton (which is in the tailcap, the switch itself is on the battery pack) and screwing the ring in further. My torch immediately ceased being easy to accidently activate.

I may be naive in the way of modern torchaholicism, but for me the way my first generation P7 is put together and the obvious care taken with design and manufacturing of the general componentry within it gives me a feeling of assured quality that I just don't get with my fenix and quark torches (although my TK20 comes very close).

For me, the quality of a torch has nothing to do with the number of features that it has, it's about the feel, the reliability and the way it's put together. I seem to carry that attitude across to life in general and that's perhaps why I still use a reel to reel tape recorder, compete using a side by side shotgun (ok, I'll admit it's custom made) and drive forty five year old Jaguars...............

 

[M@elstrom]

If it were me, I'd avoid LED Lenser flashlights because they do not have regulation circuitry built into them. Regulated lights have constant brightness while with unregulated lights their light output goes down as the battery drains.

The biggest downside for me is the fact that they are unregulated - so the light output directly relates to how full the battery is. You will get a great bright light at first, but it will steadily dim throughout the batteries charge - this is how they claim both the high output (measured on a fresh set of batteries) and long runtime (which is only that long if you can put up with hours of dim glow for the last while)

Those comments don't apply to the LED lenser P5R, the Lithium-Ion rechargeable cell would have a relatively flat discharge (compared to alkaline), the M series is promoted as having a constant regulated mode/option

One of my co-workers picked up a P17 locally for about $140.00 AUD and is really happy with it, when you consider a stock 3D Maglight used to cost $80+ until recently $140.00 isn't a huge stretch for a B&M consumer, the only way to obtain something better here is if I build it OR they purchase something online :thumbsup:

 

[McAllan]

ALL THOSE WHINING ABOUT THE RESISTOR AND DIRECT DRIVE

Has anyone actually tried some of the newer M-series? And especially the M14 which should have addressed many if not all if the criticism.
I agree that their past direct drives and partly their resistor driven as P14 are

Price is always a personal question but reality is that there's no lights to my knowledge which was such unique lens system in contrast to a traditional reflector. If course that's a personal preference too. I have an M14 ordered as I want to try it out for myself. Unfortunately I haven't received it yet so can't comment it further.

In the meantime you whining folks might want to take a look at this site:
http://www.m-series.com.au/
A description of the M14 with all it's bells and whistles. Unfortunately not many objective data though.

 

[Ragiska]

ALL THOSE WHINING ABOUT THE RESISTOR AND DIRECT DRIVE

Has anyone actually tried some of the newer M-series? And especially the M14 which should have addressed many if not all if the criticism.
I agree that their past direct drives and partly their resistor driven as P14 are

Price is always a personal question but reality is that there's no lights to my knowledge which was such unique lens system in contrast to a traditional reflector. If course that's a personal preference too. I have an M14 ordered as I want to try it out for myself. Unfortunately I haven't received it yet so can't comment it further.

In the meantime you whining folks might want to take a look at this site:
http://www.m-series.com.au/
A description of the M14 with all it's bells and whistles. Unfortunately not many objective data though.

you can order the same lights off-label direct from the factories in China for 1/4 the cost

many of them are listed on DX or KD

 

[McAllan]

you can order the same lights off-label direct from the factories in China for 1/4 the cost

many of them are listed on DX or KD

Sure. Like you can get SureFire, Arc and MagLite there too

I've not noticed any that come close to the real thing except KD which has a few older models of the real thing - at same price as locally. The closest was a Small Sun copy of a Led Lenser V6 power chip although with a Cree. Even got a LL belt holster. But was noticeable lower quality. Fit, finish, craftsmanship, non zoom TIR lens - everything was lesser quality but output was great. Modded it with a proper driver and gave it away to a very happy receiver who's never seens such powerful light in a small package.

And you've not even addressed the driver question.

 

[hyperloop]

well, personally i own a P5 and a P14 and they are great lights!! love the focusing ability! non regulation isnt a huge push factor for me at least there is still light being emitted.

Have had some lights running on protected rechargeable cells and they just die off immediately once the protection circuit cuts in, so having a light that gradually runs down isnt a huge disadvantage.

end of the day, it all boils down to personal preferences and if you like the LED Lensers go for it

 

[Egsise]

ALL THOSE WHINING ABOUT THE RESISTOR AND DIRECT DRIVE

Has anyone actually tried some of the newer M-series?

M7 lol, now the circuit drops the output to 60%, lol.
http://translate.google.de/translat...nlampen-test.de/reviews/preview-led-lenser-m7

Any news about M14, is the circuit the same? :green:

 

[Swedpat]

I have a P14 and like it. This will provide quite (perceived) even output some hour or so. But yes; I think it's a pity that such a high-tech-described company doesn't make their lights with a real heatsinking and regulation. They could then be way better and attractive for even more flashoholics!
And I am sure more flashoholics would buy them though a higher price. But yes; fewer non-flashoholics would, and there may be the reason? We are in the minority among the flashlight buyers...

Regards, Patric

 

[mcnair55]

If you live in the UK Led Lenser are easy to buy off the shelf in many outlets,try buying another make with a decent choice you would find it near on impossible,you would have to go the internet route.Sports type places have the odd Gerber but Led Lenser supply the retailer with a decent glass display cabinet.
I have a P3 and a K3 and have no issues at all with them,they do a job for me and that is all I am bothered about.

 

[McAllan]

M7 lol, now the circuit drops the output to 60%, lol.
http://translate.google.de/translat...nlampen-test.de/reviews/preview-led-lenser-m7

Any news about M14, is the circuit the same? :green:

If you look here you can see that the M14 is supposed to have two energy modes. (And here how to change the mode).
There's the supposed to be a constant current mode and an economy mode - the economy mode reminding of the old resistor method.
That sounds quite interesting. You have to click like crazy to change it though

Odd if the M7 isn't the same as M14 except size and power source :thinking:

 

[Egsise]

If you look here you can see that the M14 is supposed to have two energy modes....

Didn't you read the article that I linked, the M7 has two modes, just like M14?

In addition to the various modes that will be described later still, the M7 has two modes cross-energy programs, from Zweibrüder as "Energy Saving Mode" and "constant current mode" means.

​

In the latter, the lamp starts with maximum brightness, which remains constant for a few minutes and falls in the next few minutes to 60 percent of the maximum brightness.

​

These 60 percent remain set until the batteries are empty.

​

In this program, the brightness is regulated only through the built-in temperature-control unit.

​

In the energy saving program to start the lamp behaves exactly as though the brightness is turned down to 50 percent here and 25 minutes to 15 percent.

Like you said, it would be odd if M14 circuit isn't the same....constant current mode that drops the output by design...
I know that the average joe don't know or care about that, they are just happy that the battery lasts longer and now there is strobe etc.

Icon rogues, who remembers those..

 

[kramer5150]

ALL THOSE WHINING ABOUT THE RESISTOR AND DIRECT DRIVE

Has anyone actually tried some of the newer M-series? And especially the M14 which should have addressed many if not all if the criticism.
I agree that their past direct drives and partly their resistor driven as P14 are

Nope, I certainly would like to though. 4xeneloopAA + regulation:thumbsup:

Its not exported to the US... its an Eu / Au model only AFIAK.

 

[jimmy1970]

It is true that in Australia, the best lights available in retail stores are generally going to be LLs. I had a look at the P7 etc and agree that they are nicely made with a very smooth finish.

Really, they seem to be more of a casual users type of light. According to my local camping shop, they do sell well. After showing him a couple of my lights (Quark AA2 Tactical, Fenix TK20), he agreed that the Fenix & Quark lights would sell better because of the standard AA battery configuration - he couldn't believe how powerful they were on only 2 AA cells. People just don't know what their missing when shopping retail. They probably don't want to know - torches and just for looking at stuff in the dark, right?

James....

 

[Jash]

It is true that in Australia, the best lights available in retail stores are generally going to be LLs. I had a look at the P7 etc and agree that they are nicely made with a very smooth finish.

Really, they seem to be more of a casual users type of light. According to my local camping shop, they do sell well. After showing him a couple of my lights (Quark AA2 Tactical, Fenix TK20), he agreed that the Fenix & Quark lights would sell better because of the standard AA battery configuration - he couldn't believe how powerful they were on only 2 AA cells. People just don't know what their missing when shopping retail. They probably don't want to know - torches and just for looking at stuff in the dark, right?

James....

Then we MUST do what we can to educate our unenlightened fellow Aussies.

I am showing ALL my friends and such as come in contact with me, my Fenix's, Nitecore and Quark (sorry, it was your day off, will be in soon) and none of them can believe what they see.

We here in the land of Kevin get shafted when it comes to quality lighting. And to top it off, most people still think an Eveready Dolphin is a bright light.

ARRGGGHHHH!!! WE NEED MORE LIGHT!!

 

[McAllan]

Didn't you read the article that I linked, the M7 has two modes, just like M14?

Like you said, it would be odd if M14 circuit isn't the same....constant current mode that drops the output by design...
I know that the average joe don't know or care about that, they are just happy that the battery lasts longer and now there is strobe etc.

Icon rogues, who remembers those..

Perhaps not enough I guess
Agree the stepped constant current sounds odd... At least if it steps down after only a few minutes - what's the purpose of that?
The optimal would one level for when batteries are full and the last one(s) to preserve some light long after they're practically empty (at least with alkalines that is).

But I still miss some information. Would be nice if there were user manuals online to study. The light manufacturers could really learn something from the general electronics manufacturers.

Oh well. We'll see what the M14 will be like when I finally receive it.

 

[McAllan]

Its not exported to the US... its an Eu / Au model only AFIAK.

Perhaps it's just because it is so new :thinking:
And since LL is by brand German (!= where made though) then it occurs naturally for new models to come here first. Just like when M*g comes with new models in the US first etc.

Give it a month or two and I'm sure it'll be available most places.

 

[JaguarDave-in-Oz]

Really, they seem to be more of a casual users type of light. According to my local camping shop, they do sell well. After showing him a couple of my lights (Quark AA2 Tactical, Fenix TK20), he agreed that the Fenix & Quark lights would sell better because of the standard AA battery configuration - he couldn't believe how powerful they were on only 2 AA cells. People just don't know what their missing when shopping retail.

I would prefer my P7 ran on AA's instead of AAA's but I'd want it to stay the same size or it would just be the even better but far less pocketable p14.

I have all three torches you mention, had them all for a while now and frankly the P7 does a better job for me than either of the others. Unfortunately what it doesn't do is fit in my pocket as well as the AA2 tactical and it doesn't have a clip (TK20 is useless in that respect in my environment with its silly un-reversable bezel up clip).

My AA2 tactical is quite pocketable since I now run mine off a single 17670 but it can't see anywhere near as far in either R2 or R5 versions though the spill is wider than the P7 on flood.

I will admit to some bias here. I admit I can't stand beams that have a separately defined bright ball shaped central spot surrounded by a large much dimmer spill. That very distinctly separate central spot is one of the half dozen or so reasons I hate my Fenix TK20 (and my quark's turbos are little better) and I'm guessing it's also why I'm finding my new Eagletac p20c2 MkII so damned great, it throws reasonably and the spot fades so smoothly and progressivley into the spill that it's not like having two completely separate torches in the one beam that so many othe rtorches feel like. Great beam shape on the P20c2MkII but it still can't compete for amount of light on the target with my P7 though. The LLP7 manages its light extremely well that it lords it all over many other fancier brands who have much higher lumens ratings. I've had to buy a lot of torches to come up with one that works as effectively in my environment.

 

[McAllan]

Oh well. We'll see what the M14 will be like when I finally receive it.

Got it today :twothumbs
However there wasn't a user manual for the M14
They said it was a "known issue" with the UK package. I don't see a need to return it but I will try to see if I can hunt one - either English or German - either is fine with me.
Hey I even got a very low twin prime serial number! :naughty:

Haven't done any long tests to can't comment on that yet.
Flood is very nice. Spot is... well very spotty Approx. the size of the spot in Fenix TK20 but much more intense as it's lens can direct most of the spill too. Can be I do some measurements in the near future when I get some time.

UI is quite nice too and rather unique. It's sort of a mix between forward and reverse click. From off press to momentary on (with 130%) and you may morse with it if you want. Press and click and it'll turn up in 100% mode. Actually subjective there's only a very thin hair of difference between 100 and 130% - just as expected. While on you can soft click like a reverse click to advance modes. When in 100% mode and you press and hold (still a soft click) the light fades slowly in and out between 100 and 15% or so. Release at the wanted level.
To sum up. Practically all the positives of both forward and reverse click almost without their drawbacks - very nice!

It uses PWM regulation for dimming. But at a very high frequency (tint don't change like PD20). My guess would be around 5-10 kHz based on the sound I hear by lighting on a solar cell connected to some earphones.

Just for fun I bought the M1 too. A simple single CR123A based one with 100%, 15% and strobe - only a little bit longer than the Fenix PD20 (Q5). Despite being rated lower lumen wise it's noticeable brighter than my Q5 PD20 (or LD20 as they're practically the same). Again nice flood to a tight spot. Although not as tight as the M14 naturally but still no problem out throwing PD/LD20.
The M1 is a forward click. Wonder why they chose that. It would have benefited more from a reverse click as it's driver is like the typical driver without memory - short power interruption to move to next mode.
M1 uses PWM regulation too. Not as high frequency but IMHO high enough not to be an annoying (unlike Fenix LD01/05, MiniM*g Rebel and many DX lights etc.).

So far I'm quite impressed with the lights. My only fear is the lenses is made of plastic not glass - wonder how's the best way to clean them when they get too dirty.