BentHeadTX said:
I love my NiMH batteries!
Still use my nads and don't want a pocket flashlight bomb taking them off. We were testing a Milwaukee 28V 3.0AH Lithium-Ion pack on the Cadex analyzer and after an hour, there was a crackling sound the the Cadex went nuts and started alarming. The battery is now dead and will be heading back to Milwaukee (they cost $129 a piece) Not sure who makes those things but they charge very fast and dump over 60 amps when called upon.
I once remember reading something about Sony Li-Ion and Milwalkee. Sony makes some very special cells for tool purposes, which are quite different than their normal 18650G8 2550mAH cells (the G8 have over twice cell power density at 545WH/L):
Main Specifications of High-Power Output Cylindrical Lithium Ion Battery»
Cell Type 18650V
Size diameter:18mm, height:65mm
Capacity (0.2CmA) 1600mAh
Standard Charging Voltage 4.2V-2.5V
Energy Density 250Wh/L
Max. Output 10 Amps
Weight 44g
Cell Type 26650VT
Size diameter: 26mm, height:65mm
Capacity (0.2CmA): 2500mAh
Standard Charging Voltage: 4.1V-2.5V
Energy Density: 250Wh/L
Max. Output: 50 Amps
Weight: 90g
High power Cylindrical Lithium Ion battery (V Cell, VT Cell Series)
By using Nickel/Manganese mixture in the positive electrode, stability in high temperature conditions have been achieved, also achieving safe usage with high level of current, this being the characteristics of V/VT series. By the combination with high-voltage, which is the characteristics of lithium ion batteries, usage in the high-power output application field (such as power tools, cleaners, motor assisted bicycles) will be ideal, where conventionally Nickel-Cadmium, Nickel-Hydrogen batteries were used. In the 18650V cell, maximum output of 10A, and in the 6650VT cell, maximum output of 50A have been achieved.
I also see that Molicel brokered a deal with Milwaukee:
"Molicel® has been a recognized industry leader in the research & development of manganese based lithium-ion cells for the past decade. Using lithium manganese oxide (LiMn2O4) in the positive electrode of the new IMR26700 cell allows .... currents in excess of 100A.
By eliminating cobalt from the IMR26700 cell ... while providing exceptional safety characteristics. Further developments of the IMR26700 cell will provide fast charge capability, allowing cells to be fully charged in as little as 15 minutes."
http://www.molienergy.com/Press Releases/release040117.htm
Then there are the special Toshiba Li-Ion cells from early last year, that are rapid charge, which use a nanotechnology in them:
http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/press/2005_03/pr2901.htm
Panasonic recommends charge rates of 0.7C for their cells, and if below 2.9V on the discharge, then 0.1C. They also don't like you discharging their cells below 3.0V. They only recommend discharging their cells at 1.0C. And they do not want you to discharge their cells at temperatures above 60 degrees C.
http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/battery/oem/images/pdf/Panasonic_LiIon_Precautions.pdf
http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/battery/oem/images/pdf/Panasonic_LiIon_Charging.pdf
Molicel specifies a maximum discharge rate of 1.67 C, a discharge voltage cut-off of 2.5V, and a maximum discharge temp of 60 degrees C:
http://www.molienergy.com/specs/ICR-18650J.pdf
Varta specifies a maximum discharge rate of 2.0C (4800mA), a discharge voltage cut-off of 2.75V, and a maximum discharge temperature of 60 degrees C, and even carry the UL1642 rating, but they don't specify to what level the comply. (keep in mind, their older cell is not rated at the 2.0C discharge rate)
http://www.varta-microbattery.com/en/mb_data/documents/data_sheets/DS56624.pdf
Don't care about treating these things safe?
" Curtis Sathre said it was like a bomb going off. His 13-year-old son Michael stood stunned, his ears ringing, hand gushing blood and body covered in black ash. In a split second last August, fragments from Michael's exploding cell phone had hit him between the eyes and lodged in the ceiling of the family's home in Oceanside, Calif." WASHINGTON (AP), 2004
You can bet that cell phone makers are using quite a few techinques in an attempt to keep these things from turning into bombs.
"The CPSC is trying to determine if improved venting is enough by itself to ensure safety. "We have seen temperatures as high as 600 degrees, and you can have a torch-like effect if these batteries don't function properly," Wolfson said. "
Folks have attempted to bury the issue by saying these issues are caused by aftermarket cells, but let me assure you, there have been quite a few cases where these things go off with the original factory cells.
Companies who know what they are doing, have been the subject of Li-Ion cell recalls, and there have been a whole multitude of cases listed which include cells exploding, bursting, fire:
Black Diamond, Soliras Headlamp Li-Ion Batteries,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml05/05043.html
Apple (2004), PowerBook G4 and iBook G4, Battery Manufacturer: LG Chem Ltd.,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml04/04201.html
EV Global Motors, Mini E-Bike electric bicycles,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml02/02251.html
Thomson, DVD player,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml05/05139.html
Nikon (Nov 2005) Cameras,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml06/06023.html
Kyocera Cell Phone (Nov 2004),
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml04/04068.html
Polaroid (Dec 2005) DVD players,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml06/06060.html
Dell (multiple)(most recent-Dec 2005) Laptops,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml06/06056.html
Minitec, portable DVD players,
http://www.cpsc.gov/CPSCPUB/PREREL/prhtml05/05187.html
Page 4 of this document, talks about the multitude of safety measures that have been put in place on Li-Ion cells to prevent them from exploding, and for good reason:
http://www.cpsc.gov/LIBRARY/FOIA/meetings/mtg04/battery.pdf
Remember, I am not saying avoid Li-Ion cells, just be careful, they really can be dangerous, especially if mistreated during discharge/charge, and remember, there are a variety of protection mechanisms that I feel are really important.