ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, firsthand account)

[oldgrandpajack]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Lunarmodule:

Sorry to hear about your injuries. Hope you heal up quickly.

I've been sticking with Surefire brand batteries, in my multiple cell flashlights, thinking that I'd be protected from an incident of this type. But now I guess I had better buy a tester. Up till now, I have been putting the off brand batteries in single cell flashlights only.

Thanks for sharing with us, so we can all learn from your experience.

oldgrandpajack

 

[David_Campen]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

But now I guess I had better buy a tester.

There is no evidence that one of these testers will be of any use. No one knows what is causing these 123 primary cells to "vent with flame"; it could just as well be that the strong spring on the Pelican is crushing some cells and causing an internal short.

 

[mattyg]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Holy Crap Man! That's scary. I thought I was on the bleeding edge running unprotected 18650's in my ROP. Now I've gotta worry about primaries too? Dern!

Glad you are relatively unscathed. If nothing else it is a wake up call for the rest of us. Sorry you had to be the one.

 

[EricMack]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Wow, Steve, glad you are allright!! What a scary thing to have happen, especially when you aren't pushing anything, and thus really off-guard. :duck:
Sounds like no dancing for you for awhile and sorry you had to be the one to wake a few of us up! I sure never worried about primaries before this. Maybe some Kevlar and safety glasses for some of these crazy Mods we seem to love! Time to go print off some of the warning threads you mentioned.

Hope you are feeling better, Steve. Sorry you "took one for the team."

Mack :wave:

 

[js]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

David Campen,

No. Not true. We do have evidence that points the finger at mis-matched cells, (one used or as if used, the other new).

A ZTS style tester would elminate that possibility. If you know that ALL of your cells are 80 percent or better, than there is no chance of polarity reversal and reverse charging (and thus explosion).

The metal can of a primary 123 is way strong enough to withstand the pelican spring. I highly doubt that that is the issue, although, yes, an internal short would be very bad. However, an internal short occurence would not need to, and would not even be all that likely to coincide with running the light.

 

[David_Campen]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

David Campen,

No. Not true. We do have evidence that points the finger at mis-matched cells, (one used or as if used, the other new).

Is that evidence posted here?

 

[greg_in_canada]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

If one cell had gone to 0 and then started reverse charging wouldn't the light have dimmed to orange or no light at all? From Lunar's original report it doesn't seem like that happened.

Greg

 

[greg_in_canada]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

It's even more scary to image what would have happened if the flashlight didn't have a rubber button to vent from. Pipe bomb?

Glad you are okay.

Greg

 

[WAVE_PARTICLE]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Holy Crap, Lunar....

I'm glad this thing wasn't in your pocket..... This is hitting too close to home. It just seems that this keeps happening more to Lithium batteries and not as much for Lithium ion batteries. And ANOTHER PELICAN M6?!?!?!?

This begs the question: IS THIS TECHNOLOGY SAFE?

Even odds of 1 in one million is not acceptable. This is quite dissappointing to read, but I'm am thankful that you came out of this relatively intact.

Maybe as a rule of thumb, whenever you get a light delivered to your door, throw out the batteries that are in it and put in fresh ones. Because you never know if the olds ones are good. Even if it was from a reputable person. Sometimes people can just grab any set of batteries they see on the table and throw them into a light before shipping out.

I'm so glad this was not worse, my friend. Your story will help people recognize the early warning signs of trouble.....even if it is only seconds..

WP

 

[David_Campen]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

I am very sorry this happened.
...
I have spoken to people at several factories including domestic big names and they all have incidents similar to this. This is being caused by mixing batteries that are not exactly matched.
...

Seems like idle speculation to me. What does "exactly matched mean". Can you specify a test that will determine if 2 cells are "exactly matched"?

 

[David_Campen]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

And ANOTHER PELICAN M6?!?!?!?

It seems that the Pelican M6 is the common denominator in these events. There are a lot of Surefires lights running 123 primary cells. Why haven't these "vent with flame" events been reported with Surefire lights?

 

[s.duff]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

wow!!! that totally sucks!!! glad to hear that you are ok. are you going to send it to pelican and ask for a replacement?

 

[metalhed]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

I know this is a strong statement, but whatever...


If these events are limited to a specific brand or make of light, the manufacturer should test said lights until failures are reproduced, and then implement design changes to prevent future occurances. Mind you I said if...but, at this point I believe the evidence suggests a problem with the PM6. Unless of course other examples of this kind of catastrophic failure has been seen in other lights.

Surefire has many lights with multiple-cell 123 configurations...any reports of this type of failure in those lights?


If, in fact, the failures are not related to a specific design feature in flashlights, then the cells themselves are, IMHO, a defective product.

I don't mean any individual brand...but instead primary CR123 cells themselves.

Unless these types of failures are common to other primary cells (AA, D, C, etc.) and I'm not aware of it, these cells are not safe for untrained individuals to use.

I mean come on now...how many average joes even think about this problem? Think a cop or soldier has the time to 'match' cells? I don't think so.

What happens when one of these goes off on a nightstand or other spot close to a person's head or face? Do we have a death instead of a bloody foot? (sorry LM, I'm not trying to minimize your pain any )


I'm starting to believe there is a much larger issue here than we think.

 

[David_Campen]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

If, in fact, the failures are not related to a specific design feature in flashlights, then the cells themselves are, IMHO, a defective product.

I don't mean any individual brand...but instead primary CR123 cells themselves.

Unless these types of failures are common to other primary cells (AA, D, C, etc.) and I'm not aware of it, these cells are not safe for untrained individuals to use.

I mean come on now...how many average joes even think about this problem? Think a cop or soldier has the time to 'match' cells? I don't think so.

My thoughts, exactly.

 

[Navck]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

*Points at other topic with exploded M6*

 

[AlexGT]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Has anyone checked the light assembly spring on the pelican to see if the diameter is just the correct size to cause a short between the + top and the - sleeve? I am thinking that maybe that is the cause of the problem, when you screw the battery cap all the way in maybe the battery gets squished just right into the 2 springs to cause a short on 1 cell, overheat, vent and then take out the 2nd battery.

AlexGT

 

[David_Campen]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Edit:

 

[Navck]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Sorry about that, didn't read Kevin's post since I'm the world's slowest computer right now ( ). However, I would like to point everyone to the older thread with ANOTHER exploded M6 as well.

 

[TinderBox (UK)]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

quite a few of us bought defective 18650`s a few months ago that were supposed to be protected.

still waiting for replacements.

glad your OK Lunarmodule.

regards.

 

[AlexGT]

Re: ROAR of the Pelican (CR123 Explosion during use, underwear change required)

Lunarmodule, can you measure the diameter of the + top on the battery that was in contact with the bulb spring and the inside diameter of the bulb spring, I think that there is where the short originated.

AlexGT