Sharpening Help

[Hitthespot]

Most common sharpening mistakes is they are hitting the bevels and not the edge. So get a sharpie and mark the edge. Try sharpening and look at the edge with a strong light. If the edge stays marked with sharpie, its not being sharpened. Best piece of equipment for me is a minimum 15x loupe ( magnifying eyepiece ) to see clearly whats happening to the edge.

Thanks Kevin, I will give it a try the next time I sharpen. I will try it on one of my cheapies first!

Bill

 

[Joe Talmadge]

Kevin, I find that the sharpie trick isn't accurate enough to tell whether you're hitting the edge or not. The best, most accurate way is to raise a burr that's big enough that you can feel, along the entire length of the edge. That's the only sure way to know you've exposed fresh steel on the edge, eyeballing it -- even through a loupe -- isn't enough. I do use a sharpie to gauge my progress and keep from getting frustrated when I'm doing re-profiling, I think it's a great tool .... but once the sharpie is worn away, in my opinion you should not stop until you feel a burr.

 

[Joe Talmadge]

You have peaked my interest on the Razor Edge. If this will help teach me how to then maybe this is a better product. The cost is better that's for sure. How about some more details about this product.

Thanks

Bill

Bill, just to be clear, I'm not saying the Razor Edge clamps are a "better product" than the Edge Pro, the Edge Pro is extremely high quality and many people get great results on it. But, if you want to learn how to freehand sharpen eventually, nothing beats the Razor's Edge approach, IMO. You put the clamp on the blade, doing some very simple geometry to make sure the clamp is in the right spot. At that point, you put the clamped blade on the stone and sharpen using the exact same movements and methods as if you were sharpening freehand. Sharpen 50 knives this way, and your muscle memory will be pretty good -- I found I magically went from only being able to dull a knife freehand, to being able to do a competent job, after I'd used the Razor Edge for a while. It took a bit more freehand practice to get even better.

The downside to the Razor Edge clamp is that you have a very narrow range of angles. Basically, the clamp is built to whatever angle Juranitch picked, and you can very slightly modify that angle by adjusting the location that you put the clamp. This is not a disadvantage to a beginner whose primary goal is to learn to sharpen. But down the road, you'll want more freedom to pick your own angles -- to really bring out the best properties of well-chosen, well-heat-treated steels, you need to pick the right angle. Not an issue for you at this point, though.

All of the sharpeners mentioned here all endeavor to do the same thing -- to hold the blade/stone angle steady, through various methods (though only the Razor Edge uses the exact same mechanics as freehand). You still need to pick the right angles and grits, and you still need to grind in some relief ("backbevel") before you start sharpening.

 

[Styerman]

I have an Edge Pro , hardly ever sees use , mostly I use a Spyderco Sharpmaker ( the new model that does backbevels ) . Forget the Lansky , works but is a PITA , an messy . I also have a platoon of waterstones , ceramic flatstones , an DMT flatstones . These mostly ge used for real hardship cases people bring to me . The trick is to get to yourstuff before it gets too dull , touch up on the Sharpmaker , and backbevel . The Sharpmaker has a very goo DVD tutorial . In the kitchen I use medium Crok Stick ceramic rods .

Chris

 

[Hitthespot]

Thanks Joe, I understand perfectly what your saying. I would like to be able to sharpen freehand. My Randalls all come with a stone in the sheath for touch up work in the field. A lot of good they do you if you can't sharped without some machine you don't have with you.
In a survival situation I wouldn't want to be saying, "I wish I had my sharpening machine with me."

Again thank you. I think I will get the Razor Edge first ( because of cost ) and I may down the road get the EdgePro.

Which kit do you recommend? 6" or 8" stones?

Bill

 

[Joe Talmadge]

I actually never used the Razor Edge stones, only the clamps. I typically sharpened on the big Spyderco ceramic stones. My advice would be to go as big as you can afford -- if the 8" stones don't cost too much for you, go for that. Also look around at other big synthetic and diamond stones. There's nothing magic about the Razor Edge stones, the magic is in the clamps, so just get whatever stones work for you.

 

[nerdgineer]

...The best, most accurate way is to raise a burr that's big enough that you can feel, along the entire length of the edge. That's the only sure way to know you've exposed fresh steel on the edge...

+1 to Joe. I sharpen freehand and that's how you know you've reached the "edge". I highly recommend this book which makes it all so clear (check you're library...). On a few selected kitchen knives, I try for a near "zero edge" which has minimum or almost no bevel, and a shallow flat grind all the way from the spine in. Do that once (took hours of hand grinding for a 10 inch chefs knife), and the knife edge will be easy to maintain for years if the steel is good and you don't abuse the blade. Down side is the sides of the blade are no longer shiny which used to annoy my wife until she got the experience of working with properly sharpened kitchen knives.

I think the jigs are nice if you want to keep your knife pretty, but if you are willing for it to look used, a hand honed near zero edge blade is very hard to beat.

 

[chmsam]

Joe and several others who have posted here know their stuff (go ahead and google their names and find out why I am saying that). I'd only add a couple of things from my experience.

First, the use of a marker on the edge will get you into the ballpark as to the angle and make it easier for you to get to the burr or wire edge stage that tells you that you've got the right angle.

Second, as for having a take along set up for sharpening which can be used for survival, a Lansky kit with their screw clamp works well, the Sharpmaker could also fit the bill (I don't have one myself but it seems to be easily portable), but the best and most portable option is being able to work freehand with a good stone or two, or even a combination stone. That would be the most compact choice.

 

[jzmtl]

I've never used clamps, but wouldn't you have trouble with knives that has no flat spot, i.e. flat grind or double bevel? The angle you set on clamps isn't necessarily what you get at the edge.

 

[scott.cr]

Just in case this is of any use - if you own a Benchmade, you can send it to the factory and they sharpen it free. All they ask is a $5 shipping/handling fee to send your knife back.

I sent my Nimravus to them for sharpening (after I trashed the blade shoving it into a steel-spring mattress) and it came back looking like new.

 

[J!m]

There is nothing better than a competent hand on a wet stone...

Barring that, I use a small, pocket sized ceramic cylinder set, permanently mounted in a plastic holder for my knife touch-ups. I mention this, because of my first statement. If you let them go too long, you have to re-establish the edge, as has been mentioned.

I touch-up the edge with the ceramic rods every time I use the knife. This way, it is finely honed for the next time I need it. Maybe you don't need a razor edge next time, but maybe you do...

And, I also agree with this: if it's a Benchmade, send it back to them. Once you get it back, keep it finely honed by touching up after every use, and you will not very often need to get into the stones.

If you do go for a free-held oil stone, use a book of matches as your guide. That is just about the perfect angle (in my experience) and usually easy to get a hold of. The more complex edges (three bevels etc.) may require one of those 'pro' sharpening systems, where you can alter the sharpening edge the needed three times.

A barber's leather honing strap is not too expensive, and a great 'final touch' for a truly wicked blade edge... Old leather drive belts work great too, but thoe are likely to be more expensive than a honing strap because of the age...

 

[nerdgineer]

...A barber's leather honing strap is not too expensive, and a great 'final touch' for a truly wicked blade edge... Old leather drive belts work great too...

I sometimes use a poor man's alternative to a barber's strap: I glue a piece of old leather belt (finished side up) to a longer piece of 2"x2". Then I put a little fine polish (simichrome or auto polish) on the leather. The hard backing keeps the leather flat. It converts a shaving sharp edge into one which is shinier and shaves smoother...

 

[J!m]

Good idea!

Be careful now-a-days with leather belts. Many have applied or even painted-on outer coverings... It is getting increasingly hard to get a decent leather belt any longer!

The last decent one I got was made in Italy...

 

[nerdgineer]

Yeah, I shoulda mentioned, OLD piece of natural and smooth leather belt, not something with a finish. Thanks.

 

[Hitthespot]

Just in case this is of any use - if you own a Benchmade, you can send it to the factory and they sharpen it free. All they ask is a $5 shipping/handling fee to send your knife back.

I sent my Nimravus to them for sharpening (after I trashed the blade shoving it into a steel-spring mattress) and it came back looking like new.

I've often thought of this because there are places that will sharpen your knives. My problem is I have and use some knives which to me are not replacable. I wouldn't think of sending any of my old Randalls through any kind of mail service. Plus you just don't know what someone might do once they got it in their hands. I'm afraid I just wouldn't see them again and they have more than just monitary value. Just a personal hang up. Now my S&W, Kershaw's, even my Hoffmans would probably be OK.

Bill