Ultrafire 18650 3000mA exploded

[zipplet]

Li-ion is definately not to be messed with. The only lights I own that take bare Li-ion cells are my Lummis. Even though they are single cell I always measure the voltage of the cell before and after charging to ensure safety - not charging a cell that has been depleted too far, and making sure my charger is doing it's job.

This incident is unfortunate.

 

[calebra]

i bought 4 of those, 3 take an hour to charge @3A and the 4th takes at least 2 hours at the same rate. needless to say i dont use these cells in any light, a waste of money.

 

[Nil Einne]

To avoid confusion I will clarify the Pila IBC was not involved in the explosion at all, I was simply responding to a comment someone made.

I'm not sure if it's "real" by your definitions, but the Pila IBC does have a "CE Approved" logo on it.

I would guess by real he/she means it actually complies with CE. Anyone can of course print something onto a sticker or whatever and many junk manufacturers do of course stick CE marks on their products even though they don't comply similar to UL and other things. The slightly more honest Chinese ones will claim it means "China Export" when queried not Conformité Européenne http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_mark (many don't even use a correct CE mark although whether that's intentional or incompetence I don't know I'm guessing the later) http://highfields-arc.6te.net/geninfo/thecemark.htm . In most developed countries with strong consumer protection laws such claims would not likely help anything but outside of Europe people may not care or know what the CE is so they may be able to get away with it. If it really complies you should be able to get documentation from someone similar to e.g. http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/store/catalog/accucel-A6.jpg for the Accucel.

The Pila IBC may not exactly be junk but while that means it's less likely to have a fake CE, that's no guarantee in itself it really complies. If reliable sellers in Europe sell it's probably really CE otherwise they'd be in deep poop. However your best bet is probably to ask for some seller or Pila themselves to provide the documentation. (I didn't find any from a quick search.) Of course documentation itself isn't a guarantee but most don't go that far and you could always research it further.

 

[DM51]

Nil Einne, your post is not relevant. This incident had nothing to do with a Pila IBC charger - it was a junk Ultrafire charger with mismatched junk Ultrafire cells in it.

 

[Quension]

Nil Einne wasn't directly commenting on the incident that started the thread, he was continuing the sub-discussion on finding certified electrically safe consumer 2-bay Li-ion chargers. That sub-discussion started with advice to modify a charger designed for self-contained consumer electronics (like a cell phone), or go for a hobby charger, because all the simple ones are supposedly unsafe.

Why is that sub-discussion not relevant now, when it's already been running for two weeks? Honestly asking here, especially since finding safe chargers seems to be entirely relevant to reducing the chances of an unpleasant incident...

 

[DM51]

There are dozens and dozens of other threads that discuss the Pila IBC, and every single one of them makes it crystal clear that it is an excellent charger, by far and away the best of the 2-bay "plug and play" chargers.

It is quite unnecessary to head so far off topic in this thread as to traduce the Pila IBC's reputation by making a post in this thread that could be misinterpreted as meaning that it had something to do with the incident in post #1 and therefore that there may be something wrong with it.

 

[Nil Einne]

There are dozens and dozens of other threads that discuss the Pila IBC, and every single one of them makes it crystal clear that it is an excellent charger, by far and away the best of the 2-bay "plug and play" chargers.

It is quite unnecessary to head so far off topic in this thread as to traduce the Pila IBC's reputation by making a post in this thread that could be misinterpreted as meaning that it had something to do with the incident in post #1 and therefore that there may be something wrong with it.

I apologise, I didn't think people would make that mistake. I have clarified my post to avoid the confusion. Feel free to PM me with suggestions if you feel it still isn't clear enough.

While I agree it's OT, the question of whether the Pila IBC has CE rating was raised by someone in t his thread, which someone else responded to without apparently really understanding the question. I felt it necessary to clarify what I felt was obviously meant and at the same time point out that having a CE mark doesn't guarantee an item is compliant with CE. In fact, the WF-139 which was involved with this case does have a CE mark but almost definitely is not compliant with CE somewhat proving the point I was making. I would also point out that again that being a excellent charger, which I never disputed, doesn't mean the Pila IBC is CE compliant.

I won't discuss this anymore, for starters I don't really care about whether or not the Pila IBC has CE and I do agree it's gone too far off topic now but I do think it is vital people understand that having a CE mark in no way guarantees an item is compliant with CE.

 

[unclevit]

I use Ultrafire 18650 3.7v 3000mAh all the times (in case it's rechargeable cr123a 3.0v-3.6v, i will go for GL brand which is very good). After each charge I will check if the voltage is within limit before putting them back into my flashlight, or stock as spares. I don't use different type or brand of bats in the same light (change all bats at the same time, not half of it). Always the same brand/model/voltage class/mAh. And lastly, I used auto cut-off in my charger (which is Ultrafire WF-139). But becareful, UF is a famous brand and always come out with copies, yes by their own chinese people. There are hi-end chinese lights and batteries companies, but you have to pick the right ones. Never had a problem with genuine chinese brands batteries in all of my night patrols

 

[325addict]

I now read the complete thread on "messerforum.de" and these UF batteries turned out to have no protection PCB.
His wife already noticed "the light was very dim" so the batteries will have been severely over-discharged.
The cells had been charged a few dozen times, and were 1 year old, who knows how many times the cells had been overdischarged by now??
Then, he charged two of the three batteries overnight(!) in a WF-139 charger (version still unknown) and one cell he charged later, this one was "not hot" when it came out. Hmmmm, it should have been COLD, even the slightest warm-up of a Li-cobalt cell NOT caused by the charger itself should ring all alarm bells

Coincidence or not, I have two of these cells also.
I noticed from the beginning, that after charging one of them had a slightly higher voltage, and they just could not hold voltage very well under heavy loads (think of incans drawing in excess of 2 Amps).
You could actually SEE it with your bare eyes, my Surefire M6 didn't have as much output as with 2 AW cells...
Not until recently, I knew why this happened... one of the cells is just pure junk! It reaches a capacity of just over 800mAh, while the other one seems sound @ 2400mAh.
I'll ditch the bad one as soon as possible...

Timmo.

 

[Monocrom]

I was fortunate in getting one of the better versions of the WF-139 charger awhile back. Still, even if you luck out like I did, that Ultrafire charger is a very basic unit. Charging cells overnight must NEVER be done! I charged my AW cells on it at work. I kept a constant eye on the charger. The moment the light turned from red to green, I pulled the cells out of it. I then placed the cells aside for a couple of hours to let them cool down before use. That charger has no shut-off feature. It'll keep charging . . . all night . . . If you leave it that way.

And once again, Ultrafire cells themselves are unreliable junk. I'm glad I didn't learn that lesson the hard way.

 

[jirik_cz]

I wouldn't be so sure that you have the better one. The "good" WF-139 sold by AW has no trickle charge and will completely stop charging when the light turns green.

 

[TooManyGizmos]

I wouldn't be so sure that you have the better one. The "good" WF-139 sold by AW has no trickle charge and will completely stop charging when the light turns green.

? Who tested it and found those results ?

Link please .

 

[jirik_cz]

There has been some reports, but I don't have the link. I verified it with my two samples.

 

[Monocrom]

It's just best not to put too much faith into Ultrafire products. Especially with their cells and chargers. I rely mainly on primary cells, so a basic charger is fine for my needs.

 

[LuxLuthor]

I rely mainly on primary cells, so a basic charger is fine for my needs.

You use a (basic) charger for primary cells?

I'm just kidding. I know that's not what you meant. :laughing:

 

[Makedonas]

Hi to all....

I was doing a little research on an ultrafire c8 that i want to buy on ebay, for a bicycle headlight setup.... and i fell on this page...

The light includes two 18650 Ultrafire protected batteries and a WF-139 charger. It also states that the light only takes one battery (which from what i've read on this topic makes it safer?).

Is there any way i can tell if they are protected and if this is going to be a safe setup?

I'm a complete newb to both lighting and batteries...

Are auction links allowed here? I'll post the product photos for now and if auction links are allowed i'll let me know so i can post it.

Thanks in advance to everyone.

[hotlinked images deleted - DM51]

 

[dtheo]

Can someone please explain the difference in discharging to 3.6, 3.5 and 2.75?
I have Trustfire protected cells which I have discharged below 3.6, but probably not below 2.75. I thought the protection would kick in if they got too low, but I never wanted to chance it.
After reading this thread, I am a little worried and trying to figure out how safe I am with these cells.
They run a bike lamp and are in multicell packs (holders), but not in a tube that can explode.

thanks

I did this some time ago:

 

[forexer]

Makedonas, I suggest you buy the light separately and get a good cell like AWs. Now that Aw offers 2900mah 18650s its even better for single cell lights. You also want a way better charger than that.

 

[biker1]

I am new to rechargeables, as I have always used 123A's.
I have just purchased AW 18650 2900mAh batteries Protected & Flat-top), and a Pila Charger.
I figured if I started off with what appears to be top of the line goods, I'll have less risk of something going wrong

I will test voltage after charging though, to make sure I am not Overcharged.
I will also test voltage after removing them from my light, after use. I don't know if that is necessary to do every time though. But I will test intermittently, unless suggested otherwise.
I don't buy cheap parts for my Bike, and I don't buy cheap ammo. Both can be hazardous to your life, and that is why I don't take a chance with cheap batteries or chargers. But I will try to puchase top quality stuff for a good price, as long as they are the real mcoy

I am getting the P-Rocket 800+ lumens which also has a protected circuit in it regarding discharge. I presume that means I will be double protected, between the protected circuit in the flashlight, in addition to the battery.
I don't know if all LED lights have a protected circuit built in. I would think they do, but am not sure.
Seems less trouble to use 123A's when possible, but I won't get the most out of my lights. I spent $120 between batteries and a charger, so hopefully I can put them to safe use.
I have read only good things about the Pila which is why I purchased it from BugOutGear.

Btw, Paul looks like he also injured his thumb. Looks like it could have been a UCL tear. Nevertheless, I hope you are having a good recovery, as it has been less than 3 months since your injuries.

 

[Keatah]

And an important warning for anyone running a multi Li-ion set up is to check the charge state of the batteries , as often one battery discharges faster than the other . So it might be an idea to number the batteries so you can periodically swap them from front to back , to give them more even discharge .

It wont make a difference what order you put two batteries, or 3 or 4 in.. They are all in series and see the same current regardless.