Water Heaters

[TedTheLed]

BB, Takagi installation couldn't have been simpler since mine is mounted on an outside wall, so venting was no problem. Attach water line in and out, plug it into AC, that's about it...(oh yes, one thing; check the temprature setting on the dip switches; make sure the norocketscientist plumber didn't set it to 180 F..)
The unit works fine with a 2 gpm shower, I have the same requirement here.
..just did a quick search on froogle and found quite a few places selling the TK Jr. for less than 600$ !

 

[bfg9000]

After doing some research and some thinking on the topic, I think the solution to the minimum flow on gas units is to put a small conventional electric hot water heater upstream of the gas unit (maybe 5 gal). This way, you get hot water on demand, but for large demand the gas unit kicks in.

Just a thought.

-john

I have a small electric tank heater placed after a large on-demand gas heater with a pilot light. I can get hot water from a little trickle at the tap (no need to open it half way just to get hot water), the hot water never runs out at high flow rates (where it is entirely heated by more economical gas) and I still have hot water if either gas or electric utilities are interrupted.

If you put it before the on-demand heater you'll have no low-flow hot water after high-demand use until the small tank heats back up, plus it'll cost more to heat the water in the tank with electricity each time than to maintain the temperature of gas preheated water.

 

[John N]

BFG, oops, sorry, that is what I meant.

-john

 

[Knifemaster]

I have a tank less Bosh gas water heater. The unit was very expensive to put in and I must say that I am vary disappointed in it . The water is never hot enough you have to wait a few minutes to have hot water running. You might save some money for the heating of the water vs a standard tank but you are wasting much more water because you have to run more of it to get the water hot. I would recommend that anyone considering a tank less gas water heater to get a good tank instead and put some silver foil insulation on it. The tank less Bosh is so bad in my opinion that I consider it to be a scam. What do you want to save gas? Or water? Because it is a trade off.

 

[TedTheLed]

Knife, sounds like your Bosch isn't working right. Is it an Aquastar? That was my first heater and it has been working great for the past 7 or 8 years..the water is heated instantly, (3 or 4 seconds for the echanger to heat up) and should be hot by the time it takes to get to wherever you are using it in the house.. is your heat control set high enough? Is the flow good -- or maybe you need to flush the built-up minerals out of the exchanger?

 

[Newuser01]

I agree with Tedtheled. I have a Bosch Aqastar (smallest unit). I bought it from HD and installed it with my brother. Using the same gas line and flu from the 50 gal tank unit used to be. This unit did not require SS vent and the same venting was used.
So now I have it mounted high on the wall and I've gained some space in the garage.

Pro: Well, I think everyone here knows what it is. So I wont repeat.
Cons:
1.Takes a bit to get hot water in the shower. (garage is opposite side of the house from shower.)
2.Can't get hot water for minimal use like rinsing dishes after washing.
3.uneven temps when taking shower.
4.Have to do de-scaling for the unit which I have yet to do. (still researching.) When you see cloudy hot water its time to do de-scaling.

My friend installed a Takagi unit before the 80 Gal gas fired boiler b/c he was not getting enough hot water to fill the hot tub in the house is very happy as the used hot water is being replaced with the hot water from Takagi unit. So there is always enough hot water for his family. It is installed next to the tank boiler and vented vertically out the wall with SS vent. The unit also has powered vent system. There is power outlet next to it so I did not have to run wires.

He is very happy with his install even though it cost him about $2000 to install.

Overall: Yes. I would do it again despite all the negative. But this time I will be installing the instant heater with small tank heater to act as a storage. You do need to do a lot of research and also it is hard to get plumbers who will service the unit. So, If you can find someone who is willing to service your unit, its worth it.

Regards.
PS. My unit is about 8 years old now and it is still very good IMO. Its a shame how little info, service and parts not avail for general public.

 

[turbodog]

I've tried to warn everyone. If you're new to this thread, please read my portions near the beginning.

The units *can* work, and work well. But it's far easier for them to *not* work well, and to not even work as well as a cheap regular water heater.

For the record, the envirotech unit I used would actually turn on at .3 gpm flow. That's pretty low for a 28.9KW unit.


Several of you would be far happier with a point of use heater at a commonly-used area like the kitchen sink. I also had 2 of them.

I have a tank less Bosh gas water heater. The unit was very expensive to put in and I must say that I am vary disappointed in it . The water is never hot enough you have to wait a few minutes to have hot water running. You might save some money for the heating of the water vs a standard tank but you are wasting much more water because you have to run more of it to get the water hot. I would recommend that anyone considering a tank less gas water heater to get a good tank instead and put some silver foil insulation on it. The tank less Bosh is so bad in my opinion that I consider it to be a scam. What do you want to save gas? Or water? Because it is a trade off.

 

[CandleLite]

I have a tank less Bosh gas water heater. The unit was very expensive to put in and I must say that I am vary disappointed in it . The water is never hot enough you have to wait a few minutes to have hot water running. You might save some money for the heating of the water vs a standard tank but you are wasting much more water because you have to run more of it to get the water hot. I would recommend that anyone considering a tank less gas water heater to get a good tank instead and put some silver foil insulation on it. The tank less Bosh is so bad in my opinion that I consider it to be a scam. What do you want to save gas? Or water? Because it is a trade off.

I find it quite interesting how YMMV. I have a Bosch tankless heater for about 3 years now and am satisfied with it. It does everything I expected of it. It provides ample hot water and is saving me money as well.

It is not perfect of course, you do have to wait for 10 or 15 seconds for the hot water to hit the tap and you should be aware of anyone else taking a shower before turning on a tap or they will get a cool surprise for a few seconds. Since there are only 2 of us in the house this works ok for us. Factor in 2 or 3 kids and it might not.

For these subjectively small inconveniences I figure that it will pay off its initial cost in about 5 1/2 years. After that it will continue to save me money for another 20 years in lower gas bills and the cost of replacing probably 2 regular water tanks. In this period of time we will have not burnt up some 200 gigajoules (?) of natural gas with its resultant polutants and not dumped 2 large cylinders of metal and glass in a dumpsite.

Works for me, but obviously not for everyone. As mentioned earlier, before deciding I studied up and spoke to anyone I could about tankless and got what I expected. Different strokes for different folks I guess. :touche: