Zebralight H600F c/d mk3 85cri and XM-L 2?

[tech25]

I put a lot of hard use on my H600Fd and c MKIII this summer camping, hiking, rock climbing, exc. and I have to say they are great headlamps. They surpass any other headlamp I have ever owned or tried and I am very happy with them.

What are your thoughts between the two of them regarding tints? Do you have a "w" to compare them with?

 

[Tachead]

What are your thoughts between the two of them regarding tints? Do you have a "w" to compare them with?

Well, they are both great but, each is better for different reasons/uses. The "d" is towards the cool side of neutral and is slightly brighter. It is better for daytime lighting tasks or when you are going between dark places and places lit by daylight(home renos, mechanics, wiring, etc.). It is also better for work related tasks as it is a sharper light that keeps you more awake if you get what I mean. Now the "c" is towards the warmer side of neutral and is a much more calming light. It is better for extended night time tasks in full darkness as it more closely matches moonlight. It is better for camping when your around the fire or in the tent late at night and relaxing and is much less harsh. It also is better if you wake up in the middle of the night and need to take a leak, for instance, because it is a warmer light and doesn't wake you up as much(preserves you night vision better).

Tint wise, the "d" is a more pure white light then the "c" and makes whites look more white. It has great contrast and renders most colours nicely. The "c" is quite a bit warmer and has a yellowy, golden hue to it but, it is more soothing and makes the greens and browns in the forest look a bit nicer I would say.

In conclusion, both are great lights and just excel at different things. I don't think I could get rid of either and I will be keeping both as I need redundancy(for safety) for my uses anyway. Both have above average colour rendering(not quite as good as a 219B but, close) and both have very clean and even tints and beam profiles.

No I dont have a "w" to compare but, it would be somewhere in the middle temp wise and would not render colours quite as well due to its lower CRI. It would be the good middle ground if you are willing to sacrifice some colour rendering and put up with more of a tint lottery.

 

[tech25]

Tint wise, the "d" is a more pure white light then the "c" and makes whites look more white. It has great contrast and renders most colours nicely. The "c" is quite a bit warmer and has a yellowy, golden hue to it but, it is more soothing and makes the greens and browns in the forest look a bit nicer I would say.

In conclusion, both are great lights and just excel at different things. I don't think I could get rid of either and I will be keeping both as I need redundancy(for safety) for my uses anyway. Both have above average colour rendering(not quite as good as a 219B but, close) and both have very clean and even tints and beam profiles.

No I dont have a "w" to compare but, it would be somewhere in the middle temp wise and would not render colours quite as well due to its lower CRI. It would be the good middle ground if you are willing to sacrifice some colour rendering and put up with more of a tint lottery.

Thank you! You are very descriptive! I recently got my first 219B light and compared to my triple xp-l 4k I have a tough time as to which I like better. (Also a bit tougher due to beam profile) I enjoy the relaxing part of the warmth- but the 219 is just..there.

I can't really make a decision since I can't tell if it's the tint or the cri that makes the difference to me. I have read up on both and until now just stuck with a 4k tint- malkoff and okluma, but when I am comparing it seems as if a 4k tint and a 5k with a high cri are pretty much the same with colors except for the 4k tint having a slight yellow tinge.

I mostly use my current headlamp mostly for indoor work, reading and infrequently for outdoors, and think all in all I might like the h600fd better. My other ZL are a sc600w and an H51fw- I have been wanting to upgrade the h51 for a long time- and I like the tint but as it is an Xpg, I don't have any green or blue in in and the color esp green is what bugs me in a light.

 

[dubliftment]

Well, they are both great but, each is better for different reasons/uses...

Thanks for detailing the differences. I am sure glad I went with the same setup and I am very much looking forward do the D that is currently in the mail. What astonishes me most about the H600Fc is the compact beam. It has a very even transition from the middle to the edges. There is no hotspot/ spill profile but it still has some throw to it. Remarkable - for me it works much better than the typical reflector/ clear lens and the 100% pure flood LED only setup. And the SC600Fd Plus which also has a reflector/ frosted lens is sometimes too floody, competely lacking throw and I therefore tend to use the higher modes more often.

Efficiency of the H600Fc might be a bit less than with the H600w II that I had previously, but this is no issue to me. Runtimes are still great and I would prefer the better quality of the light any day.

 

[StorminMatt]

Efficiency of the H600Fc might be a bit less than with the H600w II that I had previously, but this is no issue to me. Runtimes are still great and I would prefer the better quality of the light any day.

On the other hand, the efficiency of the H600Fc is still LOTS better than any multi-emitter Nichia 219 setup. I finally broke down and got an H600Fc at Illumination Supply. And on the way home, I did a night hike up Mission Peak. I was amazed that, in rather cool and windy conditions (which guarantee that the PID is not cutting back output much or at all), it was able to run at H1 for a little over an hour on a 3200mAH NCR18650BD. It didn't even get too warm. Admittedly, the weather was cool and windy. But even under these conditions, my Astrolux would have gotten uncomfortably warm to handle at a similar brightness level (which would have been the step down from max). Not to mention that the light would have dimmed rapidly and the battery would have been drained FAR sooner.

And let's not forget the tint - PERFECT (at least in my opinion) for a night hike. Just a nice warm white that REALLY brings out the colors of nature. Perhaps the CRI is rated somewhat lower than the S41. But I still MUCH prefer the 4000K Easywhite to the slightly greenish 5000K 219B in the S41. All in all, it looks like Cree and Zebralight CAN build lights with great tibts - if they put their minds to it. Now, all we need is a handheld light with this same emitter. Headlamps just don't work so well when you are in a cloud (like the one shrouding the summit of Mission Peak tonight) and when you are getting LOTS of condensation from breathing.

 

[Kraken]

I have a H600FW MKIII sitting in my cart, but I notice there's no "CRI" in the description. Is there in fact a "H600FW MKIII" and a H600FW MKIII CRI"? I have several lights that take the 18650 battery (Nitecore P12 and Fenix TK 75). I have several Nitcore NL189 3400mAh rechargeable batteries - is that a good match for the ZL H600FW? OR are there better options out there?

Thanks in advance for the direction.

 

[maukka]

The H600Fw III would be CRI80, see Zebralight's spreadsheet.

 

[Kraken]

The H600Fw III would be CRI80, see Zebralight's spreadsheet.

Thanks for the info - obviously a silly question, but I haven't studied up much on the technical aspects of the modern flashlight. I frequently see 3-4 technical terms in a single post that leave me scratching my head. Thanks for the patience.

 

[Trango]

Hello everyone!
I have been reading this forum for quite some time, but never found the need to register since I found the answers to all my questions just by reading (and I don't have much knowledge of flashlights to contribute). That changed with the last posts here. I lately decided to pull the trigger and go for a 18650 headlamp, and after reading quite a lot of posts here decided for the H600Fc (the light will be mainly used for hiking and mountaineering) but now I'm concerned, if the "normal" H600Fw has 80 CRI is the 3-5 CRI more of the H600Fc worth the 300 Lm loss? Does it make such a difference? Thank you all for your responses.

p.s. I have ordered a couple of weeks ago an Astrolux A01 to get to see how a high CRI, 4000k light looks like but unfortunately It hasn't arrived yet, but even so that should be a 90 CRI light, so basically double the difference between the H600Fw and H600Fc.

 

[dubliftment]

For me, the H600Fc is the holy grail in outdoor headlamps. Incredible tint and color rendering and a floody but compact beamt. I had a H600wII before and I returned it. It is worse tint-wise and concerning color rendering. I don't have a H600FwIII to compare but I certainly had the SC600wIII and I sent it back immediately. So all I can say you have made a very good decision and I am positive you'll enjoy the light. As for the max brightness. First off, the difference between 800 and 1100 Lumen is not as noticable as the difference between 100 and 400 Lumens. Secondly, you will only rarely need those 800 Lumens for the purposes you described.

 

[roger-roger]

Did I just miss the restock of the Fc MK3, or are we still waiting?

 

[Tachead]

Hello everyone!
I have been reading this forum for quite some time, but never found the need to register since I found the answers to all my questions just by reading (and I don't have much knowledge of flashlights to contribute). That changed with the last posts here. I lately decided to pull the trigger and go for a 18650 headlamp, and after reading quite a lot of posts here decided for the H600Fc (the light will be mainly used for hiking and mountaineering) but now I'm concerned, if the "normal" H600Fw has 80 CRI is the 3-5 CRI more of the H600Fc worth the 300 Lm loss? Does it make such a difference? Thank you all for your responses.

p.s. I have ordered a couple of weeks ago an Astrolux A01 to get to see how a high CRI, 4000k light looks like but unfortunately It hasn't arrived yet, but even so that should be a 90 CRI light, so basically double the difference between the H600Fw and H600Fc.

It is not just about the CRI, although a few more CRI still helps. The "c & d" MKIII's use 2-step MacAdam Ellipse Cree XM-L2 Easywhite emitters which have a much lower tint variation then the 5-step XHP35's used in the "Fw" MKIII. Which means you get a consistent clean white tint vs. a random tint lottery between different lights ranging from strong magenta to green.

As for output, it takes 4 times the lumens to equal twice as bright to the human eye. So, the 292 lumen difference only amounts to about a 6-7% increase in perceived brightness. Will you notice that? Yes, but it will not be a significant difference. Also, consider that with these small lights, the thermal regulation very quickly starts decreasing the output on H1(Max output) as temperatures rise. So, you're only getting that listed output for 15-30 seconds under normal conditions.

Another difference is the colour temperature. The "Fw" is 4500K typical where your "Fc" is 4000K typical so, your "Fc" will be quite a bit warmer.

There have been recent reports of a decline in quality with the Astrolux A01. Some of them now no longer come with the same high CRI 4000K emitter and some have a PWM driver with mode memory. Keep this in mind when using for comparison. Your light may not be the same as the ones tested.(See post #23)...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...trolux-A01-AAA-measurements-(Nichia-high-CRI)

 

[Trango]

Thank you for your replies.

@dubliftment
I will probably never use it at 800 Lm, mos of the time I plan on running it on ~100Lm mode, should be enough to see the trail and gives enormous run time. If I'll be satisfied with the headlamp I'm planning to get a flashlight also for the moment when you need throw.
p.s. that about the holy grail sound very nice

@Tachead
Didn't know that about the MacAdam Ellipse, I mean I read about it, but never figured out what it means. Also didn't know that about the Astrolux A01 (I'm glad it was cheap).

Guess I'll stick with my original choice, now I just have to wait for the H600Fc to get in stock.

 

[dubliftment]

Did I just miss the restock of the Fc MK3, or are we still waiting?

Mine shipped 2 days after ordering (Sept 10) although website said "back order" all the time.

 

[dubliftment]

PWM driver with mode memory...

the worst thing, it will not start in the same but in the next mode than the one previously used. This is how to ruin a flashlight...

 

[Trango]

Did I just miss the restock of the Fc MK3, or are we still waiting?

It is now listed "In Stock" on the zebralight website.

Still "out of stock" in EU

 

[roger-roger]

Mine shipped 2 days after ordering (Sept 10) although website said "back order" all the time.

Thanks, decided to go with an H502w in the meantime--ordered and shipped yesterday.

 

[dubliftment]

My H600Fd III arrived - as expected I am absolutely amazed by the tint and color rendering of this light. It is actually the first light I have ever seen that has a tint which is just white and nothing else. Not yellowish, greenish or whatever. It certainly beats the FD Plus tint-wise, at least I like it more.

Nevertheless my light seems to have a driver issue. It doesn't hold the H1 and H2A modes, instead upon activation it gives a short flicker and settles somewhere between 350-450Lm. (bit brighter than H2B which is 255Lm but below H2A which is 560Lm). In this mode brightness setting it runs approx. 3,3 hours. It seems as if a capacitator is broken. PID however is not an issue, it works if the light gets too hot. I am using freshly charged MJ1 and 30Q cells, so it cannot be a battery issue. If it was, the light just would step down to M1, but it doesn't.

Since I got the light, I have used it quite a bit and while at first the flicker on H1 lasted about 30 seconds, now its only 1-2 seconds and then it remains in the "hybrid" level mentioned above. My Fc is considerably brighter in H2A and H1 so I will probably return this otherwise fantastic light. in case the flicker goes away completely, I might keep it as a backup and for handing it to my children.

I always give them my Zebralights configured to the lowest H2C setting (100-150Lm) and never talk about the double-click. But with a ZL that does not have the 800-900LM H1 it is even safer for them.

Also there seems to be a different LED used. I made a pic with both lights on L2C (0,01ish Lumens) and the LED of the Fd seems smaller. In direct comparison it also has a more defined hotspot and more throw than the Fc. I think they gave me a prototype with a Nichia 219b LED. (Don't tell TCY!) Other thoughts on this? https://onedrive.live.com/?cid=42E7C24BB6321EE7&id=42E7C24BB6321EE7%215936&parId=42E7C24BB6321EE7%21139&o=OneUp

 

[dubliftment]

Maybe someone else can take a pic of both their H600Fc/d on lowest mode as well. Tachead maybe?

 

[Tachead]

Maybe someone else can take a pic of both their H600Fc/d on lowest mode as well. Tachead maybe?

There is an issue with your "D", it is defective. Both the D&C use the same emitter, the only difference is the colour temperature. The XM-L2 Easywhite that they use are quad die emitters. Both should look like your "C"(the one on the left in your pic). Mine both look like your "C". I suspect that only one of the 4 dies is lighting on your "D"(the bottom left die by the looks of it). That would explain the lowered output and beam profile. Send ZL, or whoever you bought it from, an email about the issue and I am sure they will replace it in short order:thumbsup: