14440/LD01/LF2XT, some questions, and some humor

[GTSECC]

So, seems like most folks here want the most light possible AND guilt free lumens.

I want that!

1. So, if I get an LF2XT or an LD01, I ought to buy some 14440's and a charger. Right?

2. Also, like most folks here, I don't want to blow off my balls. Right?

This is a different concern than wasting money. If I ruin a rechargeable battery, it really isn't going to ruin my day. I don't want to ruin a battery and waste the money, but it is not THAT big a deal. Blowing my balls off seems like a much worse scenario.

So, I hear a lot about "protected" cells.

3. What does "protected" mean?
Is that the term that means I won't waste money by ruining the batteries, or is that term term that means I won't blow my balls off? It seems important to me that I clearly understand what is being protected, my balls or the battery.

4. 14440 protected or not?
Another problem is that I hear the 14440 batteries are so small, the protector thing-a-ma-jiggy won't fit in it. So, when I read something like "the AW line of cells are protected," what they really mean is the AW line, besides the 14440, right?

5. What is the dreaded voltage number? (2.4?)
Now, I know what you do is you keep the 14440's "topped off" so you don't go below the dreaded 2.4 volts, or what ever, right?

6. How do you know? And what are the consequences if you are wrong?(you guess, volt meter, meter built into the light, or it dims) Well, obviously, I think, folks are not checking the voltage every 2 mins. How do you check it anyway? With the LF2Xt, you can use the light, but other light you need a volt metter, correct? I assume folks know that for a certain light and battery, it goes below the dreaded voltage limit after a certain amount of time, say 20 mins. So, they just sort of estimate 15 mins of usage, and then change batteries, and charge the used cell.
Now, if you mess up, and drop just a little below 2.4, do you poof the battery, slightly shorten the life, majorly shorten the life, or blow your balls off? Also, different lights, have different drivers, some of which will mask the drop in voltage, right? So, you really could not rely on watching for the light to dim, right? Now, if it does dim, is is a stair step drop that is impossible to miss, or gradual, that you could miss? Once it drops, is it too late?

 

[Benson]

So, seems like most folks here want the most light possible AND guilt free lumens.

I want that!

1. So, if I get an LF2XT or an LD01, I ought to buy some 14440's and a charger. Right?

Nope, but close. You (IMHO) should buy some 10440s -- the first two digits are diameter in mm, second pair is length in mm. 10440s are same size as AAA, 14500s are same size as AA, and AFAIK nobody makes a 14440.

2. Also, like most folks here, I don't want to blow off my balls. Right?

How would I know what you want? But it does sound likely.

3. What does "protected" mean?
Is that the term that means I won't waste money by ruining the batteries, or is that term term that means I won't blow my balls off? It seems important to me that I clearly understand what is being protected, my balls or the battery.

Kinda both. Protection does help prevent the batteries from being killed too bad, but is principally a safety measure.

4. 14440 protected or not?
Another problem is that I hear the 14440 batteries are so small, the protector thing-a-ma-jiggy won't fit in it. So, when I read something like "the AW line of cells are protected," what they really mean is the AW line, besides the 14440, right?

I don't think anyone should be saying that, because AW sells both protected and unprotected cells in a variety of sizes. But nobody offers a protected 10440 (or any 10xx0; there are also some 10180 and 10350, IIRC, cells used in certain keychain lights), because, as you heard, the protection circuits are too big.

5. What is the dreaded voltage number? (2.4?)
Now, I know what you do is you keep the 14440's "topped off" so you don't go below the dreaded 2.4 volts, or what ever, right?

There's no magic number. The more you abuse cells, the likelier it is that they eventually fail catastrophically; that eventual failure could happen at a moment when you're treating them quite decently, in fact. Generally, Li-ion cells fail during charging, but that can be due to damage sustained in a previous overdischarge. (Incidentally, this means you should be more concerned about a house fire than your balls, unless you charge them in your pocket.) Generally, something like 2.7V to 3V is a safe end-of-discharge for low current draw. Many protection circuits cut out at 2.5V, which (depending on current) may be unhealthy for the cells, but is unlikely to pose a safety problem; different people adopt different bottom ends at which they'll throw a cell out rather than attempt to recharge it.

6. How do you know? And what are the consequences if you are wrong?(you guess, volt meter, meter built into the light, or it dims) Well, obviously, I think, folks are not checking the voltage every 2 mins. How do you check it anyway? With the LF2Xt, you can use the light, but other light you need a volt metter, correct? I assume folks know that for a certain light and battery, it goes below the dreaded voltage limit after a certain amount of time, say 20 mins. So, they just sort of estimate 15 mins of usage, and then change batteries, and charge the used cell.

Yep, unless your light tells you (for example, by dimming towards the end of a run), you run a discharge under controlled conditions, measuring the voltage as you go, and then estimate runtimes to make sure you charge often enough. But it doesn't hurt to charge more often, so just charge whenever you think you might be over half-empty, and you'll be fine. (Or charge it every day, even...)

Now, if you mess up, and drop just a little below 2.4, do you poof the battery, slightly shorten the life, majorly shorten the life, or blow your balls off?

Just a little below whatever safe threshold you've decided on takes just a little more off the battery life, and adds just a little risk of explosion during some subsequent charge. Again, there's no magic numbers, just increasing risk. But do note that the Li-ion discharge curve has a pronounced knee, so if your light keeps sucking constant current, the voltage will rapidly drop through your cutoff point; just "a little" longer discharge can mean a lot lower voltage.

Also, different lights, have different drivers, some of which will mask the drop in voltage, right? So, you really could not rely on watching for the light to dim, right? Now, if it does dim, is is a stair step drop that is impossible to miss, or gradual, that you could miss? Once it drops, is it too late?

Depends greatly on the particular light. As I don't have either of those lights, I'm not real sure how they act.

The good thing, though, is that 10440s are very robust little creatures, and I've never heard of one exploding, even though (being so small, and thus so limited in appropriate current) they are quite frequently abused. They do stop taking a charge, but they don't blow up. Of course, that doesn't mean I deliberately abuse them; after all, I've no desire for the "honor" of being the first case!

 

[GTSECC]

Perfect!
I understand.
So, what 10440 chargers are available, and what are the pros and cons?

 

[wapkil]

Perfect!
I understand.
So, what 10440 chargers are available, and what are the pros and cons?

There is only a single decent one available that I am aware of. The one described in this thread. You can also buy a good multichemistry hobby charger (much more expensive) or build your own charger. The options are rather limited

Note that the LD01 is not designed to handle Li-Ion cells. It works with them but at first is direct driven (i.e. acts as if there was no driver). The LF2XT is designed to handle Li-Ion cells - will be dimmer than the LD01 initially is but the output will be more flat. The LF2XT has the overdischarge protection built in to take care of your cells, the LD01 not designed for Li-Ions obviously doesn't have it. The LF2XT is also a much more sophisticated light than LD01.

 

[csshih]

the LF2XT would be much safer on Liion cells. exactly as stated above.