A thought about water resistant flashlights.

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A computer is water resistant, even laptops. If water was to be splashed or sprayed on the sides or top, it would continue to function fine. If it were to be dipped in water however, it may not function fine afterwards...

My point? "Why don't they make computers water resistant".
It's plain silly.

In my experience, humans are water resistant - even with facial and bodily cavities which allow access into internal organs. But for the most part, whenever it rains people tend to take certain precautions and avoid exposure to the rain as much as possible. eg you don't tend to see people rain-bathe at a beach if its pouring down. Why can't we adopt similar precautions if carrying your $100+ lights in severe weather without expectation from manufacturers to "idiot-proof" everything?
 
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Onyx said:
Why can't we adopt similar precautions if carrying your $100+ lights in severe weather without expectation from manufacturers to "idiot-proof" everything?


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Because if you are out on a rainy night, you are particularly likely to need your light (no stars, no moon).

Pat
 
I bought an L1 and I assumed its water resistant, my infinity is and has been used during harsh rainstorms. My L1 has a O-SEAL just like the infinity and the rubber button is sealed onthe back etc.. so the L1 should work in heavy rain right without water entry? thats what the oseals are for. Anyhow I do agree any flashlight costing 100+ should be water-resistant at the least.
 
I hate to defend SF, but it seems to me they are water resistant. Certainly they're more water resistant than a mag lite, and I've never heard of a mag lite failing in the rain.

I have heard of mag lites failing when people take them caving, or camping, where they often end up submerged. For that type of service, where you want a waterproof light, I wouldn't take a mag lite OR a SF. I'd take something more rugged. (couldn't resist /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif ) I'd take my Tektite, or one of my Streamlights, or a UK - all of which are waterPROOF.

Now, why isn't a SF waterproof? Maybe because they're primarily aimed at law enforcement, and their gear isn't normally waterproof, either. The cell phone and Motorola radio that your friendly neighborhood policeman carries are NOT waterproof. The 9mm sidearm he's carrying may not be dunkable either, meaning that it may not have been subjected to the "drop it in the mud, wipe it off on your shirt sleeve and see if it still works" test that the military used to do.

Military gear, on the other hand, including radios, is probably waterproof, as they're expected to live outside, where this doesn't happen to law enforcement people unless things get really bad... (I don't believe many carry write in the rain ticket books, either.)

Just my 2 cents.
 
if any of my flashlights leak, a simple cleaning and lubing of the O-rings usually does the job. the problem with the surefire bezels with pyrex lenses, is that if they leak, there's nothing you can about it except get a new bezel since they cannot be easily taken apart.

even if surefire sends you one free of charge, its still an inconvenience to wait the 1 or 2 weeks (or sometimes months!) for the part to arrive before you can use it the way it should be.

i still cannot understand why surefire doesn't use a more straightforward design to their bezels, similar to the maglite and pelican M6 bezels where by the lens is sealed against an O-ring in the face cap, which is screwed onto the bezel. instead, they use an (IMHO) overly complicated method for their pyrex bezels, which is sealed shut. not only is it wasteful since you have to toss out a good bezel due to a leaking seal or a damaged lens, it also doesn't seem to work well all the time.

as i've mentioned a few times before, i had both an E2e and M2 leak through the lens (not through the other O-ring seals). and the M2 is supposed to be a "special operations" light. i suppose special operations means having to worry about getting it wet? and to clarify what under what circumstances they leaked, both lights were exposed to rain. after i dried them out, i used a showerhead to spray water on them and water got in through the lens seals again.

since the A2 appears to use the same bezel design as the E2e, i would expect the water resistance from unit to unit to vary as well. ever noticed that surefire only offers an "N" certification for the 6Ps now? the 6P uses a snap-fit lexan bezel which in my experience is more consistant with water-resistance, and this could be the reason for it. this is the reason i would take a surefire lexan bezel over a pyrex one any day, and its why i chose an old model C2 with a lexan lens as my EDC along with my arc AAA. the new-style 6P which is not "N" certified i have is just as resistant to water as my C2.

anyway i've discovered a useful method to check how waterproof your surefire is. screw on the tailcap tight, remove the bezel, then screw it back on again. check to see if the rubber tailcap cover is bulging out due to the air pressure. if it is, it probably means your surefire is not leaking, since the seals don't even let air through. leave it for a few days or weeks if you want, and if the air pressure still isn't equalized, you can safely submerge it without worrying it about leaking /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

my 6P allows the air pressure to equalize after a few days, but it still doesn't leak a single drop when i submerge it in a pail (about half a metre of water). my C2 does not equalize at all, and i've taken it to the bottom of a swimming pool (about 2 metres) without any problems.

lastly, i don't think the lack of water resistance for some surefires should be excused just because they are aimed at the law-enforcement or military market. by pricing their products as such, they automatically place themselves in a niche market whereby such inadequecies are unacceptable. should i then buy a $5 million ferrari f40 and then accept that it leaks through the windshield when its raining since its a sports car, not an suv? or that if it leaks i'll have to change the entire body shell since the windshield is glued onto the frame? think about it.
 
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One way to prevent water entry into any Surefire light is to properly lubricate the O-rings.

Any Surefire I have ever received in a factory sealed box has come with dry O-rings.

So, do the following:

Remove the O-rings from the flashlight.

Make sure the O-ring groves are clean. A dry toothbrush will usually remove any dirt from the groves. Then wipe with a clean dry cloth.

Clean the O-ring by wiping it with a clean cloth.

Lubricate the O-ring with a small amount of O-ring lubricant of your choice. I use silicone grease found in the plumbing department of hardware stores. I figure silicone grease is designed to help the O-ring do it's job of preventing WATER from migrating,and that is what I want.

You want the O-ring to be just shiny with the lubricant. No gobs of grease. Rub a very small amount of the lubricant between your thumb and finger,then coat the complete O-ring.

Install the O-ring on the flashlight.

The key to keeping water out of any O-ring installation is lubricating the whole O-ring. If you just smear a little grease on the ring without removing it from the flashlight body, you may as well forget about an efficient waterproofing job.

I have dunked several Surefire lights including E2e,G2,and 10X Dominator and never had any water damage.

If you believe your getting leaks around the bezel or tailcap, try coating the edge of the glass and the rubber pushbutton with a small amount of silicone grease or for a more permanent seal use clear silicone sealer on these areas.
 
tombeis: very informative /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif in my experience, surefires come from the factory with threads and O-rings that are either overlubed or bone dry.

if your surefire still doesn't pass the tailcap cover test after proper lubing and cleaning, then your surefire is probably leaking through either the tailcap or most probably the lens seal.
 
Hey guys, ALL flashlights are water resistant in my experience (fresh water). Try submerging any flashlight in water w/fresh batteries, switch it on and let the batteries drain. Even if the flashlight fills up with water (i.e. has very low water resistance), I think you will find it will work just fine while submerged and will sustain no damage. Of course, this does not apply to salt water or other highly mineralized water (such as hot springs). The whole waterproof thing is highly overemphasized. While waterproofness may in some way satisfy a perceived (i.e. not real) need, apart from underwater and/or extended use in very humid environments, there is no real use for waterproof lights.

nm
 
Corrosion and oxidation of the contacts occurs as a result of any water contact. There is no "fresh water" that is so pure that it contains no ions. If "fresh water" were that pure we wouldn't need to paint the metal bodies of our cars - they would never rust from rain exposure...

Soak your flashlight inside and out and wait a few days. The contacts will show signs of oxidation and as a result the resistance of the contacts increases, negatively impacting the flashlight's performance sometimes to the point of failure. Experience is my teacher in this arena.

I know I said my last post in this thread was the one above, but the topic has changed. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Welcome aboard, NM! Questioning conventional wisdom is never a bad thing.

My 2¢
 
I have to jump in about the ruggedness of police equipment:
Many sidearms used by cops are nearly identical to military ones: the Beretta 92 (USA's M9), Sigs, Glocks, Etc.

I maintain that, since you never know where a puddle or sink may show up, *any* item claiming to be drop-proof or "ruggedized" should be able to survive a quick dunk in a dirty puddle or being dropped in a sink.

Sadly, there's a pretty large number of issued items that "somehow" get dunked in toilets. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 
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Blikbok said:

Sadly, there's a pretty large number of issued items that "somehow" get dunked in toilets. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

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dude, there is no way you're dropping that line without explanation! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

i'll be over here waiting........... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/popcorn.gif
 
>>issued items that "somehow" get dunked in toilets

Didn't know the senior officers still hazed the rookies!

Nope, I'll bet Blikbok meant a flashlight being dislodged from a ditty belt during the officer doing his "duty."
 
<font color="blue"> Corrosion and oxidation of the contacts occurs as a result of any water contact. </font>

Maybe, but it's invisible and of no consequence, at least with my lights. I can drop my light into the water, take it out, let it dry and there is no evidence whatsoever of any corrosion and/or oxidation. Even a new one (I normally keep all contacts coated with silicone grease)


<font color="blue"> There is no "fresh water" that is so pure that it contains no ions. If "fresh water" were that pure we wouldn't need to paint the metal bodies of our cars - they would never rust from rain exposure...</font>

The water doesn't have to be pure, just fresh (i.e. not salt water or other highy mineralized water). Car bodies are usually made of materials highly susceptible to corrosion (like steel). Flashlights are generally not (plastic, aluminum, stainless, etc.)

<font color="blue"> Soak your flashlight inside and out and wait a few days. The contacts will show signs of oxidation and as a result the resistance of the contacts increases, negatively impacting the flashlight's performance sometimes to the point of failure. Experience is my teacher in this arena.</font>

Well, I can't dispute your experience. Mine has been the opposite. As a caver and canyoneer, I get my lights wet inside and out all the time with no negative consequences. Over time, I have experienced slight oxidation of certain contacts (most notably the soldered bulb contact), but this is easily remedied by cleaning. Just my experience.

Waterproof lights certainly have their place, but I think their popularity and perceived necessity is akin to the SUV phenomenon: people like to have the features even if they don't really use 'em.

<font color="blue"> Welcome aboard, NM! Questioning conventional wisdom is never a bad thing.</font>

Thanks, QB! Nice to have a civil discussion (is there an alt.flashlights?)

nm

P.S. Forgot to mention: the notion that plain 'ol rain is somehow gonna shut down a flashlight is ludicrous. A candle, yes, flashlight, no. I'm guessing early flashlight users were psyched to have something that would provide easily portable light in the rain.
 
Well my A2 just passed the sink test with no problems. I filled the sink with cold water and placed it in, I then turned on and off many times both with the push and turn method. I then shook it vigorously and let it sit about five minutes. After removing it and drying the outside I opened everything and all was dry. Like I said before I have not had one of my Surefire lights take on any water but I also keep them very clean and well lubed just like I do with my dive lights.
 
i won't be sticking my A2 in any sink or puddle. if it somehow gets wet i'll take it apart and inspect. otherwise i could care less about dunk tests. this has gotten way out of hand and overblown.
 
Tkl:

Too many of the stories are...close to home. Ones I can talk about are a brand-new Gerber 400 multitool that was dropped in a very...unflushed toilet, and reteived reflexively by the owner. Much hand-scrubbing ensued.

We've also seen people who've sent loaded pistol mags through the wash. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif

Let's just say that I have many associates who like spring-loaded gear-keepers.
 
GO Surefire!(sarcasm)

You might notice I don't have a single Surefire flashlight in my small but slowly-growing supply of flashlights. Plan to keep it that way except for maybe the G2 because of it's cheap price, but even it has some cheaper or equally priced alternatives, oops nevermind, they don't have the "World Acclaimed Surefire Beam", so they must be totally inferior and useless.(more sarcasm) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
4x4Dragon, usually I won't advice you on posting like that. Kinda looks like a flame bait to me. You must understand that on this forum there are quite many Surefire diehard supporters. Try and phrase things nicely next time.
 
Water resistance or -proof ness, even if the light is o-ring sealed, is only as reliable as the o-ring maintence. Dust, dirt, lint, hair, salt crystals will all build up on an o-ring and compromise it's seal. Occasionally cleaning and light lubrication with the proper O-RING LUBRICANT (NOT Vasaline, WD-40, earwax(yuk), etc.) will usually keep things working right.

Keep the light warm, too. If you need to wear a coat, your batteries and o-rings will be happier in a warmer environment, too. Hard o-rings don't work. NASA found out the hard way about that. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/twak.gif
 
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