Battery Safety

[flashpass]

Hi all,

This is my first post. I've read a lot on the forum about safety. It seems there is a risk of explosion when using flashlights. I have always liked flashlight since I remember and I was not aware of those incidents before getting interested in more fancy and expensive flashlights. The Zebralight seems fine and everybody seems to like it. I was planning to buy it but I hesitate because it is a waterproof flashlights and those seems to be more at risk of explosion because the gas cannot escape. Maybe there is a safety vent ? Every kind of battery seems to release hydrogen or other gas that can build up in the flashlight. Air tight model seems to be more at risk. I've found a little bit of information on the forum and on the internet. The following article does not answer all my questions but it is the only scientific paper I found. At least, it gives some warnings and precautions.

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/docs/97-149/

I would like to know if there is a model safer than another. I would also like to know if there a kind of battery safer.

Cheers

 

[ChrisGarrett]

You're more likely to be killed by a piece of falling space junk, than you are from an exploding flashlight.

Just follow safe Li-Ion battery practices and you'll be fine.

Batteries/cells are the power source, not the lights.

Chris

 

[mcnair55]

Take no notice it is just a load of nonsense,it is a case 2 + 2= 5,like anything use common sense,read instruction manuals etc and learn off the board.Anorak wearers put the bogey man stories on every hobby forum you can think of.My recently bought German air rifle is over priced according to the guy who lives around the corner from his brothers mate that is married to his sister and has tea with the Pope,get my point.:D

 

[thedoc007]

You're more likely to be killed by a piece of falling space junk, than you are from an exploding flashlight.

That may be true, but there is a higher possibility of injury...just because it is (extremely) unlikely to kill you, doesn't mean it isn't a real issue. I agree that if you use proper handling (don't use damaged cells, if using multiple cells make sure they are well matched (brand/age/cycles/capacity), and buy quality batteries/chargers, your danger of ANY issue, is very low. Orders of magnitude lower than many other things which most people do daily, and therefore nothing to be worried about.

Take no notice it is just a load of nonsense,it is a case 2 + 2= 5,like anything use common sense,read instruction manuals etc and learn off the board.

It isn't nonsense. Explosions do happen - in fact have happened to several CPFers. And ignoring flashpass's concern is doing a disservice. You tell him to read the boards, but when he asks a valid question, you dismiss it as nonsense?



Flashpass, there are some models that are safer than others, both in flashlights and in batteries/cells. For lithium ion, stick with reputable protected Japanese cells (Panasonic and Sanyo are the big names). Keeppower, AW, Eagletac, Nitecore, Fenix, Xtar, Orbtronic, and many others are all high quality cells based on the Panasonic cell - the only difference is the protection circuit. These cells have built in safeguards against excessive heat, over-charging, over-discharging, short circuit (over-current) etc.

Some lights offer built-in protection against reverse polarity, i.e. installing a battery backward. If you are worried about inserting one backward, look for that feature, and you'll be covered in any case.

I do agree with the last couple posters that some people take the safety issue way too far...there is no need to micromanage the cells. If they were as unsafe as some would have you believe, they would have been banned. The infrequency of problems, even despite people's tendency to ignore the warnings about safety, is proof to me that the issue is overblown. Keep reading and learning...the more you know, the more comfortable you will be in using them.

 

[mcnair55]

That may be true, but there is a higher possibility of injury...just because it is (extremely) unlikely to kill you, doesn't mean it isn't a real issue. I agree that if you use proper handling (don't use damaged cells, if using multiple cells make sure they are well matched (brand/age/cycles/capacity), and buy quality batteries/chargers, your danger of ANY issue, is very low. Orders of magnitude lower than many other things which most people do daily, and therefore nothing to be worried about.





It isn't nonsense. Explosions do happen - in fact have happened to several CPFers. And ignoring flashpass's concern is doing a disservice. You tell him to read the boards, but when he asks a valid question, you dismiss it as nonsense?



Flashpass, there are some models that are safer than others, both in flashlights and in batteries/cells. For lithium ion, stick with reputable protected Japanese cells (Panasonic and Sanyo are the big names). Keeppower, AW, Eagletac, Nitecore, Fenix, Xtar, Orbtronic, and many others are all high quality cells based on the Panasonic cell - the only difference is the protection circuit. These cells have built in safeguards against excessive heat, over-charging, over-discharging, short circuit (over-current) etc.

Some lights offer built-in protection against reverse polarity, i.e. installing a battery backward. If you are worried about inserting one backward, look for that feature, and you'll be covered in any case.

I do agree with the last couple posters that some people take the safety issue way too far...there is no need to micromanage the cells. If they were as unsafe as some would have you believe, they would have been banned. The infrequency of problems, even despite people's tendency to ignore the warnings about safety, is proof to me that the issue is overblown. Keep reading and learning...the more you know, the more comfortable you will be in using them.

Yes read the board and yes it is all nonsense, i bet bottom dollar the explosions are from people messing around and not using common sense.Do you honestly think you could buy such stuff if the risk of explosion was greater than a tiny risk.

Oh the bogey man is coming.

 

[thedoc007]

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?114455-Battery-exploded-in-flashlight

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?169038-Battery-explosion-with-Fenix-P1D

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?250219-battery-explosion-it-was-too-close

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...m-cell-info-testing-links&highlight=exploding

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/951360_.html

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?280909-Ultrafire-18650-3000mA-exploded

Just selected links from the first page of a search. Mcnair, it clearly isn't nonsense - continuing to dismiss the real damage it can do is fostering the ignorance that can lead to problems.

Buy quality cells, only use matched cells, and your likelihood of problems is very low. But don't pretend the problem doesn't exist.

 

[mcnair55]

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?114455-Battery-exploded-in-flashlight

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?169038-Battery-explosion-with-Fenix-P1D

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?250219-battery-explosion-it-was-too-close

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...m-cell-info-testing-links&highlight=exploding

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/951360_.html

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?280909-Ultrafire-18650-3000mA-exploded

Just selected links from the first page of a search. Mcnair, it clearly isn't nonsense - continuing to dismiss the real damage it can do is fostering the ignorance that can lead to problems.

Buy quality cells, only use matched cells, and your likelihood of problems is very low. But don't pretend the problem doesn't exist.

It happens but we only hear of one side of the story,it is the same with Lipo and radio control stuff,just buy a charging bag to contain the nuclear fallout.

 

[RetroTechie]

Well there's many safety options to choose from:

• Stick to single-cell lights only
• In multi-cell lights, don't mix old/new cells or ones of different brand/capacity
• Avoid el cheapo cells found on sites like eBay, DX etc (in particular, the many ????Fire ones), that is: buy respected brand batteries only
• Only use protected Li-ion batteries (especially in multi-cell lights!)
• Drill venting hole(s) in your light :scowl: and cover with tape / glue to prevent water entry
• Use safe(r) chemistry cells like LiFePO4​ (safest lithium-based chemistry afaik, but low capacity) or Li-Mn (IMR, capacity- and safety-wise between LiCo and LiFePO4​). Note that such cells often come in the unprotected flavor
• Avoid lithium batteries alltogether
• Last but not least: use common sense

Any of these may reduce safety concerns significantly, mix & match to make safety into a non-issue. Yes flashlights can explode, but from what I've read, almost without exception these rare events happened when someone ignored well known handling rules. :shakehead

 

[archimedes]

I've posted occasionally about battery safety issues ... and these threads always seem to get so heated :poof:

Good resources for starting to learn about this include the relevant Battery subforums here, and -

http://batteryuniversity.com

I think taking these things seriously and sensibly is wise :thumbsup:

:popcorn:

 

[flashpass]

Thank you all for your safety tips and links. It helped me a lot. I will continue to keep me inform about batteries. I'll probably go with Eneloop for now, they seem great and does not leak. From what you are saying, it is a good choice to go with one-cell flashlight so I think Zebralight was a good choice from the start.

Great community, thanks !

 

[SilverFox]

Hello Flashpass,

Welcome to CPF.

The article you presented refers to nickle based chemistry batteries. Li-Ion batteries do not produce hydrogen.

Stored energy has risks. The more energy you store the more potential risks you have. Fortunately incidents are few and far between, but they do occasionally happen.

I would suggest that you ignore Mcnair55's "frivolous" attitude toward safety, but do pay attention to his comments on using batteries with a healthy dose of common sense. Incidents occur when common sense isn't all that common. However that isn't the only time incidents occur.

Keep in mind that many people use lawn mowers that are powered by gasoline. Gasoline is very dangerous to handle, yet most of us fill our cars and use lawn mowers without incident. When you break the rules the results can be nasty, but most people have a healthy respect for gasoline. At CPF we try to develop a healthy respect for batteries.

As far as which battery is safer than another you can expect that those batteries you can buy at the corner market are among the safest. If you have to dismantle a laptop battery or can only find a battery via mail order or in a specialty shop, it is most likely more dangerous than those that are easily found at the corner store.

Tom

 

[mcnair55]

Hello Flashpass,

Welcome to CPF.

The article you presented refers to nickle based chemistry batteries. Li-Ion batteries do not produce hydrogen.

Stored energy has risks. The more energy you store the more potential risks you have. Fortunately incidents are few and far between, but they do occasionally happen.

I would suggest that you ignore Mcnair55's "frivolous" attitude toward safety, but do pay attention to his comments on using batteries with a healthy dose of common sense. Incidents occur when common sense isn't all that common. However that isn't the only time incidents occur.

Keep in mind that many people use lawn mowers that are powered by gasoline. Gasoline is very dangerous to handle, yet most of us fill our cars and use lawn mowers without incident. When you break the rules the results can be nasty, but most people have a healthy respect for gasoline. At CPF we try to develop a healthy respect for batteries.

As far as which battery is safer than another you can expect that those batteries you can buy at the corner market are among the safest. If you have to dismantle a laptop battery or can only find a battery via mail order or in a specialty shop, it is most likely more dangerous than those that are easily found at the corner store.

Tom

I think you have written that spot on young Tom and I for one would not be using lap top batteries, that is what I call messing, pity I have a near new lap top here which has had liquid damage but I am binning it.

Common sense is your best friend.

 

[avrilcory]

If you are looking power backup batteries provide a safe and dependable source of power. Battery handling safety and keep loose batteries locked away, or place a piece of duct tape over the controller to prevent from accessing the battery.

Thanks !!!
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