Battery Testing With Pro Gear.

[Hashime]

Hello all, it has been a while since I was last here... Anyways, thanks to my current co-op job involving confidential battery tech I have access to a professional battery testing system, the Maccor MC-4 test system. I also have three free channels on the device at any given time. So, my question is: Does anyone want any specific batteries tested?

I am ordering a few kinds from deal extreme today (so about 2 weeks before they get here, already testing the ones I have) but for the next month or so I will have access to this machine. If anyone wants a specific battery tested that is not too expensive I can pop it on the machine and test it pretty much any way you wish.

Just post here if you have any requests or ideas.

Cheers.

EDIT: I put this in the wrong spot. Whoops.

 

[Cataract]

WHOA! nice!

Can you test all chemistries with it?

 

[Hashime]

There is a limitation on voltage / current. The system maxes out at 5V / 5A per channel and 12A across all channels.

That being said I can program it to do whatever I want. Right now I am testing a trustfire 18650 with a 0.75A CC discharge then charging it to 4.2 V with a 1A CC followed by 4.2V CV until the current drops to 0.3A. I am taking data every 5 seconds on each step. It also calculates everything you could want to know automatically which is sweet.

 

[Cataract]

Very nice. The brands I see people using most are AW's, XXXfires, Tenergy, Eneloop.

I personally would like to see a comparison between Eneloops, Duraloops (LSD duracells with the white top) and the newer Duracell LSD's (with the green top). I have a suspicion the green Duracells are not as good both in capacity and charge retention.

 

[Hashime]

Well, I have some new duracell AA cells kicking around. I can make a run to the store next week and give the energizers a go as well.

Do you have a specific discharge rate in mind? I can test pretty much anything and give you a capacity based on your application.

 

[Cataract]

That's a good question, I never really paid attention to current consumption in my lights or other gadgets, but I'll have a look (or plain test it). Perhaps it would be best to average out single cell flashlight discharge rates and use that, this way the data would benefit more people. Anyone out there with that kind of number handy?? :poke:

I'm surprised you're not geting more demands, there are not too many occasions like this...

 

[Knight_Light]

Just post here if you have any requests or ideas.

I have some requests. Could you please test the following batteries.

• "Soshine 14500 LiFePO4 3.2V 700mAh Rechargeable". The product can be seen at the following link. http://dx.com/p/soshine-14500-lifepo4-3-2v-700mah-rechargeable-batteries-w-box-black-4-pcs-154867
• “Generic LiFePO4 Rechargeable 14505 Cell: 3.2V 600 mAh, 0.6A Rate, 2.22Wh”. The product can be seen at the following link. http://www.batteryspace.com/lifepo4...rate222whbuttontopstandardaasizeullisted.aspx
• “Coolook 600 mAh 3.2 V AA 14500 LiFePO_4 Lithium-ion Batteries “. The product can be seen at the following link. http://www.fancycost.com/coolook-60...mion-batteries-2pcs-p-60088.html#.UVs8E0nD8r0

My suggestions are based on the fact that there has already been a lot of testing on all of the other battery types and chemistries and the one area that is lacking is LiFePO4. Since I utilize AA in a lot of devices these are the choices that I am requesting.
LiFePO4 I believe is a great alternative providing higher voltages while being much safer than traditional lithium-ion. The amount of charge cycles is supposedly triple that of lithium ion. So it would be interesting to see if any of the above batteries are good quality batteries or if they are just hype. It would be interesting if they measure up to their capacity claims.\

If you could utilize 400ma for charging it would be great.

Either way on behalf of everybody thank you for testing whatever it is you do test.

PS: If anyone else in the community has already tested these cells could you please post the results.

Thank you.

 

[LightCrazy]

The Fenix 18650 is what I use most, it does well in most of the tests I have seen here on CPF. It would be nice to see how it performs in your test.

 

[Hashime]

Okay, so Update:

I have been a little busy with my actual projects at work but have some preliminary data on the "Trustfire 18650" from DX. I have run it 5 times with various discharge currents and preliminary (I will do the actual data analysis together with a few kinds, easier that way) the cell I have tested is sitting at 1750 mAh compared to its supposed 2500, not bad for $3 a cell.

I picked up eneloops and duraloops today so I will give those a shot in tomorrow most likely. The only thing I am not too sure about is the best charging profile / method. I could actually run both fast and trickle charges.

I ordered the Fenix and Tenergy 18650's today as well.

I also have a few more Lithium Ion batteries coming from DX, they shipped them out today so I should see them hopefully next week.


As a side note I have no issue with testing a specific discharge profile / charging profile and if you want something situation specific tested on a battery post it.

 

[Hashime]

I have some requests. Could you please test the following batteries.

• "Soshine 14500 LiFePO4 3.2V 700mAh Rechargeable". The product can be seen at the following link. http://dx.com/p/soshine-14500-lifepo4-3-2v-700mah-rechargeable-batteries-w-box-black-4-pcs-154867
• “Generic LiFePO4 Rechargeable 14505 Cell: 3.2V 600 mAh, 0.6A Rate, 2.22Wh”. The product can be seen at the following link. http://www.batteryspace.com/lifepo4...rate222whbuttontopstandardaasizeullisted.aspx
• “Coolook 600 mAh 3.2 V AA 14500 LiFePO_4 Lithium-ion Batteries “. The product can be seen at the following link. http://www.fancycost.com/coolook-60...mion-batteries-2pcs-p-60088.html#.UVs8E0nD8r0

My suggestions are based on the fact that there has already been a lot of testing on all of the other battery types and chemistries and the one area that is lacking is LiFePO4. Since I utilize AA in a lot of devices these are the choices that I am requesting.
LiFePO4 I believe is a great alternative providing higher voltages while being much safer than traditional lithium-ion. The amount of charge cycles is supposedly triple that of lithium ion. So it would be interesting to see if any of the above batteries are good quality batteries or if they are just hype. It would be interesting if they measure up to their capacity claims.\

If you could utilize 400ma for charging it would be great.

Either way on behalf of everybody thank you for testing whatever it is you do test.

PS: If anyone else in the community has already tested these cells could you please post the results.

Thank you.

I have ordered the Soshine batteries from DX. Battery space wanted $70 to ship to me and I am not familiar enough with fancy cost to buy from them. It will be a while before they get here so I will update when I can.

Cheers.

 

[Knight_Light]

I have ordered the Soshine batteries from DX. Battery space wanted $70 to ship to me and I am not familiar enough with fancy cost to buy from them. It will be a while before they get here so I will update when I can.

Cheers.

I appreciate you doing this and so will the community. Let us know how the tests come out. As far as the charge profile for the eneloop may be 500ma, 1000ma and 2000ma. As far as the discharge 270ma, 920ma, and 1245ma. That would also be highly appreciated.

 

[Bolek]

Would you been so kind to test low curent discharge of "dead" alkaline (under 1V) from a recycle bin: AA at 25mA, 10mA and 1mA and C with same currents. In a direct drive light with no balast (wrong engeniring leading to a destruction of the light if i put any "alive batteries in it) 3C or 4 AA give some lights for months at about 12h a day.But I have no idea of actual energy remening in a dead alka.

 

[Hashime]

Would you been so kind to test low curent discharge of "dead" alkaline (under 1V) from a recycle bin: AA at 25mA, 10mA and 1mA and C with same currents. In a direct drive light with no balast (wrong engeniring leading to a destruction of the light if i put any "alive batteries in it) 3C or 4 AA give some lights for months at about 12h a day.But I have no idea of actual energy remening in a dead alka.

Yep, I have some dead energizer batteries at home, I will give it a go on monday if I remember to bring them.


General up date: I have finished testing on the Trustfire li-ion batteries I have on hand, some interesting results there. I have a fex discharge profiles on some Energizer white top LSD NiMH batteries and a few on some duracell DX1500 2000mAh NiMH batteries. Charging them is a pain, I have switched over to my onyx 235 charger for the charging duties.

I also have a trickel charge profile for the DX1500.

Cheers.

 

[Bolek]

Thanks

 

[Hashime]

So I have finally gotten around to putting some data together. Today's update is the completed analysis of the blue "2400mAh" trustfire batteries I got off of DX. I ran 11 tests on the batteries (2 cells) but only logged a few as I made a mistake with the software. Overall I found the capacity to be as high as ~1800 mAh discharging at 250mA, and for both 500 and 750mA of draw the capacity was about ~1700 mAh. Here is a plot of the discharge curves:

Just a few notes, the time scale is in minutes (whoops) and all batteries were charged with the same profile though there was some time between tests so there was a little variance in starting voltages.

I am testing a fenix and tenergy 18650 at the moment, my enerloop / duraloop tests are also done so I will throw up a curve soon.

Also I have been running some dead AA's for the past few days on the first 2 channels, so I can toss that info up soon as well.

As for the other battery types: DX has shipped them so as you know, could be a week, could be a month. Hopefully not a month though, I am back at school in the beginning of may so the tests would have to hold until September.

Cheers.

 

[Hashime]

Second update for today: The completed Trustfire "2400mAh" series. This cell is different than the blue ones I tested. It is black with flames. Interestingly enough its capacity claims were correct. I only tested two cells once each (time constraints and all that) but I found on the first cell discharging at 500mA (My new standard) a capacity of 2269 mAh, and on the second cell, 2332 mAh. I will have to pull up the DX sku of the battery, but if they are making them the same this cell is a better call than the blue cells at the same ~$4 a cell price.

Here is the discharge curve:

Anyways, as I said above, the next information to go up will be the NiMH tests.

I can expand on the data being provided if anyone wishes, These are just the discharge curves, I have data from the entire Li-Ion cycle including charging.

 

[LightCrazy]

Thanks again for all this testing!!! It will be interesting to see how the Fenix 18650 fairs in your test. I have mostly Fenix lights and batteries. I am hopeful that the Fenix batteries are optimized to give their lights at least as good of performance as the other leading battery brands. Wouldn't look to good for Fenix if their batteries only gave their lights mediocre performance.

 

[LightCrazy]

Hey Hashime, where did you go??? Hope everything is going OK.

 

[Hashime]

Update, Finally, Things got busy at work, I am back to school, the usual.

I have data from a few tests to go through and will be throwing it up as I have time.

There still is a package from china in the mail (over a month now) so those tests will have to wait until the fall when I am next on a work term.

As for what is done: I have tested the Fenix, Tenergy, Soshine LiFePO4, as well as some AA drain tests. I did the analysis on the Soshine batteries earlier today, so here is that data at least:

These batteries were disappointing. They had a capacity of ~450mAh at 750mA draw, ~466mAh at 500mA draw, and ~500mAh at 250mA draw. They were cheap however. The DX SKU for them is 154867. You could probably get good use out of them if you were only using your light for a few minutes a day and size was a concern. They are the same size as AA batteries.

As a side note, the SKU for the Trustfire Batteries that actually had a 2400mAh capacity is 175632. I cannot make claims about longevity / safety, but I have been using them for about a year and they are pretty great.

 

[Knight_Light]

These batteries were disappointing. They had a capacity of ~450mAh at 750mA draw, ~466mAh at 500mA draw, and ~500mAh at 250mA draw. They were cheap however. The DX SKU for them is 154867. You could probably get good use out of them if you were only using your light for a few minutes a day and size was a concern. They are the same size as AA batteries.

As a side note, the SKU for the Trustfire Batteries that actually had a 2400mAh capacity is 175632. I cannot make claims about longevity / safety, but I have been using them for about a year and they are pretty great.

I really appreciate you doing these tests. I always wondered about these particular batteries and you have actually solved that mystery. I guess it's another one of those brands that claims one capacity and totally under delivers. Thank you for your efforts.