Sold/Expired Feeler - Streamlight SL-20X and Sl-20X-LED Drop-in LED Conversion

[HarryN]

Streamlight SL-20X and Sl-20X-LED Drop-in LED Conversion – Feeler Thread

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Update 21 May 2010

Below you can see the picture - sorry for the poor quality image, but you get the idea.

From the top:
- Boost driver board (not yet populated with parts )
- LED board (parts on order)
- Proto of the drop in assembly (parts stacked up, not assembled)

The basic idea is that you pull out the existing lamp + reflector assembly, and replace it with this one.

Thanks

Harry

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Hi, as some of you know, I am developing an LED Drop-in replacement for the Streamlight SL-20X and SL-20X- LED flashlight. The drop-in is not quite ready, but in order to obtain decent pricing on parts, I need to estimate the volume needed for the first run. I am expecting to ship 20 of these in June 2010.

This is a FEELER THREAD / Interest expression thread. This means that you are not committing to buy, nor am I committed to sell them.

As a practical matter, this is the kind of light that is most commonly used in public safety / police work, and the design of this drop-in is focused on the needs of that market.

In particular, this drop in will provide:
- High light quality, not just brightness.
- The LEDs are very high CRI, 4000 K LEDs, which give provide high detail contrast. This is somewhat of a new experience for traditional LED flashlight users (like me) that had trouble seeing details, even with a lot more total lumens out the front of their flashlight. This compares to approx. 3000K from the incan bulb assy and a similar CRI. The beam will appear slightly whiter, more like an overdriven incan bulb.
- As much as possible, made in North America and the EU.

- LED power – 12 – 15 watts of LED lighting power, approximately 2X the out the front lumens of the standard incan bulb assy.
- Similar run time to the standard incan bulbs that come from Streamlight, just more light
- As close as possible similar operation and characteristics to the light – on / off

Beamshots and pictures. Yes, I should post some, but I am going through another rev of the build and I want to only post accurate information.

For those not familiar with this family of lights, of course the best information comes from the Streamlight web site, but a quick summary:

SL-20X – Aluminum body, full size flashlight, 5 series, ½ D size, NiCad battery pack, 10 – 12 watt incan bulb / reflector assy. (I have 3 of these lights myself)

SL-20XP – same, but the body is molded plastic instead of aluminum

SL-20X-LED Aluminum body, full size flashlight, 5 series, sub C NiCad battery pack, 10 – 12 watt incan bulb main beam, plus a 3 each, 5mm LED secondary / low beam (I have 1 of these lights so far)

SL-20XP-LED – Same as the SL-20X-LED, but the body is molded plastic instead of aluminum

All of these are Streamlight factory specified at nominally:
- 200 lumens
- 20 – 25,000 Lux at the VERY CENTER of the beam. It drops off very fast to much lower numbers, but it is a solid thrower.

This drop-ins will only work with the aluminum body lights, not the plastic body lights. The basic reason is that the heat from the LEDs needs to be dissipated by the body, so it has to be aluminum to work.

In case you don't know about it, you can already buy via Amazon, a drop-in from Terralux that provides 3 watts of LED lighting power, vs 12 – 15 on this one. I think Terralux sells these for around $ 40 – 50 / each. My perception is that they are a bit fragile for my taste, but they might be a good choice on a tight budget.

Pricing:
- Estimated pricing $ 125 / each
- Most likely I will discount the price 10% for those purchased in the first batch compared to future buyers.
- I have not yet decided on payment methods and deposits, but I prefer to keep things simple.
- First batch – 20 to ship in June
- Shipping locations – I don't think these are so common outside of North America, so I am initially focused on sales in North America. (Canada / US / Mexico) Feel free to let me know if this is an error.

- Please note if you are interested in the one for the SL-20x, or the SL-20x-led, as they are not interchangeable.

So, if you have read all of this, and are still interested, please post here. If these are commonly used by your department, please send an email to me directly. (sales at wirlnet dot com)

Thank you for your interest and patience.

Harry

 

[HarryN]

LED Module Drop in interest list:

SL-20X version
- Lightleaner
- HarryN x 2
- 021411
- EvilPaul2112
- CWhitt
- motorwerks
- Jaundice
- tjhabak

SL-20X-LED version
- CDP930
- HarryN
- mlatino

Just for info, I am trying to make the SL-20x and SL20x-led versions identical, but I am not quite there yet.

SL-20XP Version
- I am not sure if this will be offered or not. If it is offered, it will be a lower power version only, as the light is a polymer body, which is not very good for high power LED applications.
- icpd30

SL-20 (no x)
- maybe motorwerks - need to study the light to see what is possible after the other drop ins are finished.
- Pomosapian
Version not stated yet
- None

 

[HarryN]

BTW - here is the original thread I started in the home made and custom section about this project in case you are interested.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=238105

 

[CDP930]

Very interesed in one for a SL-20X LED.

Cant find a good head mounted switch on newer lights these days that are of bigger size.

If you decide to do a run Ill pass along the info to coworkers and see if they would be interested.

 

[HarryN]

Thank you for the reply.

Most likely, all of the units for June will be the -LED version, as it is the most complicated to build and drives the overall design a bit. (both vesions will use the same circuit boards)

I am in so deep time wise and financially that is is highly likely that it will move forward, but I just don't want people mad if there are delays or unplanned life events.

 

[LiterLeaner]

Harry,

I am still interested on these. I am heading back to nights in less than a month and would love to do a comparison to my 5D Cell modified Maglite.

Thanks,
Frank

 

[HarryN]

Harry,

I am still interested on these. I am heading back to nights in less than a month and would love to do a comparison to my 5D Cell modified Maglite.

Thanks,
Frank

Hi Frank, Thanks for the post. I think you have the standard SL-20x - correct?

I see the 4 cell mag in your sig line, but not the 5 D modified one. Is this setup the one with the 3x LED from Terralux?

I am expecting the Lumens and Lux to be similar, but your ability to resolve detail, especially fine grain details, and color rendering will increase.

Edit: I looked some more at this upgrade, and was kind of surprised by the relatively modest thermal path for the LEDs. It also looks like it turns on at 700 lumens, then drops to 500 fairly quickly. (Their product description). I will just say that the thermal path on this module is "considerable".


Just so it is clear, I am setting up these mods to be decently powerful, but not to stress the switch and battery pack beyond their standard operation. If you are after even more power, perhaps we should talk about it.

 

[CDP930]

So....even if you dont get the amount of requests you want, would those of us still after them be able to purchase?

I am excited about the idea. Bought the SL-20X LED and didnt even use it because of its shortcomings. However i like the platform.

I hope you are able to make some sales...finger is the paypal button :twothumbs

 

[HarryN]

Hi, I am going to build some, if for no other reason than I own 3 each of the SL-20x s and 1 of the -led ones, so I need these for myself anyway.

I suspect that interest will rise over time, which is probably good, since that gives me more time to grow the build infrastructure. If its a decent product with useful results for the end users, they will show it around.

As a practical matter, I will have about $ 3 K of development costs into this project before I actually buy the parts to build any to ship, so its not like it will be a big money maker anyway even if I sell quite a few. Its sort of an extension of the hobby. It would be nice to break even in the end, but realistically, most hobby flashlight project runs don't break even.

I am curious though, which shortcomings do you think are in the light? I like the secondary beam, but not the rings of it, and over driven blueish light. In some ways, my goal for switching this over to LED are "just because it was there." What are you hoping to get out of this change?

The main SL-20x beam has good punch (throw) but I am not so excited about the very small hot spot and large corona. In the end, there aren't that many ways to pull an LED conversion off, so I hope people like the beam well enough. The -LED beam is less pleasing IMHO, due to the cut outs in the reflector.

I actually have toyed with the idea of making the secondary beam (the LEDs) traffic light red instead of white. This would be potentially useful for retaining night vision, but of course not so great for searching a car interior.

At the moment, I am planning to use a Lumileds Rebel for the secondary beam instead of those 3 small LEDs, so any color that the Rebel comes in is possible, at least in theory. Right now, I am planning to make the secondary beam white, and logistically, it is more challenging than you might think to have the secondary beam a different color. Not impossible, just another challenge.

 

[CDP930]

Well, I purchased mine for carry after already having an Ultrastinger and just felt that the Ultrastinger, being brighter and throwing further, was better.

I have tried several different lights for duty, currently main light is a Malkoff MD4 and secondary is an Eagle Tac T100C Mark II.

For me, I like having a bigger primary light for all the obvious LEO reasons. Dont get me wrong, I like the SL-20 platform and would love to get that sucker up to par on the brightness level of todays "super lights".

Also, none of todays lights have head mounted switches, whether they are 4 inches long or 14 inches long. The longer the light is, the more awkward it is to hold for normal tasks, especially if you have to hold the light on the move.

Anywho, Im totally down for one, keep me on the list for sure.

I agree about the small hotspot. Small doesnt bother me to much as long as I have some decent spill. The different colered secondary LEDs would be interesting, Id like to see something like that.

I know it must be tough as all holy hell to make something like this from scratch, but whenever you could provide a decent comparison, be it words or pictures, that would seal the deal.

Thanks

 

[LiterLeaner]

Hi Frank, Thanks for the post. I think you have the standard SL-20x - correct?

I see the 4 cell mag in your sig line, but not the 5 D modified one. Is this setup the one with the 3x LED from Terralux?

Typo... its a 4 cell and the SL20X (both) are the standard aluminum body converted over using the drop in.

 

[HarryN]

The Ultra Stinger is a very nice thrower. I don't own one, but have seriously considered it. The SL web site lists it as having 2X the Cd (75,000 vs 30,000) of the stock SL-20x, which is pretty impressive. I can see why this is a popular light for LEO use, and I have a lot of respect for Streamlight.

I noticed that SL rates the runtime on these lights as the time to reach 10% output, which I had missed before. On freshly charged cells, that Ultra Stinger center hot spot will out throw this LED drop in, no question. After 20 - 30 minutes of use, that story might change.

In case you can't tell, I am going to rate things on the conservative side. My prior work has indicated that it is a lot safer to assume that "out the front lumens" are about 50% of the "LED data sheet rated lumens". If it turns out better, that is fine.

This build is for light quality, as in identification of what you see, not a super light, although that would be fun to do sometime. Some example are being able to tell if your steak is cooked right on the grill, or finding items lost in the grass. Of course, with that much light, I find the main beam is a bit much for short range use.

Please relax on the buy / pay part, but I do appreciate the interest. I am mostly trying to calibrate if the first batch should be 20 or 100, and I think this thread will show this over the next month.

Harry

 

[EvilPaul2112]

very interested

 

[021411]

I am interested in a drop-in for my 20X.
I currently run a prototype Malkoff 3x Q5 module in mine that I got in 2008. It's been good to me so far on-duty. I never had a failure yet. It has been dropped and used as a door knocker. :naughty: I'm looking for something better now since LED tech has advanced since then. Put me down. lovecpf

 

[icpd30]

I use a SL-20XP for duty, and upgraded to Terrelux. Brighter...uh, maybe, maybe not. Certainly longer run-time. I'm in for an SL-20XP.

 

[HarryN]

Hi, Thanks for the interest.

- EvilPaul - Please let me know which version you want when you have a chance.

- 021411 - Thanks - have you down.

- ICPD30 - Thank you for the interest. I know the body of that light is plastic, and I am assuming the head is as well, but will double check to see if it is aluminum or plastic.

If the head is plastic as well, then the full power version of this drop in will not work. Even if it is plastic, I might be able to come up with something that will work better than what you have. Let me look into this some more and see if I can offer you any options.

That is a very nice light, but LEDs need a thermal path to get the heat to the outside of the flashlight body. The same thing that makes the "P" models nice for winter, makes them bad for LEDs.

On the Terralux module you have, they really don't have a thermal path, and its only 3 watts, so it sort of works. If I had that module, I would probably go back to using the stock incan bulb assy, as that is certainly brighter in my mind.

 

[EvilPaul2112]

SL20X please

 

[HarryN]

Hi - just bumping this thread to check for interest.

Thanks

Harry

 

[CDP930]

Hey Harry

Still interested. Are you currently working on one or still waiting for more responses?

Id be interested in seeing some pics of progress if you are making one up.

 

[CWhitt]

I'm interested in one of these if they ever get goin'. I'm 'required' to use the issued SL20X for my work, but the standard lamp is less than impressive.