Flashlight Help

[TLRam1]

After pouring over threads here, You Tube videos, mfg sites, I seem to be getting more educated and more loss at the same time.

Looking at pocket carry sized lights that use 1 x 18650.


1. What are the different LED or what should I be looking for, I see CREE and a few letters, but I don't know what I should be looking for.

2. I do want to use rechargeable 18650 battery.

3. Do you get a different light output whether you use 2 x CR123 or 1 x 18650?

4. Any reason I should not go with the 3100 mah battery instead of the 2600 mah?

5. What is the difference between the protected and unprotected battery?

6. Most of what I see with a Lumens of around 850 in Turbo/Burst mode step down after a few minutes, are the small lights all like this?


Lights I have considered are too many to list but to give you an idea of type, Klarus XT11 XM-L2 Dual Switch 820, Nitecore EC25 Cobra XM-L U2, Fenix PD32 UE, Leaning towards the Fenix PD35.

1. I like a low lumens output of around 10, as well as high in the 800 range

2. Prefer a more flood type vs a concentrated beam.

3. I like the rear button because it's cool and I don't know any better why, side button is fine to for mode change.

Thank You
Terry

 

[Dadof6]

Terry, I'll try and answer as many questions as you have.

My first thought is that an 18650 is, in my opinion, a little on the bigger side for pocket carry. Not that you can't, it just seems to bulge a bit.
3100 over 2600 doesn't matter as much as getting a battery that is reputable. Some manufacturers overinflate their mah.

Difference between protected and unprotected I quote from Lighthound's website "The primary difference between the Protected and Unprotected batteries is that the protected batteries have a small circuit board, typically on the bottom of the battery, that stops the charging or discharge of the battery in certain circumstances. Some of the circumstances in which the circuit include: Over-Charge, Over-Discharge, Short-Circuit, and in some cases, overheating"

I believe you could get a different output with a difference between 2 CR123 and one 18650. Look at this website for more information about drivers http://flashlightwiki.com/Driver.

Hope this helps you a bit.

Rich

 

[Cereal_Killer]

2. I do want to use rechargeable 18650 battery.

3. Do you get a different light output whether you use 2 x CR123 or 1 x 18650?

2. I'm not trying to sound like a *** but I really think you need to do some more research on Li-ions before you go out and buy some. They can be very dangerous (tho a single battery will be safer than multiple cells) but these batteries can literally explode in your hands. Check the battery forum here and the "dangerous/close calls/smoke & fire" forum for details. (Also check out battery universe). I'm not tryin to turn you off from Li-ions, but please do yourself, family and friends a favor and build a better knowledge base on the subject before you make your first purchase.

3.The output difference will depend on the light, some lights are optimized to run either, and in that case output should be the same (but you'll get much longer runtimes out of one 18650 than 2 123's) but in other lights that really take 2x123's and just happen to work on 1x18650 you likely will see a slight decline in output (but again longer runtimes).

just an FYI: 2 cr123's in series (+ to -) DO NOT equal the capacity added up, if you have a 2xCR123 light and use 2 1500mAh batteries the total capacity will still only be 1500, therefore a single 2900mAh 18650 will have almost 2x the runtime (in real life you won't get twice the runtime exactly but it will be greatly extended).

The number one reason for batteries "venting with flame" (the Industries term for exploding) is using non-voltage matched cells, one draining first and the other reverse charging it. I would highly recommend picking up a DMM to make sure your using a voltage matched pair (even CR123's have this problem) by testing each battery as you insert them. If you don't have one you can get a $5 one from harbor freight good enough to do the job.

 

[TLRam1]

Terry, I'll try and answer as many questions as you have.

My first thought is that an 18650 is, in my opinion, a little on the bigger side for pocket carry. Not that you can't, it just seems to bulge a bit.
3100 over 2600 doesn't matter as much as getting a battery that is reputable. Some manufacturers overinflate their mah.

Difference between protected and unprotected I quote from Lighthound's website "The primary difference between the Protected and Unprotected batteries is that the protected batteries have a small circuit board, typically on the bottom of the battery, that stops the charging or discharge of the battery in certain circumstances. Some of the circumstances in which the circuit include: Over-Charge, Over-Discharge, Short-Circuit, and in some cases, overheating"

I believe you could get a different output with a difference between 2 CR123 and one 18650. Look at this website for more information about drivers http://flashlightwiki.com/Driver.

Hope this helps you a bit.

Rich

Rich,

Thanks for the reply.

Yes an 18650 type might be a little large for packet carry, from the little knowledge I have, the CR123 lights do not handle or CR123 are not rechargeable batteries but I have not researched it enough. A friend showed me the first experience of a high power light and it was the Lenser F1 and they do not work with rechargables. I will need to determine who is reputable, the one I have looked at was the Eagletac.

I take it protected is the way to go, correct?

Thanks for the link I will read it after posting here.

 

[TLRam1]

2. I'm not trying to sound like a *** but I really think you need to do some more research on Li-ions before you go out and buy some. They can be very dangerous (tho a single battery will be safer than multiple cells) but these batteries can literally explode in your hands. Check the battery forum here and the "dangerous/close calls/smoke & fire" forum for details. (Also check out battery universe). I'm not tryin to turn you off from Li-ions, but please do yourself, family and friends a favor and build a better knowledge base on the subject before you make your first purchase.

3.The output difference will depend on the light, some lights are optimized to run either, and in that case output should be the same (but you'll get much longer runtimes out of one 18650 than 2 123's) but in other lights that really take 2x123's and just happen to work on 1x18650 you likely will see a slight decline in output (but again longer runtimes).

just an FYI: 2 cr123's in series (+ to -) DO NOT equal the capacity added up, if you have a 2xCR123 light and use 2 1500mAh batteries the total capacity will still only be 1500, therefore a single 2900mAh 18650 will have almost 2x the runtime (in real life you won't get twice the runtime exactly but it will be greatly extended).

The number one reason for batteries "venting with flame" (the Industries term for exploding) is using non-voltage matched cells, one draining first and the other reverse charging it. I would highly recommend picking up a DMM to make sure your using a voltage matched pair (even CR123's have this problem) by testing each battery as you insert them. If you don't have one you can get a $5 one from harbor freight good enough to do the job.

I will do more research on Li-ions but what would I use if not Li-ions? All these lights from what I see Li-ions are what they use or recommended.

3. I had not realized that, thanks for the info.

Regarding venting with flame issue, if you put 2 CR123's together, wouldn't they be the same voltage or is this something you have to check even on same voltage batteries?

I don't mind your opinions, that is what I am here for.

Thanks
Terry

 

[Cereal_Killer]

2. I will do more research on Li-ions but what would I use if not Li-ions? All these lights from what I see Li-ions are what they use or recommended.

3. I had not realized that, thanks for the info.

4.Regarding venting with flame issue, if you put 2 CR123's together, wouldn't they be the same voltage or is this something you have to check even on same voltage batteries?

I don't mind your opinions, that is what I am here for.

Thanks
Terry

I numbered your questions so my responses would be clear.

2. Li-ion is the best option, NiMh can't even come close in terms of watt-hours /battery and I'm not at all trying to scare you away, or change your mind. But you wouldn't go out and buy a firearm if you weren't well versed in the subject of firearm safety, and without doing research first, just saying that Li-ions also need a elevated level of care and a good understanding of the safety aspect. You're here asking about them so I'd say you're already doing the research and on the right track.

3. These are just a couple examples of the difference- my solarforce XM-L drop ins are rated for 2.7-9v, they are really designed to run at 6v from 2xcr123's and put out 550Lm, at ~4v on a single 18650 it puts out 500Lm (the difference from 500 to 550 is undetectable by eye) on the other hand the armytek predator has a way to tell it if your using 1x18650 or 2x123's, its designed to take either and the output will be the same.

4. Yes that happens even with 123's even from the SAME PACK. You really should voltage match each battery at the time of use. They could be in a pack together but have different date codes (they could be in a pack together but be mfg's months apart too). The only way to know is a quick DMM check, it takes 5 sec while your inserting the batteries. Honestly CR123's are no less dangerous than Li-ions and a lot of time the general public is total unaware of the additional safety measures required to ensure safe use/care of them. I guess that's the hazard of a "new" product (I know they're not new, but lots of people are just learning of them). Like I said in my first post, a single cell setup will be much safer (cause again the biggest problem is one cell dying first and being reverse charged by the other, well they don't like being reverse charged, by design a single cell can't have that problem) FWIW I only own one multi 18650 light, and I don't loan it to anyone, I do however have no problem handin out one of my 2xCR123 lights that I'm running on 1x18650.

Check out this forum for the horror stories, if your not carefull, and don't know what your doing, a multi-cell light can be more powerful than an M-80, and I'm sure you wouldn't want an M-80 going off in your hand.

thanks for not being upset, I wasn't trying to be offensive, and you seem to be putting in the required research, welcome to CPF, keep your wallet close, this hobby is expensive!

 

[TLRam1]

Thanks Cereal Killer for the info.

I read through the issue of the batteries from 4Seven explode & burn. I will be using a single cell so that should help to reduce problems although thanks for letting me know, I had no idea of the issues about mixing cells of different voltage. I will continues reading and use best practices to avoid problems.

So much info in a couple of post......

Is the CPF Market Place different from this forum, looks like I have to join that forum?

Thanks
Terry

 

[Cereal_Killer]

Yea it a separate forum, ran by the same people but differet login info required.