Interest in Compact Fluorescent posts?

[ikendu]

I've started to replace all the lights in my house with Compact Fluorescent lights. They are 2-4 times more efficient than incandescent bulbs and last way longer. They cost more but since they last longer, the cost is about the same while at the same time saving money (and energy) from your electric bill.

However, (as with many things) I've found that not all brands or models are alike. I've got one light for my living room that is great and another set from a 4 pack that are terrific too! Some other models that I bought are dim, mis-colored and one stopped working way pre-maturely. Some start almost instantly and others take forever to come up to regular brightness. Although I bought two for my daughter and they are just about perfect! It's clear that not all Compact Fluorescent lights are created equal!

So...I haven't been able to find a good source of reviews or an active community of curious folks with which to share information on this topic. Naturally, when I thought of curious folks...I thought of this forum!!

Any interest in starting up a forum just for this category of lights? Or...anyone know of such a forum ...or, a good source of reviews?.

Thanks!

 

[jmm]

I did the same thing about 10 years ago. I was VERY disappointed with their longevity (or lack thereof). Some of the replacements I've bought seem a little better, but I haven't found any yet that came close enough to being what I would consider "long life". I'd definitely be interested in seeing some long term life comparisons by brand, in case there was something decent out there that I havnt't run across in the local home improvement joints.

John

 

[Chris M.]

This house has almost all flourescent lights too, asides the living-room which has dimmer switches so I can`t put any in there, and the bathroom shaving light, which I`m working on

. I did change out the linear incandescent tubes in the living room display cabinets with triphosphor flourescents, though they were bigger than the bathroom one and won`t fit in there. I`ve seen some shorter ones, it`s just a case of finding a supplier!

They`re on the whole pretty good in this country, our stringent rules and regulations must weed out all the really bad ones cos I`ve not had many problems and find the colours and CRI have been OK. Surprisingly the only troubles I have had is with Philips Ambiance, "normal bulb shaped" electronic ones - I had two of those fail within 3 months, so havn`t used them again. Their SL Prismatic lights are the best - good old fashioned magnetic ballast and a high quality tube good for 12000+ hours easilly, with good efficiency. 18 watts = 120 watt incandescent. The downside - they`re huge, heavy, and some of them can be heard to buzz/chirp a bit at close quarters.

I fould some tiny 15 watt electronic-ballast spiral ones recently that are as tall as a normal bulb so will fit where no other flourescent has gone before, and give as much light as a 75 watt normal bulb. It would seem the technology is advancing, so expect to see them get ever smaller and cheaper in the near future!

Don Klipstein has a good page where he reviews some of the CFLs he`s found for sale and will be more relevent to you US folks than anything I could ever tell you. UK flourescents seem to be quite different.

Don`s page: http://misty.com/people/don/cfbest.html

And yes, I know I can`t spell it right! But it`s too late to change. My typing`s bad enough as it is....

 

[jmm]

Chris M - Like you, I've had decent luck with the "real" full sized tube/ballast based fixtures. I made a bathroom "shaving" fixture with triphosphor and cool white fluorescents in addition to incandescents so my girlfriend at the time could check out her makeup in the light of her intended destination. She liked it. She didn't like a lot of the other lights I made or bought. I started liking the lights better than her, but that's not a problem any more.

My previous negative comments were directed specifically toward "compact" fluorescents as they were the topic of this thread. I've gone through at least 20 Phillips brand compacts in the last 10 years, and there are right at the top of my "S" list.

John

 

[James S]

I did a rather long post at some point in the past you may be able to find by searching the board, but I'll sumarize it a bit.

Sylvania 75w equivalent spiral lamps. These are my favorite. They are inexpensive and sold at Lowes. Color temperature is a good white and they are bright. Only downside is that they take a heatbeat to light after you turn the power on.

GE 100 watt equivalent spiral lamp. I have 4 of these I bought for less than $5 a piece from Target. They are all still going good. They startup funny though, with a bright flash and then light a hearbeat later. They reach full brightness quickly, but have a very pink or even violet tinged light. This is preferrable to the green tinged light that some el-cheapo CF's have though.

Phillips marathon 3 way 75/100/120 (?) these are also very nice lights. I own 2 of them and they are both going strong. They are very bright. The color temperature is not quite as good as the sylvania bordering on green, but not objectionable after they have warmed up. These are the hottest running of any of the CF's I have, but they are also the brightest. I would buy more of these, but they are also the most expensive. These are carried at home depot.

Commercial Electric 75 watt equivalent compact spiral lamps. Home Depot sells a LOT of this brand of light. These are rated for enclosed fixtures which is why I got them. They have proven to be very reliable, I've been running them for 8 months or more now in the kitchen overhead which gets switched on and off a lot. They light instantly which is nice too. It does take them a minute or so to reach full brightness and the color is quite green when first turned on but they brighten to an acceptable color, but not as good as the sylvania which is the benchmark as far as I'm concerned. They are also inexpensive.

Commercial Electric enclosed 75 watt equivalent floodlight. These look ver much like a regular par type lamp. The color is VERY blue and they take a LONG time to warm up, but do put out a lot of light once they warm up. Personally I don't like them very much due to the color and wont be buying any more.

Commercial Electric 60 watt equivalent enclosed bulb. These look like a regular bulb. Don't bother with them. They are very dim, take forever to reach full brightness, the light is horribly green and dim.

Lights of America lights. I bought 7 or 8 of their non-spiral tubed, 75 watt equivalent lamps about 4 years ago to put in the recessed fixtures in my basement. I was very impressed with the first batch I bought, the light color was good and they were bright. So I bought a few more and a few of the brighter 100 watt ones. All the 100 watt ones ballasts literally smoked and burned out within a couple of weeks. All the newer 75 watt ones burned out in a short time too. I have continued to use the first batch of 75 watt ones and lost the first one since then 3 nights ago in a lamp that burns most of the night. So I was happy with that first batch, but have never bought any more because I suspect their QA isn't very good. Or at least it wasn't good back then.

Lights of America twist lamp. I bought one a couple of years ago. It's aweful, green green green. Can't use it except in the utility closit.

These are my personal experiences with the lights, yours may vary!

 

[jmm]

James - Thanks for the detailed info, maybe the things are getting better. I'm willing to put up with a few startup quirks and moderate time to full brightness, which is to be expected with any fluorescent. Even those that don't seem that obvious to the eye, show a big difference to a light meter after one minute of on time.

My experience with units from Lights of America parallels yours, generally el crapo. I may be willing to give Phillips another try with some of their newer units, since you said yours are holding up well. I really liked some of their other plus features, but the ones I had werent any better than the LOAs.

By the way, I've used some of your Mac software. You do nice work!

John

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

jmm, contrary to your experience with Philips, I have had very good service from mine. I haven't bought any more compact fluorescent bulbs in years since the last crop I bought is doing so well, so I'm not up on the very latest technology in terms of personal experience..but

the burnouts stopped when I found the Philips DIMMABLE compact fluorescents. The dimmables obviously handle brownouts much better than the others, (one of which actually melted a hole in it's side during a brown out where I used to live -- I'm off grid now; never a brown-out) the other non-dimmable fluorescents have been quite happy with the quality of electricity from the sinewave inverter too; even the Philips EARTHLIGHTs, which are NOT DIMMABLE, and NOT to be used with "electronic timers, motion detectors, or photo-cell devices" and it says so on the package..but these are lights are cheap; $8.00 at the Home Depot, and I like the warmish pink-yellow fluorescents better than the bluish 'outdoor' lights..but you are probably better off finding the dimmable ones..

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

 

[Lurker]

I have dabbled with these a few times over the past 10 years and between several moves I have lost whatever I had. I am just beginning to experiment with CF again. I recently bought the Sunbeam value-pack of 4 twist-style lamps, 24W = 100W, at Target recently. Very cheap, I think about $12 for the 4 bulbs. I installed 2 in my bedroom office ceiling light fixture and am very happy with them. They light almost instantly, but start out dim and a little off-color, but warm-up quickly enough and are then very bright and white.

The major drawback is that these lights are longer than incandescent bulbs and I couldn't get them into any of my enclosed ceiling fixtures in the kitchen or hallway, so 2 are still in the box.

I also put a yellow CF bug-light on my front porch. It has been cold lately and that thing starts out really dim and takes a good 5+ minutes to warm up, but is otherwise fine. It will probably be much better in warm weather.

I guess fitting CF lights takes some shopping around, and my wife always resists change of this nature, so I have not yet investigated any further. If someone could point me to good bulbs that would fit my fixtures, I might overcome my inertia on this. One hurdle is that I have numerous kinds of incandescent bulbs in my house, including 3-way reading lamps, bathroom vanity globes, chandalier bulbs with bases that are smaller than standard, spot-lights and lights on dimmers, etc. I will be doing well if I can just replace a few of the most-used lights, but wherever I can get one in, it seems like a good way to save money and help the environment.

 

[jmm]

Ted - Thanks for the tip. I don't think any of the Phillips units I bought between 6 and 10 years or so ago were rated as being dimmable. Although I didn't use "electronic" switching or dimming on any of the fluorescents in question, it makes sense that those that could handle it might be a bit more gutsy. I don't mind paying more for something up front if it means I don't have to mess with as much later.

Jeeze I love this place, you get exposed to so much real world practical experience based knowledge.

John

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

John, my pleasure. I did a little googling and found links that suggest the designation "Earthlight" may mean dimmable, maybe not, you gotta check. They are several times more expensive;

interesting discussion of compact fluorescents, dimmable and otherwise;

http://www.cyberg.com/cflarticle.htm

pictures of dimmable and non-dimmable Philips, and some prices;

http://sierraclub.usptgear.com/energystore.htm

cheers!

 

[ikendu]

The good ones that I got so far are:

GE spiral 100w equivalent, light quickly, bright quickly and good color (not too blue or too warm).

Sylvania 55w equivalent (bought in a 4 pack for $9 total)...same deal, great lights! ...and, compact enough to fit anywhere (but only 55w eq.).

GE mini-spiral 40w equivalent (only draws 10w!), these are REALLY tiny, small enough to go anywhere. I've got them in an enclosed, shallow glass fixture in a hallway. There is just the slightest hesitation before they light...then great! And...the 40w is just the right amount of light for that hallway. It used to draw 120w from two 60w bulbs...now draws only 20 watts from the two spiral CF bulbs; 6 times less power!

CF desk lamp from WalMart...takes a 13w, long, double tube CF. I works great! Quick to light and really bright for 13w!

Lights-of-America 150w equivalent; lights really well, this is my work horse "read the paper" light. This light worked so well, I really got thinking that Lights-of-America made really great lights! However...

Lights that have been BAD investments:

#1...all of my other Lights-of-America lights.

I bought 5 or 6 of the reflector style lights that go in those "in-the-ceiling" light cans. They work "OK" but overall, I'm not really happy with them. They are too slow to brighten up, too dim and weird color. They are 65w equivalent. Although, I am using them...and I've not found a better substitute.

I got another Lights-of-America 60w enclosed light (looks like a bulb)...it buzzes and it's too dim. Overall, I just don't think I could recommend any lights from this manufacturer.

#2 Panasonic Light capsules. I got these for the bathroom 'cause the spiral lights just looked too weird for my wife. They start unbelievably dim, take forever to brighten up and one of the 3 I bought already died after about 2 months of use.

Bottom line...so far, only the new spiral type lights have been really good. The Sylvania were clearly the best deal and are great lights too! All of the enclosed, bulb-look lights have been not-so-good. Now when we look for lamp fixtures, we only consider ones where the longer spiral type bulbs are going to work.

 

[ikendu]

Any one got experience with a good outdoor CF light for a porch? It can get below zero here in the midwest but some nights we leave this light on for a long time and I sure wish it was CF!

 

[highlandsun]

Anyone using these candelabra base chandelier CFLs? I have a couple chandeliers that regularly go thru incandescents and I'm tired of replacing them. (Two over my stairwell, 3 bulbs each, non-dimming. The big hassle is setting up the ladder to reach the 2nd lamp from the bottom of the stairs. I also have a 5-bulb lamp in my dining room, but that's on a dimmer and I definitely haven't seen any dimmable candelabra CFL bulbs.) The going rate seems to be around $7 each regardless of brand.

 

[highlandsun]

Ted, thanks for the link but I've already done similar searches. Just because you find those words on the same page doesn't mean they're all in the same sentence, or talking about a single bulb. The dimmable CFLs are 18W or larger, in regular bases. If you know of a specific URL that has them, I'd love to see it, but that Google search is too general.

 

[T-Rex]

newsgroup:

sci:engr:lighting

Look through the google archives. Discussions ad nauseaum.

 

[highlandsun]

Here's a possibly better solution, a universal dimmer that drives fluorescents as well as incandescents:
http://www.maxlite.com/Pages-html/PR%20Stories/DimAll%20PR.html

 

[James S]

John, Thanks

And I should probably mention that I've had ALL of the above mentioned lights plugged into X10 modules at some point. Some of them even incorrectly plugged into lamp modules. I'm careful to set those to not-dimmable in my home automation software XTension (which I whole heartedly recommend as the best home automation software available anywhere for any price) so that they don't get dimmed. I know that they shouldn't be used with the lamp modules as that even all the way on the output it an altered sign wave which could cause heating or buzzing in the lamps. The only one that had any problems with this at all were the Commercial Electrib bulb shaped lamp which I already mentioned was worthless no matter how you powered it. It buzzed loudly and got quite hot, none of the other lamps have had any problems with them that way and some have been on X10 control for a year or longer.

 

[flashfan]

Be sure to check color temperature when buying compact fluorescent bulbs. I haven't checked recently, but most Home Depot, Target, etc. compact fluorescent bulbs emit approx. 2700k (warm white) light.

I buy my compact fluorescent bulbs from topbulb.com (they were one of the few suppliers I was able to find several years ago that carried compact fluorescent bulbs with bright, white light at a relatively decent cost). The bulbs I currrently use are at approx. 4100k (26W). There are bulbs of 5000k and higher, but some of them are quite expensive ($30+ per bulb for the Spiralux). Ott-Lite manufactures bright, white (full spectrum?) compact fluorescent bulbs and fixtures, but they are expensive, too.

I've been planning to try out a couple of the "newer" (on the topbulb site) 55W, 5000k spiral bulbs, but just haven't gotten around to ordering them. The major drawback of these bulbs is that they are so HUGE, and thus won't fit into many applications...

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Originally posted by highlandsun:
Ted, thanks for the link but I've already done similar searches. Just because you find those words on the same page doesn't mean they're all in the same sentence, or talking about a single bulb. The dimmable CFLs are 18W or larger, in regular bases. If you know of a specific URL that has them, I'd love to see it, but that Google search is too general.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">mm. there were so many promising sites on the google search page, I thought I'd just let you look yourself. sorry. I'm still looking. so far just this 5 watt fluorescent, non-dimming; (I'll add a dimmable here if I find one later)

http://www.topbulb.com/find/Product_Description.asp?intProductID=47177&promoid=70

(added)no 5w dimmables yet, but here's a 'starting temperature' chart for many different cf's i thought might be useful to some:

http://www.gaiam.com/retail/gai_content/learn/gai_learnArticle.asp?article_id=583