Oh TK40, why did I forsake you?

[JaguarDave-in-Oz]

Where I live we don't get too many dogs attacking people but we sure get a lot of cases of people's dogs coming onto our properties and hunting or killing sheep.

Those dogs generally get shot on sight, no questions, no comebacks (in fact the dog's owners are still required to pay damages for lost stock). Actually that seems to be one situation where a light really will scare off a dog. These dogs often seem to know full well that they are not allowed to be doing what they are doing, they do the bolt big time if they know they've been seen. You've got to be quick to get the shot in.

I'd hate to think what would happen if some of these dogs ever decided it was more fun to hunt and kill children than sheep and lambs.

I once rang the police about a dog hunting sheep. I knew the owners (some local criminals) and figured there might be some retaliation if I just up and shot their dog and the police said, "it's going to take us half an hour to get there, you've got a gun, just shoot it, we'll sort out any problems with the owners when we get there".

People who own dogs have a responsibility to keep them away form other people an dproperties. If they can't make sure the dogs stay within the boundaries of their own properties then the dogs should be taken off them.

I have a dog (a kelpie sheepdog) and it's never free to wander unsupervised.

 

[Greg G]

I just want to clarify something.

Not once did I make mention of any opinions on "guns, religion, politics". This thread is about a flashlight, so in essence, yes you are bragging about shooting a dog. It is off topic, and to some unnecessary.

In Aus. we don't have the ability to carry guns, but I am not frightened of dogs attacking me.

I was attacked by a German Shepard when I was six years old. I didn't have a gun to protect me.
Guess what my favourite breed of dog is now...

I apologise to the op for taking this thread off topic. However, I feel that some of what TOQ said was rather unjust, and prejudice.

There are two topics in the first post; the flashlight (primary), and the dog attack(subordinate). The effectiveness of a flashlight during a dog attack is a valid topic IMHO. I know the last thing that I would want to do is kill anything, including a dog..... but if the dog presses things and makes it a case of "him or me" I'm going to fight for my life by any means available. I don't carry a firearm when I go walking, but I do carry a sharp knife, and if the dog engages me I'm going to do society a favor if it's in my power.

I've seen the consquences of dog attacks. It's never pretty when there's actual contact.


P.S. Glad you escaped serious injury when you were 6, but don't let it make you complacent.

 

[DimeRazorback]

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for bringing a threat to an end.

But the fact is, a flashlights strobe would never kill an animal.

So why are we all talking about shooting an attacking dog with a gun?

It is off topic and not necessarily appropriate for a family orientated forum.

Thank you for your concern, but trust me, I am definitely not complacent around animals of any kind :laughing:
They are animals, and are unpredictable. I do love them though.

I also won't live in fear of another attack, as owners should be more responsible of their animal.

 

[Kindle]

Regarding the effectiveness of flashlights as a deterrent against attacking animals...

1. Even if it has worked in some cases there is more than enough anecdotal evidence to believe that it doesn't work in ALL cases. Is something that may or may work really worth staking your life on? IMO no.

2. While I wouldn't advocate relying on a flashlight as a deterrent...if you're in a situation where you have one and it appears that the animal is absolutely intent on attacking you (and you don't have any better options)...what do you have to lose by trying it?

Unfortunately when it comes to defense situations there isn't always a right answer.

I would like to make a correction to my post above. I got a bit hot and said something I would not do. If some owner of a dog I had shot did come out to confront me, I would NOT point a gun at him! I would simply pull out my cellphone and call the police and let them sort it out. I would do everything I could to prevent further violence but yes if pressed and I felt the owner was also going to cause us harm, I would then re-pull the gun and warn him not to advance any further as he would be chancing great bodily harm if he was to to do.
..

If you get "hot" & lose your composure over a minor message board comment you might want to seriously rethink your ability to stay calm and maintain your head in an adrenaline charged fight or flight scenario.

 

[Greg G]

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for bringing a threat to an end.

But the fact is, a flashlights strobe would never kill an animal.

So why are we all talking about shooting an attacking dog with a gun?

It is off topic and not necessarily appropriate for a family orientated forum.

Thank you for your concern, but trust me, I am definitely not complacent around animals of any kind :laughing:
They are animals, and are unpredictable. I do love them though.

I also won't live in fear of another attack, as owners should be more responsible of their animal.

*If* the light had not failed during a dog attack, the OP likely would not have even posted about the light failure in the first place. He would have just repaired the thing and gone on about his business. *When* the light failed, (during a dog attack) is part of the story. Get it?


One member simply "reported the news" about a dog attack he was involved in. Nothing more. I did not read it as being barbaric, or speaking down to those that place the lives of dogs above humans. If you do not fear dogs, and you feel safe putting your life in the hands of every dog owner whose house you walk by, then that's your choice. I'm not one to say you're wrong about it, although it is not the choice I make.

Cheers! :thumbsup:

 

[was.lost.but.now.found]

Half of you people should NOT be allowed to carry arms. A warning shot above the head would suffice, or in the path its running. What if a mentally disturbed person or someone that is high on narcotics charged towards you?

With apologies, you belong in that half. You should never fire warning shots in the air. You will be more likely to be in trouble with the law for that than for actually shooting the dog. There are documented cases of people being killed by stray bullets fired into the air. You either have just cause to fire at and kill the dog or you don't. There are no warning shots, and the LEOs on this site will back me up on that.

 

[LightOnAHill]

So why are we all talking about shooting an attacking dog with a gun?

It is off topic and not necessarily appropriate for a family orientated forum.

So Old Yeller isn't a family movie?


I couldn't resist.

 

[JaguarDave-in-Oz]

So Old Yeller isn't a family movie?

nor my favourite To Kill a Mockingbird!

That ol' Atticus was the best shot in the county.......

 

[JaguarDave-in-Oz]

But the fact is, a flashlights strobe would never kill an animal.

So why are we all talking about shooting an attacking dog with a gun?

perhaps because manyof us view it as an appropriate part of a discussion on the the failure of a torch to deter an animal and whether the user of the failed torch may still have needed to rely on something else even if it had not failed. Personally I see a direct correlation between one and the other in the way the discussion has flowed.

It is off topic and not necessarily appropriate for a family orientated forum.

It seems obvious to me that plenty of people appear to believe it is not off topic and just because some readers do not feel comfortable reading of such things does not make it right for them to attempt to stifle discussion between others who do feel comfortable about it.

As to the subject's appropriateness, I can't for the life of me see what it's got to do with this site being "family oriented" or not. Surely people who are part of families get attacked by dogs just as single people might.

 

[SureAddicted]

As to the subject's appropriateness, I can't for the life of me see what it's got to do with this site being "family oriented" or not. Surely people who are part of families get attacked by dogs just as single people might.

I'm particularly not interested in hearing about gun yielding yobbos period. It would be good to get to the root of the issue, which is the owner. If he wants to train his dog to attack people, he is held accountable, plus he must provide an enclosure so it cant be let loose on the streets.
I also think most of you need to grow some Kahuna's. This is a dog for crying out loud, I've never seen a dog charge at someone with a knife between its paw, or holding a gun between its two paws, for an adult it's not a life threatening situation. By reading what most of you have said, none of you even practice gun safety, which is a huge concern.

 

[computerpro3]

I'm particularly not interested in hearing about gun yielding yobbos period. It would be good to get to the root of the issue, which is the owner. If he wants to train his dog to attack people, he is held accountable, plus he must provide an enclosure so it cant be let loose on the streets.

1. The root of the issue doesn't matter when the dog is charging you. The simple fact of the matter is that there are tons of bad owners, tons of bad dogs as a result of this, and plenty of deaths from dog attacks every single year. In 2008, there were 23 fatalities in the US alone, and hundreds were maimed.

Welcome to the real world.

I also think most of you need to grow some Kahuna's. This is a dog for crying out loud, I've never seen a dog charge at someone with a knife between its paw, or holding a gun between its two paws, for an adult it's not a life threatening situation. .

2. You are completely, utterly ignorant about dog attacks and the strength of dogs. This is not name calling or a troll post, but a simple fact. My dog can most certainly kill you in under sixty seconds. A single bite from several breeds can snap your leg bone in two at the thickest part.

An excerpt from one of the stories:

35 years old (est.) | Detroit, MI
Robert Howard, estimated to be 35-years old, was killed by a pit bull that was attacking a woman's dogs. Police said a woman came out of her home when she saw a pit bull attacking her two chained dogs. When she tried to stop the attack, the pit bull went after her. She grabbed a shovel and beat the dog. Robert Howard came out of his house to help. The pit bull, which was reportedly a loose or stray fighting dog, tore into Howard's calf. His friend, Isaiah Brown, said, "[The dog] just snatched and pulled all the arteries out. He was lying on the steps, and when I checked his vital signs he was already dead then." Police said the dog bit a main artery in Howard's leg.

Yeah. Growing some "kahunas" sure would have helped him there.

 

[SureAddicted]

1. The root of the issue doesn't matter when the dog is charging you. The simple fact of the matter is that there are tons of bad owners, tons of bad dogs as a result of this, and plenty of deaths from dog attacks every single year. In 2008, there were 23 fatalities in the US alone, and hundreds were maimed. Welcome to the real world.



2. You are completely, utterly ignorant about dog attacks and the strength of dogs. This is not name calling or a troll post, but a simple fact. My dog can most certainly kill you in under sixty seconds. A single bite from several breeds can snap your leg bone in two at the thickest part.

I see dog attacks more than you on a daily basis, dont go preaching. There is no such thing as a bad dog, only bad owners, you need to get that through your ears. Another thing, you've been watching to many movies.

Oh please.

Standing still and not showing fear - 20-30% chance I get hurt

Putting a .45 cal in between it's eyes - 0% chance I get hurt.

Your choice, mate.

Thats a good example of a gun yielding yobbo.

 

[computerpro3]

I see dog attacks more than you on a daily basis, dont go preaching. There is no such thing as a bad dog, only bad owners, you need to get that through your ears. Another thing, you've been watching to many movies.

www.hookedonphonics.com

Maybe they can help your reading comprehension.

I'm well aware that there are "no intrinsically bad dogs". But the simple fact of the matter is that the ARE bad owners. Is this such a difficult concept to understand?

If a dog, ruined by the owner, is charging you, it simply doesn't matter what the root cause is. You eliminate the immediate threat to you, and sort out the consequences later.

Can you explain how growing kahunas would have helped Mr. Robert Howard from my previous post? I'm interested to know.

 

[SureAddicted]

Can you explain how growing kahunas would have helped Mr. Robert Howard from my previous post? I'm interested to know.

I cant help when people dont use their own heads. Going outside with a shovel to break up a dog fight is more than stupidity. As for Mr Howard, same thing, at least grab a baton, who did he think he was....superman?
COMMON SENSE.
I've been attacked 4 times, I'm not dead, nor did I use a firearm.

 

[awid]

1. The root of the issue doesn't matter when the dog is charging you. The simple fact of the matter is that there are tons of bad owners, tons of bad dogs as a result of this, and plenty of deaths from dog attacks every single year. In 2008, there were 23 fatalities in the US alone, and hundreds were maimed.

Wow 23 people out of 300,000,000. You make it sound so common. I'd also be willing to bet of those 23 people, most if not all of them were either elderly or children. Hell if a 9 year old boy can take out a pitbull in hand to hand combat. Any reasonably fit/intelligent man or woman should be able to do the same.

http://www.bakersfieldnow.com/news/local/37069754.html?video=YHI&t=a

I think people that are attacked by dogs let it happen to some extent. I'd throw morality out the window, as you should.

That being said. I want a TK40.

 

[psychbeat]

I kinda wonder how many people were injured or killed in
gun accidents in 2008... >23 probs...
I want a TK40 too!!!
meanwhile Ill keep vigilant with my Q123mini...
maybe Ill mounts some punk spikes on it?

are dogs more sensitive to warmer or cooler bins?

lovecpflovecpflovecpf

 

[Egsise]

Using TK40 might draw lightnings to you, so I would suggest using something that has plastic body.

 

[LeifUK]

I kinda wonder how many people were injured or killed in
gun accidents in 2008... >23 probs...
I want a TK40 too!!!
meanwhile Ill keep vigilant with my Q123mini...
maybe Ill mounts some punk spikes on it?

are dogs more sensitive to warmer or cooler bins?

lovecpflovecpflovecpf

In 2003 about 30,000 Americans died from gun shot wounds, with about half being suicides. Death by gun shot is the second largest cause of death for young male adults. I believe a significant number of shootings occur during domestic arguments. I think deaths by dog bites is completely insignificant and very rare. But this is off topic. So back to dogs.

Following on from earlier posts, if it is so easy to defeat a dog, why do people use them as guard dogs? Why do the police use them to bring down suspects? There are large properties in the areas where I go running, and there are dogs that start growling when I run by. In one case there are two dogs who snarl, and drool, and appear to be doing their best to get past the fencing. Were those two to get loose, I would be in serious trouble. In many cases owners purposefully mistreat the animal in order to ensure that it remains aggressive.

Sadly a torch is useless during the day. And it would not work for two dogs. Fortunately the vast majority of dogs off leash are 'pussycats' and on getting close will expect to be patted and stroked. :huh:

In the UK most dog deaths appear to be children mauled by a 'pet' belonging to a banned bread whose owner see the dog as a weapon or a macho status symbol. Frankly using a torch as a defence against a dog will in the UK be rare, but using one as a defence against a human assailant at night is a real possibility.

I've been attacked several times on the street, but I have never been attacked by an aggressive dog, though I've had many bound up to me, leaving me wondering if the animal will be a threat, thanks to the thoughtlessness of the owners.

Would a torch be of any use during the day time? My tests suggest it would be of minimal use. And would it be of use against a gang?

 

[DM51]

The original discussion about whether or not a light is effective at stopping a dog or other animal was an appropriate topic for this forum.

Unfortunately, the discussion soon veered way off topic into a discussion about shooting dogs instead. That is most emphatically NOT an appropriate dicussion for this forum, and I am frankly astonished that anyone here would think it was. We have the Underground for such discussions, and anyone who wishes to take it there may do so.

The thread is so far gone that I have closed it.