Where to buy automotive reflectors?

[86cherokee]

First off I love this site and lights of all types. Now for my question: I recently bought a jeep that has a ton of low quality offroad lights, and I was wanting to buy new reflectors (and bulbs) and keep the same housing and lenses. I have no idea as to where to look (for the reflectors). Can you all please point me in the right direction to where to buy some? They are just plain ol round 5.5" reflectors. Any help would be great. Thanks guys

 

[DM51]

Welcome to CPF, 86cherokee.

We have a dedicated Automotive sub-forum here, so I'm moving this thread there for you.

 

[chmsam]

First off I love this site and lights of all types. Now for my question: I recently bought a jeep that has a ton of low quality offroad lights, and I was wanting to buy new reflectors (and bulbs) and keep the same housing and lenses. I have no idea as to where to look (for the reflectors). Can you all please point me in the right direction to where to buy some? They are just plain ol round 5.5" reflectors. Any help would be great. Thanks guys

By "reflector" I assume you mean the light assembly (housing). The inner reflective surface is probably not available as a separate part -- most assemblies are the entire light bucket and mounting. If the lights are junk, replacing a part isn't going to cut it. If you cannot find replacement assemblies through the manufacturer (either of the vehicle for the built ins, or the one for the driving/fog/off road lights), you'll probably have to replace the lights. A Google search should turn up OEM assemblies and a check of manufacturers' web sites should turn up the other ones. Again, that's if they are available.

Check out Hella, PIAA, etc. to see what's available. There are conversion kits to go from sealed beams to something like an H4 bulb. Getting an HID (or worse an "HID" -- wanna be) conversion has been the topic of a long and fiery thread here -- most people hate the glare and blinding quality of those, and most of the people who put them in their vehicles tend to be clueless as to how to do it correctly and how to aim them. HID's are far less forgiving as to their being properly installed and aimed.

Better to get fewer assemblies that are of high quality than just plaster the thing with a lot of cheapo's. You'll see the benefits and the other drivers won't be as likely to throw things at your vehicle.

One place I might recommend is rallylights.com (they cater to the performance rally car crowd). Check under both "lighting" and "light bulbs" (and there is a lot to look through). They also carry wiring harnesses and switches rated for the extra power that lights need. Believe it or not you can gain a lot of light just by making sure the alternator and wiring can handle it and is of good quality.

 

[tay]

suvlights.com has a good selection too.

 

[-Virgil-]

You probably will not find any reflector/lens parts to fit in your existing fog light housings. Fog lights like this are generally not made to any kind of a universal construction standard, so each different make and model of fog light has its own components that don't accept parts from other makes or models of fog light. In short, if you want better fog lights you are probably looking at getting whole new fog lights.

Where to shop depends on what you're looking to spend and what kind of quality level you're shopping for. There are hundreds of internet and brick/mortar shops (such as SUVlights) where you can buy mostly low-quality cheap lights made in developing countries. China, India, etc. Most of this stuff isn't worth buying if you're looking for good lights that will work well and reliably for a long enough time to make the purchase and installation worthwhile. Better to stick to major brands. I favor the European-made lights (Bosch, Cibie, Hella) over the Japanese ones (IPF, PIAA) for performance and cost-effectiveness. Rallylights.com (already mentioned) is a dependable vendor supplying mostly Hella, also check with Dan Stern supplying mostly Cibie and some Bosch.

The advice to put in better headlights is good. Shop carefully, there are a lot of options on the market, but only relatively few of them are worthwhile. The warning above about "HID kits" is valid. HID bulbs in halogen-bulb headlamps do not work safely or effectively, which is why they are illegal. See here.

 

[Diesel_Bomber]

The OP mentions "offroad" lights. Now, provided "offroad lights" means these lights are actually for OFF road use only, and not just a catch-all for "fog lights" or "driving lights" or etc...........what would the problem be with a cheap halogen to HID retrofit kit? Lots of light and no one around the blind. The beam pattern would be crap, but who cares, no one around to blind.

Note: I mean "not for onroad use" as in physically not going to be used on a roadway. I don't mean in the lawyer/courtroom sense where I have said not for use on a road, thereby clearing me of any liability should the OP decide to use them on a road, knowing full well that the OP will be using these on the road. Do not use HID retrofitted halogen lamps on the street.

:buddies:

 

[LukeA]

Do not use HID retrofitted halogen lamps on the street.

A big ole +1 to that

 

[chmsam]

The OP mentions "offroad" lights. Now, provided "offroad lights" means these lights are actually for OFF road use only, and not just a catch-all for "fog lights" or "driving lights" or etc...........what would the problem be with a cheap halogen to HID retrofit kit? Lots of light and no one around the blind. The beam pattern would be crap, but who cares, no one around to blind.

Note: I mean "not for offroad use" as in physically not going to be used on a roadway. I don't mean in the lawyer/courtroom sense where I have said not for use on a road, thereby clearing me of any liability should the OP decide to use them on a road, knowing full well that the OP will be using these on the road. Do not use HID retrofitted halogen lamps on the street.

:buddies:

If used as headlights it would mean trailering the Jeep to and from each run. How many people are going to do that? Not to mention that most "HID" conversions that I have seen are crap, especially when compared to an actual HID assembly installation instead of a conversion kit.

 

[tay]

Get a good 5.5" sealed beam replacement headlights with some decent Philips Xtremepower H4s as your main beam. Those will improve output while still being safe and street-legal.

For offroad only lights, there are a few concerns:

Aftermarket HID bulbs run hotter and emit a lot of UV light, so they can damage the chrome on some housings over time. If they're not rebased well, the filament will be placed incorrectly, and you'll lose a lot of output.

I'd be hesitant to use cheap rebased bulbs in an expensive Hella or KC offroad light. I'd feel safer with a good quality HIR or +80 halogen bulb from a name brand. But if you want to get a cheap $30-50 set of ebay H3 driving lamps, and put a HID kit in them, it might turn out pretty decent, and if the kit bulbs burn the chrome or something, it's not like you're ruining your nice $300 pair of lights.

 

[Diesel_Bomber]

If used as headlights it would mean trailering the Jeep to and from each run. How many people are going to do that? Not to mention that most "HID" conversions that I have seen are crap, especially when compared to an actual HID assembly installation instead of a conversion kit.

The stock headlights would remain untouched and in place. The HID kit(s) would go in the OFFROAD ONLY lights.

:buddies:

 

[Diesel_Bomber]

Get a good 5.5" sealed beam replacement headlights with some decent Philips Xtremepower H4s as your main beam. Those will improve output while still being safe and street-legal.

For offroad only lights, there are a few concerns:

Aftermarket HID bulbs run hotter and emit a lot of UV light, so they can damage the chrome on some housings over time. If they're not rebased well, the filament will be placed incorrectly, and you'll lose a lot of output.

I'd be hesitant to use cheap rebased bulbs in an expensive Hella or KC offroad light. I'd feel safer with a good quality HIR or +80 halogen bulb from a name brand. But if you want to get a cheap $30-50 set of ebay H3 driving lamps, and put a HID kit in them, it might turn out pretty decent, and if the kit bulbs burn the chrome or something, it's not like you're ruining your nice $300 pair of lights.

I concur with the recommendation to upgrade the stock headlights responsibly, but the rest of your post has me scratching my head. UV doesn't affect chrome. It might affect chrome colored plastic. HID capsules rebased for halogen headlights won't have the right filament orientation anyway, so who cares? If the OP had decent Hella or other lights then this thread probably wouldn't have come up anyway.

:buddies:

 

[chmsam]

The stock headlights would remain untouched and in place. The HID kit(s) would go in the OFFROAD ONLY lights.

:buddies:

Hopefully most people would do it that way but I've met more than a few who wouldn't and not even begin to understand why it would be a bad idea. I spend way too much time talking people out of doing really stupid things with their cars. One kid wanted to run aircraft landing lights as their only lights. I've seen more than one person try to run a race car on the street and not understand the problems (one forgot that the lower ground clearance of a race car is bad mojo in pothole country). I've even seen people spend money on an aero package for a car that had the gas tank literally dragging on the ground.

Let's just say that the OP is not the only one who might be reading the posts here.

 

[tay]

I concur with the recommendation to upgrade the stock headlights responsibly, but the rest of your post has me scratching my head. UV doesn't affect chrome. It might affect chrome colored plastic. HID capsules rebased for halogen headlights won't have the right filament orientation anyway, so who cares? If the OP had decent Hella or other lights then this thread probably wouldn't have come up anyway.

:buddies:

The issue with the chrome is the excess heat from a poorly-built bulb can burn it or make it bubble, especially if the housing is very small.

Don't be so quick to rule out rebased bulbs as being incorrectly made. I'm sure there are many that are, but there are also ones that aren't. HID kits in halogen headlights is hit or miss, and you guys are neglecting the hit part. There are some rebased bulbs out there that are correctly fitted. There are some halogen projectors that can handle HIDs. These are the exceptions, not the rule, but they do exist.

 

[-Virgil-]

HID kits in halogen headlights is hit or miss, and you guys are neglecting the hit part.

Because it doesn't exist except in the minds of True Believers who find the facts an inconvenient nuisance. Fact is, no HID kit works safely or effectively in any halogen headlamp (reflector or projector) -- ever. "Nobody ever flashes their high beam lights at me" doesn't change that. "I think the beam looks pretty good" doesn't change that. "I think it's probably OK in some cases" doesn't change that. "Everyone on MakeModelYear Forums does it and thinks it works great" doesn't change that. No amount of guessing, assuming, advertising, or wishful thinking changes that.

But there are still plenty of people who really, really, really want to believe that their illegal & dangerous headlights are OK, and will come up with (and believe) any justification to rationalize that belief, no matter how baseless or fact-free. I have scrutinized many hundreds (possibly thousands) of modified headlamps, most of them halogens with HID kits. Most of them are so obviously noncompliant just to the naked (trained) eye that it's not worth bothering to test them formally. Some of them aren't obviously noncompliant, and some of those even look pretty good...but fail formal photometric testing. The optics are different for a reason: they have to be, to distribute the light correctly from the HID light source. I have yet to see an HID kit installation that passes formal photometric testing. Improper light distribution, even if the cutoff is still present. Perhaps someday somebody will show me an HID kit installation that produces acceptable photometrics…I'll keep looking. ;-)

 

[tay]

Dude, if I had a nickel for every time I saw that post verbatim...

I'm talking about OFFROAD lights. That means there's no other cars around, and your lighting does not need to meet DOT standards. I'm saying that if you have a decently rebased bulb in a big offroad reflector, it will be brighter than it was with the halogen bulb. Even with halogens, those reflectors would blind any other drivers, that's why the OP is only going to use them off road.

 

[Diesel_Bomber]

Hopefully most people would do it that way but I've met more than a few who wouldn't and not even begin to understand why it would be a bad idea. I spend way too much time talking people out of doing really stupid things with their cars. One kid wanted to run aircraft landing lights as their only lights. I've seen more than one person try to run a race car on the street and not understand the problems (one forgot that the lower ground clearance of a race car is bad mojo in pothole country). I've even seen people spend money on an aero package for a car that had the gas tank literally dragging on the ground.

Let's just say that the OP is not the only one who might be reading the posts here.

Oh yes, I agree, idiots abound, and there's a point at which ignorance is vast enough to become active stupidity. I've made money fixing these types of problems for people, after they've spent good money creating the problems. An hour's Googling would have saved them a couple thousand dollars.

That said, I thought I covered my point pretty well by stipulating OFF ROAD ONLY several times, and specifying exactly what I meant when I said off road.

Tay -

You're definitely talking about chrome colored plastic. Real chrome, applied over metal, will not be hurt by the heat or UV light produced by an incan or HID bulb.

:buddies:

 

[-Virgil-]

Dude, if I had a nickel for every time I saw that post verbatim...

Eventually the message will sink into all but the hardest heads.

 

[270winchester]

I think you are missing the point he was trying to convey.

...works safely or effectively in any halogen headlamp

To effectively use the output from an HID source, in an otherwise stock halogen reflector, it will require some serious luck to have a halogen reflector to work with an HID bulb. The emitting pattern of HID bulbs and halogen bulbs are way too different.

In order for a light to be effective, the light must be collected correctly AND projected to where the light is need. Even for off roading, you want the beam to go where you are going, not where you can look at and say "oh my, look at how well I'm lighting up 10 ft in front of me.

I'm no expert, but from what I have seen in HID bulbs stuck in halogen housing(reflector, projector, etc) the beam is almost always eff'ed. There is way too much artifact, way too much scatter, and not enough light down the road to be useful. Kinda defeats the whole purpose of buying expensive ballasts and bulbs, don't you think?

You can get two sets(4) of Hella 500s and have them put out around 5-6k lumens for about 150 bones and still use less power than a high end stereo system. Or you can buy HID ballasts and bulbs for that much, and get about that much light but scattered all over the place. I know which one I want. For light off highway (and legal on road with no car within 500ft) driving I got a set of 550s for about 60 bucks and they are fantastic. Of course in most states you can only have 4 lights on at once so this was taken on private property.

Dude, if I had a nickel for every time I saw that post verbatim...

I'm talking about OFFROAD lights. That means there's no other cars around, and your lighting does not need to meet DOT standards. I'm saying that if you have a decently rebased bulb in a big offroad reflector, it will be brighter than it was with the halogen bulb. Even with halogens, those reflectors would blind any other drivers, that's why the OP is only going to use them off road.

 

[Benson]

I think you are missing the point he was trying to convey.

To effectively use the output from an HID source, in an otherwise stock halogen reflector, it will require some serious luck to have a halogen reflector to work with an HID bulb. The emitting pattern of HID bulbs and halogen bulbs are way too different.

I don't think so, at least for an axial-filament halogen.

Check the test #2 at that Daniel Stern link, comparing a 9006 (axial filament) with an HID drop-in. It failed on color (not an issue for off-road), and by being too bright at 5 measurement points, but it was no dimmer than the 9006 at any measurement point, and a cursory comparison of the contour plots makes the beam pattern look quite similar, just brighter. No luck needed, a similarly-shaped light element in the same place, that's much brighter all over, had better give a similar beam -- if it doesn't, a botched rebasing job is to blame. (I don't know how prevalent those are, as I have never played the HID retrofit game.)

Even test #1, comparing a cross-filament 9004 to an HID drop-in, showed the HID's intensity being lower at only one of the prescribed measurement points, and while the contour plots were rather different, the hot spot was still central, and still brighter than the halogen. I'd grant that some luck is needed to get a good beam with HIDs in a reflector designed for a cross-filament bulb, but this particular case shows good enough performance that if I were (bizarrely) forced to choose between a 9004 with the high filament burnt out and the tested HID burner, in the tested reflector, for off-road use only, I'd go with the HID, and re-aim to the left and possibly down, as needed.

In neither of these cases was the HID kit suited as a low beam, but the 9006 replacement was not scattering light to the sides instead of forward, as suggested, and even the 9004 kit, with its obviously malformed beam, would still give better distance illumination than the halogen. It really annoys me when people want to make a (perfectly valid) point so bad, they resort to hyperbole, such as Daniel Stern's claim "the beam patterns produced by this kind of "conversion" virtually always give less distance light", when the data clearly contradict them. At best, from the very data linked earlier on the page, it could be suggested that some of them throw enough foreground light to override the distance light improvement with pupil contraction.

In order for a light to be effective, the light must be collected correctly AND projected to where the light is need. Even for off roading, you want the beam to go where you are going, not where you can look at and say "oh my, look at how well I'm lighting up 10 ft in front of me.

Totally agreed, but contrary to some propaganda, an HID retrofit is not a guaranteed ticket to an over-spilled, under-spotted beam. That's one of the possible outcomes, but there are also much better outcomes possible, depending on several factors, especially the filament orientation and position of the original bulb.

Buying purpose-made HID off-road lights is certainly the sure way to get a good off-road beam, but I think trying an HID kit to save a few bucks can be a reasonable choice, if you do your research first.