Questions re: SF E1L current version and new Fenix P2D CE

I have both of these. The Fenix on Turbo mode is brighter than the SF E1L. But on High mode the Fenix P2D CE looks to be about the same brightness as the SF E1L (using the current KL1 head).

I'm curious if SF underestimates their lumen ratings as I've heard. Supposedly the SF E1L using the KL1 head only rates 25 lumens according to SF's specs. But uses a spcially designed optic to boost throw.

The new Fenix P2D on high mode is rated at 80 lumens.

Both lights seem to compare the same when the P2D is set to high.

Is this to be expected from the P2D and SF E1L?

Are both on primaries or R123a when you tested them?

so the version rated at 25lumens is the one with the kl1 head?, i loved this torch , but i didnt buy it because i thought "25 lumens, mmmm not enough", I also looked at the l4 and L1, i can't decide, they are damn sexy i give them that..

Is the E1L a good thrower ? i assume it's bright if it looks to be the same as the p2dce on "high".

Cheers.

The KL1 is almost all throw.

As far as comparisons, it's hard to compare a light with flood to a light without flood. I have an L1, and I've tried to compare it to other lights, but it's really tough. If you look at the Fenix and realize how much light is outside of the hotspot, the higher lumen count starts to make sense.

With that being said though, your KL1 is probably putting out more than 25 lumens ... just not 80.

With a lot of these Cree lights, a majority of the light exits as spill, rather than as throw. If you look at the beams in my Avatar (logo next to my name), the one ridiculously bright beam that looks like it's brighter than the others is actually emitting LESS lumens than any of the others. I'm using an optic to collimate all the light into a single beam, like a surefire would. For the others, the majority of the light exits as spill, whcih for working up close is great, but not so great for throw. That should give you a sense of the difference.

My Replies:

jumpstat:
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This is using SF primaries CR123's

ensile:
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The E1L with KL1 head is supposedly rated at 25 lumens by SF, but I've heard SF is conservative with their ratings. Also, the optic makes a big difference. The E1L uses an optic, whereas the Fenix P2D doesn't.

I'd rate the throw of the SF E1L with KL1 head the same as the Fenix P2D on High. Of course, the P2D on Turbo is noticeably brighter. As expected.

If you're considering the E1L, wait another month or so and get the new CREE E1L using the KX1 head. I'm gonna buy the KX1 head when it's released.

ja10:
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Yep, true about the sidespill on the P2D compared to the E1L with KL1 head. I just wonder what the "real" lumens rating of the E1L using the KL1 head is.

2xTrinity:
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I'd love to see the P2D with an optical head using the CREE, that'd have throw like nothing on the market now.

Idea:
instead of guessing around, just measure current at the output levels You plan to compare.

if these are the same --> the Fenix should be brighter, thanks to the more efficient emitter
is Fenix current higher but seeming dimmer --> SF more efficient than 100 %

an homegrown method of a very rogh brightness comparison would be a ceiling bounce test.
Put light upright and have it shine on ceiling, try to compare how well the room is lit.
Might make medium flood and thrower comparable (without equipment)

hmm, the 2007 SF e1L says it's up to 30 lumens, I take it SF quote "real" lumens ?

will it be of similiar price to the current model ? It says it has a run-time of 17 hours, but SF dont separate those claims into low/high , so somewhere in there is part high, and then some.

Does the E1L regulate, does it even have a high/low ? if not is the L1 the model to shoot for ?

cheers guys.. the new 2007 catalogue is not much help.

ensile said:

Does the E1L regulate, does it even have a high/low ? if not is the L1 the model to shoot for ?

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Yes, the current E1L is regulated. No, it doesn't have multiple levels. If you want multiple levels in an LED light from SureFire, you need to look at the L1, L2, U2 or Kroma. Or the Titan, if you're well-heeled.

its' not a must. 17 hour runtime on 30 lumens and tonnes of throw sounds like my main edc.... if the inova t1 tiros dissapoints i'll get that e1l... and hopefully I fall in love with it, i have a sneaky suspicion i'll love the t1.

even if its power dissapoints me..

GeorgePaul said:

Yes, the current E1L is regulated. No, it doesn't have multiple levels. If you want multiple levels in an LED light from SureFire, you need to look at the L1, L2, U2 or Kroma.

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Or you need to find one of Don's two stage tailcaps for the Surefire E-series. I've got two of them, and they turn the E1L into a very nice two stage light.

Hans

ensile said:

its' not a must. 17 hour runtime on 30 lumens and tonnes of throw sounds like my main edc....

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I also like "tons of throw" a lot. However, the beam of the Surefire KL1 head is *very* narrow, so narrow, that it's not really easy to use the E1L to, for instance, navigate a mountain trail. Unless of course you put a beamshaper on it. The FX04 works very well indeed.

But the beamshape of the E1L is pretty extreme, and I wouldn't really want to use the E1L as my main EDC. It doesn't really work all that well for me in many real life applications. I personally see the E1L as a rather specialized light, a very nice one, but not as a typical EDC light. I often use it in combination with my HDS when I want a light that is small and has some serious throw in addition to my U42.

Hans

Hans said:

...the beamshape of the E1L is pretty extreme, and I wouldn't really want to use the E1L as my main EDC.... I personally see the E1L as a rather specialized light, a very nice one, but not as a typical EDC light. I often use it in combination with my HDS when I want a light that is small and has some serious throw in addition to my U42.Hans

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Hans, I would agree with you there; I have an E1L w/ beamshaper and an HDS U60 XRGT. I usually carry both with me as the HDS gives multiple output levels but I love the form factor of the E1L as well as the incredible throw on it.

Two questions about the 2-stage switch: Did you have a DIY kit or did you get it assembled? Also, how do you find the lower level? I'm interested in picking one up as well as I like the option of at least two light levels... :thumbsup:

RGB_LED said:

Two questions about the 2-stage switch: Did you have a DIY kit or did you get it assembled? Also, how do you find the lower level? I'm interested in picking one up as well as I like the option of at least two light levels... :thumbsup:

Click to expand...

I got a couple of complete tailcaps some time ago when they were still available from Lighthound and the Shoppe, including one that allows the light to tailstand. I've got the 22 ohm resistor in mine, low is really quite low on the E1L. But that's just what I wanted. You can vary the light output by using different resistors.

All in all I think these tailcaps turn the E1L into a totally different light. Much more versatile than the E1L with the standard Z57 tailcap. I'm sometimes wondering why Surefire doesn't offer this option, I'm quite sure it would increase their sales quite a bit.

Hans

so these Are good throwers, man i woulda bought one ages ago. in the case of the beam not being usable Then the tiros t1 can be my edc, unless i magic tape the middle to defuse beam the SF will be for diff applications. man i love e1l