12V / 4 Battery flashlight shootout?

I would love to see a shootout/comparison of a Surefire M4 with the high output 350 lumen bulb, a Pila GL4 550 lumen flashlight, and a Wolf Eyes M90X with the Lumens Factory 550 lumen bulb.

Honestly, why do people use ultra high-current, high-output lamps? 20 minutes runtime on an M4 is not practical in most situations. The heat alone will make your hand sweat and now the flashlight is uncomfortable and slippery in your hand. What do you tell the bad guy when your batteries run down, "No, don't run/attack me, I have to change my batteries!" I'm sure there are valid reasons for using these high-output lamps, otherwise SureFire and the likes wouldn't make them, but unless if your SWAT or something, I just can't see it.

Yeah, 20 minutes is rather lame, but they have their uses. Although neither of these flashlights are particularly pocketable. I would personally go that bit bigger and have a ROP 2D. That would give similar output, but a whole HOUR of it.

Anyway, back to the point, yes, it would be very interesting to see beam shots. When Surefire quote a "350" lumen bulb, that usually means the minimum expected out of the front of the window. Whereas the other manufacturers tend to quote naked bulb lumens. I would expect, in terms of brightness, this to be a close call. If anyone does this, please do a ceiling bounce test, so we can get a better idea of total output.

Thanks

wrathothebunny said:

Honestly, why do people use ultra high-current, high-output lamps? 20 minutes runtime on an M4 is not practical in most situations. The heat alone will make your hand sweat and now the flashlight is uncomfortable and slippery in your hand. What do you tell the bad guy when your batteries run down, "No, don't run/attack me, I have to change my batteries!" I'm sure there are valid reasons for using these high-output lamps, otherwise SureFire and the likes wouldn't make them, but unless if your SWAT or something, I just can't see it.

Click to expand...

Usually they're used in short bursts in situations where you want a maximum output of white light for several seconds. Most people who own these lights are either professionals or enthusiastic hobbiests and don't use them for tent lights..or reading a good book at night...lol It's just a lot of fun for CPFers to see how much light we can get out of a small package. Most of us will admit that we're all a bit crazy...hehe

Ugrey, I would like to see that shootout also. Sounds like it would be interesting. Unfortunately I can't help because I don't own any of them. Hopefully someone would be up to testing them for use. I'm really interested in the M90X myself.

Bunny, I am just a homeowner. So, I don't use my high lumen, short run lamps very often. They are my bump in the night lights. Rechargable batteries self discharge over time so primary batteries are the way to go for long term shelf sitting. Read the Surefire catalog closely. I am not planning on a 20 minute confrontation. It should be very short, and I want every lumen/ advantage I can get.

20 minutes can last me up to a month of daily uses before I recharge. Reach for the appropriate tool for a job. 20 minute sprinters are great for short bursts of usage, but don't grab it when the power goes out, lol.

"I am just a homeowner. So, I don't use my high lumen, short run lamps very often. They are my bump in the night lights."

I don't think that one can safely assume that any home confrontation will be short. Say you shine your light on an intruder, cover him with your handgun or shotgun, and tell him to freeze. So if the intruder doesn't freeze and you have no choice but to shoot him, fine. But what if the intruder does freeze? How are you going to hold that increasingly toasty flashlight on him, while leveling your gun on him, and having beloved wife dial 911? And say you've had that flashlight in your drawer for a few months, only activating it from time to time for 30 seconds or so, but that adds up and now you only have about 12-15 minutes left of runtime on your flashlight. Those cops had better get here quick! Of course, you could always turn on the houselights, but then you loose some advantage on your intruder, as he can now assess your threat posture and develop a plan of action. In any case, as far as getting every lumen you can get, I use a 9P + extender to run a 12V Lumens Factory D26 bulb on 4 CR123s with 60 minutes runtime and at least 210 torch lumens.

Wrathothebunny, just out of interest, why did you choose the 12V version instead of the HO9 and rechargeables? No criticism, just wondering.

It really just comes down to what I'm willing to accept in terms of reliability and risk for home defense. When running on rechargeables, you do introduce the risk of hot flashing the lamp assembly. While this risk can be minimized, it is always dramatically higher than would otherwise be running on CR123s. One virtually guaranteed detractor of running on rechargeables is that rechargeable batteries slowly drain while just sitting in your drawer. So I could easily neglect to periodically recharge these batteries and when an intruder decides to visit, uh oh, no juice in the SureFire. It's really risk management. The flashlight I use around the house, for non-essential purposes is my Fenix P3D CE, which has plenty of light for anything non tactical in nature.

honey is dialing 911.. does she turn on any lights in the house?

and another issue...

1 is none, 2 is 1, we all know that here. I don't think very many officers or CPFers would go into any tactical situation with only 1 light. You are making all your assumptions based on having only 1 light.. your configuration is great until the lamp blows or the switch breaks. there is always a minor risk of this happening. so a second light is the best solution to the problems you are hypothetically talking about.

I can see your point of view, Wrath. The li ion battery has a low rate of self discharge but I can see the logic for a rarely used flashlight.

"You are making all your assumptions based on having only 1 light"

Well, maybe I'm just taking into account my own idiosyncracies. If I hear "bump" in the night, I'll likely grab my SureFire in my left hand and a ready weapon in the right (currently a crowbar until I get my 45 ACP). *Hey, I thought a crowbar was an excellent choice over baseball bat or knife, you get hit once with that heavy bludgeon and you are not getting up* Having no third hand and likely being in my skivies, I doubt I would more times than not have a 2nd flashlight on my person. As far as the flashlight switch failing, I have a twisty that isn't mechanical, you just twist for constant on or press the tailcap for momentary on - Nothing to break there. The CR123s last for 10+ years sitting on the shelf, and the LumensFactory bulb is very well made - though I could see it flashing, I consider it highly unlikely - especially when running on CR123s.

Back to the OP's question:

ugrey said:

I would love to see a shootout/comparison of a Surefire M4 with the high output 350 lumen bulb, a Pila GL4 550 lumen flashlight, and a Wolf Eyes M90X with the Lumens Factory 550 lumen bulb.

Click to expand...

Did Paul_in_Maryland do a comparison something like this? I can't remember, but it would be interesting to revisit it. It would essentially be a comparison of the LAs/bulbs and their beam characteristics and outputs, not really of the host bodies.

No. I've compared only flashlights that use the same cells, the same voltage, or nearly so. I've never compared anything with primary cells; I don't use them.

My closest beamshots would be a comparision of all 12V and 13V D36 lamps by Wolf Eyes and Lumens Factory. Sorry, I don't have the link.

goodmornin Paul!
found em...
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/151611
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/138036