For the Fenix lovers (Fenix and SWAT teams)

http://www.policeone.com/Grants/1356391/

Basically a grant for SWAT teams involving Fenix lights. The public is not eligible, I just think people would find the existence of this grant to be neat.

Just 2 flashlights per team, but still interesting and personally I don't like Fenix's for police work I think it would be interesting to see what SWAT teams think of them. Our guys are in love with either the Gladius or a Surefire and are unwilling to open their minds

The swat guys I know are all about the entry. These lights wouldn't realy fit the bill for me on that:shrug:

LAPD SWAT issues 2 identical Surefires to their officers - one to mount on their guns, the 2nd for when the gun is not needed.

Fenix would have a hard time breaking into the market. While the torches are bright enough, they do not meet the other requirements.

Gun mount not available, for M1913 of other rails.

Light can not be easily operated when mounted on a pistol. No side switches like the Surefire X200. No remote pressure switches either.

Fenix has not proven their lights will continue working after the gun (pistol, rifle, shotgun, M16) has been fired. (That is how Surefire got started, the LAPD SWAT requirement for a light that can survive the recoil of a shotgun)

Length requirements for pistol mount mean CR123A based lights. For compatability the general use light should be the same but have a momentary capable tactical switch. None of the stock Fenix CR123A lights have that. The current UI is too awkward to be operated under stress.

And finally,
Not MADE in the USA.

It sounds kinda bogus, like someone had too much time on their hands.

The Chinese are very opportunistic. They do try to get into any business opportunities. Fenix is no exception. But I think they will have to improve their lights a bit before they get proper Police contracts. The whole point is about the level of construction. In terms of material, Fenix is OK. They use the same grade aluminium, same LEDs. But all one has to do is to turn the cap on and off and one will find that the threads in SF bodies are a lot tighter and smoother.

I own both SF and Fenix and I am not a basher of any. I think once the material (aluminium, LEDs, circuits, heatsink etc.) is OK, the rest (modes, location of switches, gun mounting mechanism etc.) would be cosmetic and can be sorted out easily. Once all these have been taken care of then Fenix can start to compete. I don't think made in China is a problem. If one were to take away everything made in China in the USA, I think the Americans could barely survive! At the end there has to be a balance between costs and quality.

I think Fenix lights are very reasonably priced. SFs are far too expensive, even taking into account their quality. The days of Fenix competing in the Police markets are getting close. If SF do something drastic, they may well lose out eventually.

NA8 said:

It sounds kinda bogus, like someone had too much time on their hands.

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Eh, no. The grant is there. You can get little grants for anything. Saw this while browsing them.

I agree with everything LEDNinja says and I will add; another issue is lack of Law Enforcement accessories available for the Fenix lights. No leather or even nylon holsters that will fit a 2 1/4 belt, no gun mounts and no color lenses.

Maybe this will get Fenix to change some of their production pieces to get into this market and we will get the fruits of that.

I think SWAT personnel (and patrol personnel in some cases) typically use long guns with lights mounted to them. Having a handheld utility light makes sense but Fenix would not be my first choice--or second or third.

pfccypret said:

Eh, no. The grant is there. You can get little grants for anything. Saw this while browsing them.

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Sorry, I meant the grant seemed kinda cheesey, not that your post was inaccurate.

Seems like if you figured out the salaries and time involved, you could just buy two fenix lights cheaper (to the taxpayers) at fenixstore.com. Well maybe not, the official paperwork might be just as bad

It's confusing, but this this grant is actually available from the NTOA which is a private company. Aside from LEOs being members, companies who sell Law Enforcement products can be members. It is basically a way for companies to get their brand into the hands of cops. Through advertisements in publications, demos at events, or in this case a grant.

Basically Fenix is paying the NTOA to give away 20 lights. With the hope that the SWAT members will pass them around and get some customers in the Law Enforcement business.

As stated before, I like Fenix, but don't care much for them in Police work. But I like would like to see Fenix take a stab at a simple Law Enforcement dedicated light.

"Fenix Flashlight Grant provided by NTOA."

Oh you've got to be freaking kidding me.... I love how that part is actually mentioned in bold lettering, after you click on the link.

Yeah.... so who's the greedy idiot over at NTOA who came up with this idea?

Cause apparently someone thinks that Fenix quality = Same as what you get with a Surefire model, a Gladius, or an Inova.

Guess they never saw the thread about the CPFer (ltiu) who went caving, then decided to show off his L2D-CE to others. And the light went out! Nope, batteries were fine. Turns out the contact points were dirty, and that's all that was needed for the light to stop working!

Fenix lights are far from junk. They make excellent general purpose / EDC lights.... for those who don't rely on their lights as possible life-saving equipment! I have yet to see a Fenix light with the level of durability or rugged reliability that is needed by those who go into harms way.

Phaetos said:

Maybe this will get Fenix to change some of their production pieces to get into this market and we will get the fruits of that.

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The tatical switch that comes with the latest L1T/L2T could be the 1st of the changes. Wrong light though. A 'P3T' would make more sense for this market.

I think Fenix jumped the gun in organizing the grants before they have a light ready.

Wonder if the T in the upcoming Fenix T series stands for Turbohead or Tactical.

LEDninja said:

The tatical switch that comes with the latest L1T/L2T could be the 1st of the changes. Wrong light though. A 'P3T' would make more sense for this market.

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I agree.

I think Fenix quality is fine. No one can say that no Surefire has EVER failed at ANY time. They have and they do. There's plenty of threads/posts regarding Surefire failures of some kind, just as there are threads/posts about Fenix failures.

The problem I see is that most Fenix lights are too complicated for use under stress. I work with pyrotechnics, and at times things are rushed. Being in close proximity to high explosives obviously requires precision in everything that is done, and there can be a pretty good level of stress involved, especially when you're in a hurry. I use my P3D which is great... except for the time I accidently went into strobe while iluminating a connection while my boss was quickly seting a charge. :shakehead

A P3T (meaning a light just like the L1T - only 2 modes changed by twisting the bezel, forward/momentary clicky switch) would be a perfect police light. The P3D... not so much.

Monocrom said:

Guess they never saw the thread about the CPFer (ltiu) who went caving, then decided to show off his L2D-CE to others. And the light went out! Nope, batteries were fine. Turns out the contact points were dirty, and that's all that was needed for the light to stop working!

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I think you will find that most lights stop working or are a lot dimmer if you let their contact points get really dirty..

But at the moment Fenix are far from being my first choice of light if my life depended on it. They are very good for the price though:thumbsup:
They aren't that far from making what I'd consider an almost perfect utility light; a LxT v2.0 with slightly better quality and preferably a better HA than the current black one.

Sverre

I think this is silly at the moment based upon current Fenix models. Way too difficult to get from mode to mode in a "tactical" situation. Second, the Fenix reverse clickies (and most others too) change modes if you breathe too hard on them. Third, while Fenix has decent HAIII, the body is just too thin to be robust enough for hard use.

LEDninja said:

LAPD SWAT issues 2 identical Surefires to their officers - one to mount on their guns, the 2nd for when the gun is not needed.

Fenix would have a hard time breaking into the market. While the torches are bright enough, they do not meet the other requirements.

Gun mount not available, for M1913 of other rails.

Light can not be easily operated when mounted on a pistol. No side switches like the Surefire X200. No remote pressure switches either.

Fenix has not proven their lights will continue working after the gun (pistol, rifle, shotgun, M16) has been fired. (That is how Surefire got started, the LAPD SWAT requirement for a light that can survive the recoil of a shotgun)

Length requirements for pistol mount mean CR123A based lights. For compatability the general use light should be the same but have a momentary capable tactical switch. None of the stock Fenix CR123A lights have that. The current UI is too awkward to be operated under stress.

And finally,
Not MADE in the USA.

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+1

great post! You nailed it on the head.

NoFair said:

I think you will find that most lights stop working or are a lot dimmer if you let their contact points get really dirty.

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Huge diffrence between really dirty, and a bit of dirt.