MTE P7-D Review & Comparison with Fenix L2D & Romisen RC-H3 - UPDATED 20/3/2009 -
MTE P7-D A Basic Review
After browsing CPF for some time now, I have decided it's time to help others by adding a review of my own. I would not class myself as a flashaholic but as I have night blindness, torches are very important to me.
This review is for people, who are interested in the P7-D and need some basic info to help decide if it is going to be their next torch. There is some technical information as well for people interested in modding.
I have read some reviews about other MTE P7 torches but could not find anything specific to the P7-D. I am comparing it to my little Romisen and the Fenix L2D, which many CPFers have seen and used (the L2D is the standard that I will probably judge all other torches by). The Romisen is totally outclassed but is used as a control in the beamshots.
Basic specs.
Romisen RC-H3
Modes ----------------------------------- Single
Switching -------------------------------- Forward Clicky
Lumens --------------------------------- About 15 and not 225 - as stated by the Ebay seller (rather optimistic to say the least)
Battery ---------------------------------- 1 x AA
LED ------------------------------------ Cree P4
Length ---------------------------------- 95mm
Diam. ----------------------------------- 20mm
Price ----------------------------------- (DX) $13.50 (US)
[link removed - DM51]
Comments ----------------------------- My work EDC but now taken over by my girlfriend as her handbag Torch!
Fenix L2d Premium 100
Modes -------------------------------- 5 - Low, Mid, High, Turbo, Strobe and SOS
Switching ------------------------------ Reverse Clicky and Head turning
Lumens ------------------------------- 11, 50, 100 and 175
Battery -------------------------------- 2 x AA
LED ---------------------------------- Luxeon Rebel 100
Length -------------------------------- 147mm
Diam. --------------------------------- 21mm
Price ---------------------------------- Discontinued (replaced by Cree Q5 version (DX) $66 (US))
[link removed - DM51]
Comments ---------------------------- An almost perfect EDC torch for me.
MTE P7-D
Modes ------------------------------- 5 (with last used memory) High, Mid, Low. Strobe and SOS - Check update below*
Switching ---------------------------- Reverse Clicky
Lumens ------------------------------ 600, 150. 10 (Approximations using the L2D as a Reference)
Battery ------------------------------ 1 x 18650
LED --------------------------------- SSC P7
Length ------------------------------- 146mm
Diam. ------------------------------- 40mm Head, 29mm Body
Price -------------------------------- (DX) $48 (US)
[link removed - DM51]
Comments -------------------------- A poor mans HID
MTE Power Characteristics
Here are my readings which should give ball park figures. 0.4 Ohms total meter leads resistance.
Setting & Unloaded Battery Voltage ------------- High ------- Med ------- Low ----- Battery Volts
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 0.3A ------ 0.11A ----- 0.01A --------- 3.15v
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 1.45A ----- 0.18A ----- 0.02A --------- 3.73v
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 1.55A ----- 0.19A ----- 0.03A --------- 3.8v
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 2.25A ----- 0.26A ----- 0.03A --------- 4.15v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 2.8v ------- 2.42v ------ 2.2v ----------- 3.15v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 3.12v ----- 2.47v ------ 2.21v ---------- 3.73v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 3.14v ----- 2.49v ------ 2.24v ---------- 3.75v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 3.25v ----- 2.48v ------ 2.22v ---------- 4.15v
Here are some photos of my oscilloscope screen when hooked upto the P7 Emitter. They show how the PWM changes with different modes. The bottom of the scale is 0 volts and each vertical division is 0.5 volts. Each horizontal division is 1 milli second :-
Low
Medium
High
From these you can see that there is a pulse just under every 4 milli seconds giving a frequency of about 250 to 300 Hz. so you should not see any flickering.
On high the emitter is direct driven but the electricity must pass through the driver power transistor and other parts so it does not get full battery voltage.
The emitter positive wire goes directly to the battery positive. The emitter negative wire goes to the tab (same as centre pin) on the transistor and the battery negative goes to the transistor right hand pin.
The following description is in comparison to the L2D.
Usability
Clicky is well protected so hard to turn on accidentally.
There is a hole in the tailcap for a lanyard.
Modes are changed by slightly pressing the clicky.
I found it took a couple of presses to change modes sometimes but that seems to be getting better with use.
The memory is set to the last mode used for over a couple of seconds.
The sequence is high, mid, low, strobe and SOS. I find the L2D system with low, mid, high, SOS and tighten head for turbo and strobe suits me better.
Low is slightly lower so good for close up work and the battery will last forever.
Can tail stand but Clicky rubber protrudes slightly making it wobbly (L2D is the same).
Beam has a large hotspot which fades out to a wide useable flood area.
The small head diameter means it can not throw very far considering the output from the LED but it is still impressive.
Being the same length and only 40mm diameter means it can fit in pockets easy enough and is nice to hold.
Totally silent in all modes.
No flickering in any mode – except strobe of course.
Tint is much more blue or purple but I find the L2D has quite a green tint especially on the lower settings. Halfway between would be good but both are acceptable to me.
Build Quality
Clicky feels slightly dampened which to me seems less robust.
Threads good.
2 "O" rings at each end of the body making it hard to screw the ends on due to a tight fit. The head end had a thicker "O" ring (as shown in the picture) making it hard to start the thread. I swapped the 2 "O" rings around and now it is much easier to assemble.
The head can be unscrewed a few turns which moves the reflector forward from the LED. I hoped this would alter the beam focus but it only reduced the brightness without changing the beam size. Possibly a modified reflector could be used to make the beam focusable.
Lens and OP reflector are held in place by a knurled ring screwed in to the front. Not sure how waterproof this is. As the ring is about 6mm deep the lens is quite well protected.
Lens is glass.
The heatsink is made of brass and seems to transfer heat to the body very well. Copper or even aluminium would conduct the heat better but unless you intend to modify the driver it should be OK. You shouldn't need gloves to keep your hands warm with this torch. It does not get uncomfortable to hold using high, at least not on a damp October night in England.
Trustfire protected batteries easily fit in the body. It has a spring contact at both ends. There is a slight rattle if you shake the torch but nothing to worry about.
Anodising looks fine.
The pill can be removed by unscrewing.
The P7 LED is easily accessed by unscrewing the head so should be no problem to replace.
The tail cap does not have a radius on the head end which makes it feel quite sharp. This is the only part of the design that I don't like but it is not a problem and improves the grip.
Good Points
Price
Quality for the money
Light output for the size
Easy to replace LED
Good heatsink
Bad Points
Clicky possibly not the best
Cannot use AA batteries
Comes without spare parts
Conclusions
I bought the P7-D from DX along with protected batteries and a charger. All arrived within 3 weeks and cost about the same as my L2D. It came without any accessories or spares. It seems a big step to go from AAs to 18650 batteries but when you get this much extra light it has to be done. MTE quality seems good enough and is a lot better than the price suggests. I expect a similar battery life for all 3 torches of around 45mins on high. If I think I will need more battery life then a lower setting is usually still good enough. The L2D will remain my EDC torch (mainly due to its size) but if I know I will need a torch before I go out then the P7-D will be my first choice.
Here are a load of pictures including some beamshots. I have tried to arrange the beamshots for easy comparison of settings. Apologies for the poor quality of the beam shots but my camera does not have manual settings so focus is off and the exposures may vary. You should still be able to get a reasonable comparison though. The photos outside were taken soon after it had rained making the black cobbles very dark.
Romisen - L2D Low - MTE Low
Romisen - L2D High - MTE Medium
Romisen - L2D Turbo - MTE High
Control
Romisen
L2D Low
MTE Low
L2D Medium
L2D High
MTE Medium
L2D Turbo
MTE High
L2D Turbo
MTE High
L2D Turbo
MTE High
Update
The Driver gave up on me and I had to get the torch replaced :shakehead, so the following refers to the new torch.
The replacement is externally the same except the lens retaining ring is not knurled and it's a bit deeper. It also came with a lanyard which the original never had.
*There is a different mode order, which is - Medium-Low-High-Strobe-SOS
*Also it doesn't have the last mode memory function.
The only problem I have found is when changing modes it's very hit and miss now as it often skips modes. The power characteristics seem very close to the old torch so I have added new electrical info above to my original readings.
Of course I had to take it apart to check for any other differences. Unlike the first torch, the threads for the head had been glued which made it very hard to unscrew but once removed and cleaned up was fine. The pill on the other hand was loose and easily unscrewed. The reflector is slightly too long and presses down onto the emitter when you tighten the head (maybe the reason for glueing the threads).
The emitter protective dome is a bit cloudy unlike the other one which was very clear.
Looking closely at the heatsink I could see a small gap between the heatsink and the Emitter PCB - not good for heat transfer. A good excuse to take the pill apart. Emitter PCB and driver PCB were easy to remove with a soldering iron and a couple of small screwdrivers. The driver was held in by solder and a small amount of fairly soft glue. The gap was caused by two small burrs next to the wire holes on the front of the heatsink (marking the back of the emitter PCB). There was thermal paste in the gap which has been cleaned off for the photos. Another problem for good heat transfer was where the middle of the heatsink has been ground away to remove the spike left from machining on a lathe. This has left quite a big hollow which ideally should be removed.
The heatsink has room for a larger driver - it could be upto 10mm long and 16mm diameter with a 17mm diameter PCB. If you intend to direct drive the emitter by bypassing the driver then a copper disc (small copper coins would do) could be soldered into the heatsink to improve cooling.
MTE P7-D A Basic Review
After browsing CPF for some time now, I have decided it's time to help others by adding a review of my own. I would not class myself as a flashaholic but as I have night blindness, torches are very important to me.
This review is for people, who are interested in the P7-D and need some basic info to help decide if it is going to be their next torch. There is some technical information as well for people interested in modding.
I have read some reviews about other MTE P7 torches but could not find anything specific to the P7-D. I am comparing it to my little Romisen and the Fenix L2D, which many CPFers have seen and used (the L2D is the standard that I will probably judge all other torches by). The Romisen is totally outclassed but is used as a control in the beamshots.
Basic specs.
Romisen RC-H3
Modes ----------------------------------- Single
Switching -------------------------------- Forward Clicky
Lumens --------------------------------- About 15 and not 225 - as stated by the Ebay seller (rather optimistic to say the least)
Battery ---------------------------------- 1 x AA
LED ------------------------------------ Cree P4
Length ---------------------------------- 95mm
Diam. ----------------------------------- 20mm
Price ----------------------------------- (DX) $13.50 (US)
[link removed - DM51]
Comments ----------------------------- My work EDC but now taken over by my girlfriend as her handbag Torch!
Fenix L2d Premium 100
Modes -------------------------------- 5 - Low, Mid, High, Turbo, Strobe and SOS
Switching ------------------------------ Reverse Clicky and Head turning
Lumens ------------------------------- 11, 50, 100 and 175
Battery -------------------------------- 2 x AA
LED ---------------------------------- Luxeon Rebel 100
Length -------------------------------- 147mm
Diam. --------------------------------- 21mm
Price ---------------------------------- Discontinued (replaced by Cree Q5 version (DX) $66 (US))
[link removed - DM51]
Comments ---------------------------- An almost perfect EDC torch for me.
MTE P7-D
Modes ------------------------------- 5 (with last used memory) High, Mid, Low. Strobe and SOS - Check update below*
Switching ---------------------------- Reverse Clicky
Lumens ------------------------------ 600, 150. 10 (Approximations using the L2D as a Reference)
Battery ------------------------------ 1 x 18650
LED --------------------------------- SSC P7
Length ------------------------------- 146mm
Diam. ------------------------------- 40mm Head, 29mm Body
Price -------------------------------- (DX) $48 (US)
[link removed - DM51]
Comments -------------------------- A poor mans HID
MTE Power Characteristics
Here are my readings which should give ball park figures. 0.4 Ohms total meter leads resistance.
Setting & Unloaded Battery Voltage ------------- High ------- Med ------- Low ----- Battery Volts
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 0.3A ------ 0.11A ----- 0.01A --------- 3.15v
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 1.45A ----- 0.18A ----- 0.02A --------- 3.73v
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 1.55A ----- 0.19A ----- 0.03A --------- 3.8v
Battery Amps ----------------------------------- 2.25A ----- 0.26A ----- 0.03A --------- 4.15v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 2.8v ------- 2.42v ------ 2.2v ----------- 3.15v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 3.12v ----- 2.47v ------ 2.21v ---------- 3.73v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 3.14v ----- 2.49v ------ 2.24v ---------- 3.75v
LED Voltage ----------------------------------- 3.25v ----- 2.48v ------ 2.22v ---------- 4.15v
Here are some photos of my oscilloscope screen when hooked upto the P7 Emitter. They show how the PWM changes with different modes. The bottom of the scale is 0 volts and each vertical division is 0.5 volts. Each horizontal division is 1 milli second :-
Low
Medium
High
From these you can see that there is a pulse just under every 4 milli seconds giving a frequency of about 250 to 300 Hz. so you should not see any flickering.
On high the emitter is direct driven but the electricity must pass through the driver power transistor and other parts so it does not get full battery voltage.
The emitter positive wire goes directly to the battery positive. The emitter negative wire goes to the tab (same as centre pin) on the transistor and the battery negative goes to the transistor right hand pin.
The following description is in comparison to the L2D.
Usability
Clicky is well protected so hard to turn on accidentally.
There is a hole in the tailcap for a lanyard.
Modes are changed by slightly pressing the clicky.
I found it took a couple of presses to change modes sometimes but that seems to be getting better with use.
The memory is set to the last mode used for over a couple of seconds.
The sequence is high, mid, low, strobe and SOS. I find the L2D system with low, mid, high, SOS and tighten head for turbo and strobe suits me better.
Low is slightly lower so good for close up work and the battery will last forever.
Can tail stand but Clicky rubber protrudes slightly making it wobbly (L2D is the same).
Beam has a large hotspot which fades out to a wide useable flood area.
The small head diameter means it can not throw very far considering the output from the LED but it is still impressive.
Being the same length and only 40mm diameter means it can fit in pockets easy enough and is nice to hold.
Totally silent in all modes.
No flickering in any mode – except strobe of course.
Tint is much more blue or purple but I find the L2D has quite a green tint especially on the lower settings. Halfway between would be good but both are acceptable to me.
Build Quality
Clicky feels slightly dampened which to me seems less robust.
Threads good.
2 "O" rings at each end of the body making it hard to screw the ends on due to a tight fit. The head end had a thicker "O" ring (as shown in the picture) making it hard to start the thread. I swapped the 2 "O" rings around and now it is much easier to assemble.
The head can be unscrewed a few turns which moves the reflector forward from the LED. I hoped this would alter the beam focus but it only reduced the brightness without changing the beam size. Possibly a modified reflector could be used to make the beam focusable.
Lens and OP reflector are held in place by a knurled ring screwed in to the front. Not sure how waterproof this is. As the ring is about 6mm deep the lens is quite well protected.
Lens is glass.
The heatsink is made of brass and seems to transfer heat to the body very well. Copper or even aluminium would conduct the heat better but unless you intend to modify the driver it should be OK. You shouldn't need gloves to keep your hands warm with this torch. It does not get uncomfortable to hold using high, at least not on a damp October night in England.
Trustfire protected batteries easily fit in the body. It has a spring contact at both ends. There is a slight rattle if you shake the torch but nothing to worry about.
Anodising looks fine.
The pill can be removed by unscrewing.
The P7 LED is easily accessed by unscrewing the head so should be no problem to replace.
The tail cap does not have a radius on the head end which makes it feel quite sharp. This is the only part of the design that I don't like but it is not a problem and improves the grip.
Good Points
Price
Quality for the money
Light output for the size
Easy to replace LED
Good heatsink
Bad Points
Clicky possibly not the best
Cannot use AA batteries
Comes without spare parts
Conclusions
I bought the P7-D from DX along with protected batteries and a charger. All arrived within 3 weeks and cost about the same as my L2D. It came without any accessories or spares. It seems a big step to go from AAs to 18650 batteries but when you get this much extra light it has to be done. MTE quality seems good enough and is a lot better than the price suggests. I expect a similar battery life for all 3 torches of around 45mins on high. If I think I will need more battery life then a lower setting is usually still good enough. The L2D will remain my EDC torch (mainly due to its size) but if I know I will need a torch before I go out then the P7-D will be my first choice.
Here are a load of pictures including some beamshots. I have tried to arrange the beamshots for easy comparison of settings. Apologies for the poor quality of the beam shots but my camera does not have manual settings so focus is off and the exposures may vary. You should still be able to get a reasonable comparison though. The photos outside were taken soon after it had rained making the black cobbles very dark.
Romisen - L2D Low - MTE Low
Romisen - L2D High - MTE Medium
Romisen - L2D Turbo - MTE High
Control
Romisen
L2D Low
MTE Low
L2D Medium
L2D High
MTE Medium
L2D Turbo
MTE High
L2D Turbo
MTE High
L2D Turbo
MTE High
Update
The Driver gave up on me and I had to get the torch replaced :shakehead, so the following refers to the new torch.
The replacement is externally the same except the lens retaining ring is not knurled and it's a bit deeper. It also came with a lanyard which the original never had.
*There is a different mode order, which is - Medium-Low-High-Strobe-SOS
*Also it doesn't have the last mode memory function.
The only problem I have found is when changing modes it's very hit and miss now as it often skips modes. The power characteristics seem very close to the old torch so I have added new electrical info above to my original readings.
Of course I had to take it apart to check for any other differences. Unlike the first torch, the threads for the head had been glued which made it very hard to unscrew but once removed and cleaned up was fine. The pill on the other hand was loose and easily unscrewed. The reflector is slightly too long and presses down onto the emitter when you tighten the head (maybe the reason for glueing the threads).
The emitter protective dome is a bit cloudy unlike the other one which was very clear.
Looking closely at the heatsink I could see a small gap between the heatsink and the Emitter PCB - not good for heat transfer. A good excuse to take the pill apart. Emitter PCB and driver PCB were easy to remove with a soldering iron and a couple of small screwdrivers. The driver was held in by solder and a small amount of fairly soft glue. The gap was caused by two small burrs next to the wire holes on the front of the heatsink (marking the back of the emitter PCB). There was thermal paste in the gap which has been cleaned off for the photos. Another problem for good heat transfer was where the middle of the heatsink has been ground away to remove the spike left from machining on a lathe. This has left quite a big hollow which ideally should be removed.
The heatsink has room for a larger driver - it could be upto 10mm long and 16mm diameter with a 17mm diameter PCB. If you intend to direct drive the emitter by bypassing the driver then a copper disc (small copper coins would do) could be soldered into the heatsink to improve cooling.
Last edited:
