What’s up with vapcell batts?

jon_slider

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How do they get more mah?
I think one tradeoff is, more mAh has lower Maximum Discharge rate...
another tradeoff is Protection and USB charging consume space:
ZObahR7.jpg
 

raggie33

*the raggedier*
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I can deal with 3 amps hect in my zebra I don't think she pulls over 3=amps not sure on my ts10;
 

Ocelot808

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I've had spectacular results with the Vapcell F12 in my CuTiTS-10 and BlueTiTS-10. Running "JS Approved" (tm) Anduril2 settings of "turbo" disabled / max ceiling 100. Easily 20%+ runtime improvements over the included stock cell.

The F12 performs very well with <3 Amp loads, but anything over that there's huge amounts of voltage sag and capacity reduction. So it's a Goldilocks match for a ts10 with reduced output limits (to Slider specs, naturally 🤔 😀).

Cheers to Jon for being such an incredibly helpful fellow! 👍
 

vicv

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the stock battery is 3A max, 900mAh

I dont know what the battery ingredients recipe difference is from the
3A max, 1250mAh of the Vapcel F12
Just because it says three amp max, does not mean that's all you can draw from it. All it means is that it's only designed to have 3 A continuous run through it. there's no protection circuit on it that stops more current. 10 amp cell will generally be a little bit brighter with a fet, only because the higher drain cell is lower internal resistance, so less voltage sag. Since the TS 10 only draws on turbo for about 15 seconds before it starts stepping down. It should be safe for the cell as it is a burst. But that cell can supply a lot more than 3 A, also, there is no way on earth that it is making 1400 lm with 3 A. That is just not possible. That means each emitter is putting out at least 500 lm for one amp. If that was the case, that would be the only LED used in all lights because it would be so good. And that light puts out 1400 lm through the optic. I don't know how much the LEDs are actually producing but probably closer to 1700 at least.
 
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jon_slider

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Just because it says three amp max, does not mean that's all you can draw from it.
thanks for the education, Im definitely a bit confused about that.
imo Turbo is just for Marketing, has no practical value to me..

Turbo falls off really quickly, makes excess heat, drains the battery faster, and causes thermal step down to even lower levels than the light could have maintained if it was not Preheated by Turbo.. Plus Turbo constricts my pupils more, so lower light levels seem even dimmer..

Turbo is Totally counter productive for my personal priorities, which include runtime, and sustainable output. Turbo is just a Lead Ballon, and marketing hype, even if the output claim is actually true..

here we can see the TS10 hit 1345 Lumens.. momentary max.. its a 4000K LED.. I think the 6000K version could pick up the extra 65 lumens to hit 1400 momentary max, but it would still drop like a rock:

from this zeroair review
zeroair_reviews_wurkkos_ts10_red_body_86-2048x1535.png
 

vicv

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Yeah, in my set up my 4000 K is only getting about 1250 lm. But I barely use turbo either it is just for marketing. I still find it handy though when wanting a big burst of light to view something further away when I've brought the wrong light. Lol.

About the cell. A lithium ion cell has a max continuous discharge rate. You've probably seen it as CDR. What that means, is that the manufacturer is making a claim that that cell should not have a load put on it more than 3 A continuously, if you want it to still be at 80% of the original capacity after 500 full cycles. Or something like that different chemistries and manufacturers have different cycle rates.
It does not mean that the cell cannot put out more than 3 A, just that it is not very good for it in long-term. There will also be a burst discharge rate, which will probably be somewhere around 6 to 7 A for 15 seconds for the cell. But I have not seen a spec sheet for it so I am just giving numbers.
In this case, that poor cell is being hit pretty hard on Turbo. And I don't imagine that if someone used it a lot, it would still be at 80% capacity after 500 cycles. But that's what we sacrifice for power right? Lol.
I have not seen a test done for the particular emitters in this light. But I believe the closest one available from a major manufacturer is the Nichia e17a. That LED requires 2 A to produce 500 lm. Three of them would be 1500 lm and 6 A total. Now I'm not saying the TS10 is the same numbers, as again I don't have a reference for that emitter. And with the electronic tail switch, it would be quite difficult to do a current reading. But I bet it's somewhere between 6 and 8 A
 

raggie33

*the raggedier*
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I like turbo I like it in case I'm camping and hear a. Scary noise turbo allows me to check what it is. . It's Carey how good modern lights are lol who recall them basic 2 d red caped lights? I'd guess 7 lumens lol and we was happy with it
 

jon_slider

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I have not seen a test done for the particular emitters in this light. But I believe the closest one available from a major manufacturer is the Nichia e17a. That LED requires 2 A to produce 500 lm. Three of them would be 1500 lm and 6 A total.
thanks or the education

does the LED determine the max draw through the battery, and not vice versa?

for example:
could a TS10 with three 519a LEDs (I think rated for 6A), "pull" 18A out of a 3A battery?
 

vicv

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thanks or the education

does the LED determine the max draw through the battery, and not vice versa?

for example:
could a TS10 with three 519a LEDs (I think rated for 6A), "pull" 18A out of a 3A battery?
It could. But it's not unlimited. Eventually you'd hit an equilibrium where the current draw matches the voltage sag of the cell plus other flashlight resistance. As current to the led goes up, so does the voltage required to push that current. While at the same time, the voltage of the cell is dropping due to load. That's why a vapcell L10 would be brighter than the Wurkkos cell. But neither of these cells I believe would provide the voltage required for 18A. A Molicell 42A may be able to though with low host resistance though.

Now if you created a dead short on the Wurkkos cel it may draw 18A. Briefly.

But to answer your original question, it's a combination of both.
 
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