LEO's - feedback on LED light please?

I am developing a range of lights with LEO's being one of the target markets. I am using the Pelican 8060 as a model to base the light on. Here is a size comparison:



Preliminary Specs:
1. 2x D cell - easy availability of power sources, specifically alkaline cells.
2. Overall length: 7.25 in. (8060 is 8.6 in.)
3. Plain OR optional SS crenellated bezel. Plain bezel will indicate that light is on when stood on the head.
4. Optional tail-standing cap - tactical (non-recessed, shown) standard.
5. Sequential Multi-mode - Hi, Mid, Lo, Flare (fast 8-10Hz strobe), Beacon (slow 1Hz strobe). Starts in Hi mode.
6. Projected run times on 2 D alkaline cells: Hi 12 hours (150 lumens), Mid 30 hours (60 lumens), Lo 160 hours (12 lumens), Flare 24 hours, Beacon 30 hours.
7. All metal contruction (7075-T6), type III HA.
8. Anti-roll head, lanyard and wrist strap attachment.

Comments and suggestions from LEO's (and others) appreciated, thanks.

I would suggest having a rechargable base you can just attach the light to without removing the battery, similar to the strion. Have a non-proprietary battery in a size you can buy common replacements for, i.e. 18650. 1" body for weapon mounting options, multiple modes via a twist head (allowing the option for hi only with no mode switching) for tactical apps. Forward clicky. Full brightness with the head tightened, lower brightness when the head is loosened with multiple modes if possible (general, 60 lumens and low,15 or 10 lumens, maybe lower). Recessed switch so the light can tailstand. Maybe a ring that allows cigar grip for rogers/surefire grip.

IMO that would be perfect.

A couple of quick points on your ideas from my personal experience.

I think any LEO lights should be rechargeable, or at least have the option to be utilised with rechargeable cells, the amount of use that our lights get using primary cells only gets rather expensive.

D size cells do make a thick light, maybe a smaller option may be looked at, however the length looks pretty good. Another option that might be worth thinking of is to make the bezel compatiable with a traffic wand.

Personally i would like to see high brighter, I don't see the need for a 12 hour run time on high, if it means you have to sacrifice output, especially in a multi level light and one that can be run on primary cells. To me high should be exactly that.

One last point, I am not sure how what option you have looked at to change modes, but I dislike modes changes with one click of the switch. Sometimes we press the switch multiple times in a short period, if it changes immediately between modes during this time it can be quite annoying. Personally for a duty light I prefer a single mode light, if it has mutliple modes (more isn't always better) then I like to see them hidden in the switch mode or have a changing method that isn't involved in the switch.

Just my 2 cents worth. Others will probably disagree with some of these.

I switched over to rechargeable flashlights for work at least 20 years ago.

Consider using a rechargeable battery pack that fits some other brand of light whose name is not spoken

Consider 2 switches. One for on/off and one for mode changes.

Make sure there is a ring, holster or holder available to hang or hold the flashlight on a belt or in a car.

Good luck bringing a full size light to market. Most cops carry smaller lights and those that don't seem to think that lights only come from 2 companies.

Anto said:

Maybe a ring that allows cigar grip for rogers/surefire grip.

IMO that would be perfect.

Click to expand...

I think 8.6 inches is a bit too long for those.

Ditch the multi-mode. From experience, it's rarely used.

D cells are too big. I'd suggest C's or a Sub-c size battery stick (rechargeable).

I have the following rechargeable LED flashlights:

Inova T4 (original)

Pelican 7060

Streamlight Stinger LED

I have had the Inova the longest and is my wife's flashlight. It it a good light, but was clearly surpassed in my opinion by the Pelican 7060. The Pelican is flat out bright and has great throw. The Stinger LED is issued by my SO. It is a good light and the strobe is neat, but I am not assigned to patrol, so that functionality is sort of a novelty to me. They are similarly sized to one another and I think they are sort of the size to have right now. For me in law enforcement rechargeable in a cradle is a must. I know many people here are quick to point out that any flashlight can be rechargeable with the correct batteries and a charger. While that may very well be true, for cop work charging in the cradle is a huge benefit. I also happen to like lithium ion battery technology, but that can be more controversial. With the cut off circuitry it can leave you with no light. While I do like the visual warning that you get on the 7060 that it is about to shut down, it may not be as useful as a Stinger LED with nickle cadmium that simply reduces light output.

6.5-7 inches, no bigger than C size. Sucks when the kidneys and back hurt from being beaten by your own light on your belt.

Ability to charge in cradle or battery's for quick change if needed would be nice.

I think multi mode would be best if you could change the mode while the light is off. Anti roll design for sure. I'm not sure I would worry about a tail stander.

Oh yeh bright as possible to. Now that i think about it a I agree with one of the members above one mode would be great, but I think then add a low-low with a bezel twist or whatever. I guess their is times you may want to navigate but not necessarily been seen half a mile away with 200+ lumens. Thats just some thoughts. There is so many different options I hope you come up with something good and I think its great your asking other people who use lights often.

Good Luck.

I speak from what I see in my department.

Everyone uses or will use cr123.

The multi-mode is a huge no no. You will put it in the General category with that. We all want and NEED tactical lights.

I don't know a single officer, other than this board, who knows what an 18650 is so that might be a concern.

In the end, your going to have to create something that's different from MagLites, Streamlights, Pelicans, etc. or your going to have a hard time competing.

No spell check.

BTW

a suggestion I had was making the light 18650/123 compatible.

however, you might want to watch out if you make the light externally rechargeable AND compatible with primaries. 18650 + external charger = okay, cr123 + external charger = kaboom

My immediate thought is that at that length a tactical tail cap type switch is not practical.

I have a 7060 and find it a bit long to use the tailcap switch easily

Department purchase considerations.

Rechargeable without removing battery. 110V, vehicle and a 110 v/220v charging stand that can accommodate a number of flashlights.

Modes. Hi. Medium, Low (enough light to write reports) Strobe. Officer must be able to see/feel mode light is in (something like the Inova inforce light).

Option for weapon mounting. Remote switch.

Red and white traffic wand.

Lanyard attachment point. Low battery warning.

Holster or quick release holder

You may want to consider offering two version that are the same size and use the same charger: One for general use, one mode only, second for special forces/SWAT that has multi mode.

I work strictly nights. For the last three years, I've used nothing but Wolf-Eyes, single mode lights. I don't think I would ever use a multi-mode. The MC-Explorer at 580lm, is awesome. I carry a Sniper for a backup in my pocket. Also in the squad is a Boxer 24W. For the big jobs, I have 2 HID spotlights, 35W and 55W. I work in the wilderness area of Northern Minnesota.
Charging tabs for the Wolf-Eyes would be great.
Dave

Thanks to all for the suggestions. Here is a summary:

1. Easy availability of power sources, such as D and C alkalines, is not a priority.
2. Long run times at full power, such as 12 hours, not a requirement.
3. Reachargeable power - without having to remove the batteries for charging.
4. D size too big, prefer C size as maximum.
5. Maximum length of 7in. - preferably 6in. or shorter.
6. Vehicle charger, and 110/220VAC single and multi-station charger.
7. Most prefer single-mode, as bright as possible. Some would like multi-mode.

It seems that the most contentious point is #7. Single or multi-mode, method of operation (UI), etc., vary with user. One solution that I see is to have the light compatible with P60 drop-in LED modules so the buyer can use whatever is available from aftermarket sources (Dereelight, Malkoff, Lumens Factory, DX, etc).

The configuration I have come up with is 142mm (5.59in.) long with a body diameter of 30mm that takes P60 drop-ins - a 150 lumen, 5-mode drop-in is standard (OR single mode 200 lumen optional). It will come with a built-in, single cell, 4,000mAH rechargeable 3.7V Lithium battery that can be charged without removing it from the light (cycle life of the battery is 1,000 charge/discharge cycles - replacements will be available). A 12V vehicle charger that plugs into the cigarette lighter socket will be provided as standard. Single station as well as multi-station (4 or 8 stations) mains operated chargers are optional. Here is a size comparison with a Pelican 8060 and a Surefire 6P.

Sounds pretty good. Good luck with your project and let us know how it go's. I'm not as technically smart as some folks on here but was wondering if its possible to have a light that uses a cradle charger but could also throw a set of primary's in if one knew he was about to use his/her light for extended time but needed to charge first.

I guess its kinda looking for the best of both worlds.

After running and being on my feet for 12+ hrs at a time I can tell you for sure that D cell lights are not my favorite.

As for rechargeable lights, I have gone back to conventional cells after having a battery fail on me when I needed it most (memory on cells). Its nice to throw the light in a charger when you get home and expect its at full when you go back on shift but almost impossible to know or predict when your battery pack is going to go out on you. At least with conventional I can usually tell when my cells are getting beat. Considering our department also started carrying CR123A batteries, it is no longer a cost issue.

The light output is an area that I would like to see be adjustable. I have times where my light is not only my search tool but then the same night I am outside of my patrol car attempting to complete paperwork with the same 200 lumen retinal buster.

Build is a major factor due to having lights dropped, used as wedges or impact tools (anyone that says otherwise is too damn prissy to even speak up).

The last factor that is very important to me is making it so that I can find a CASE that will fit on my duty belt and match my other gear so I wont have to hear feedback from my Sgt during role call. Holders seem to be manufactured only for the standard few. Currently I am carrying the Fenix TA30 stuffed in a Streamlight Stinger pouch.

If you would like any street reviews I have a bunch of guys that would be glad to tear into it.

Thanks,
Frank

C cell or Sub C cell battery stick Nickel Metal Hydride (NiHm battery please) it doesn't have a memory like the Nicad battery like Streamlight uses in the Stinger. If it does have a secondary mode with a strobe make sure the it is compatible with a available cone for traffic control direction (this is what I use my led Stinger DS for is mainly traffic control). No sharp crenelated bezel it could be a liability issue, if it must have one make sure they are smooth and are similar to the ones on say a SF A2 . Just my 2 cents. PS if you need a beta tester I'm willing.

Anto said:

I would suggest having a rechargable base you can just attach the light to without removing the battery, similar to the strion. Have a non-proprietary battery in a size you can buy common replacements for, i.e. 18650. 1" body for weapon mounting options, multiple modes via a twist head (allowing the option for hi only with no mode switching) for tactical apps. Forward clicky. Full brightness with the head tightened, lower brightness when the head is loosened with multiple modes if possible (general, 60 lumens and low,15 or 10 lumens, maybe lower). Recessed switch so the light can tailstand. Maybe a ring that allows cigar grip for rogers/surefire grip.

IMO that would be perfect.

Click to expand...

I would buy 3 of these. I agree that would be a kick *** light. Except, I'm still not sure about the multi mode feature.


Something else to consider is that some departments, including mine old one, no longer allow officers to carry METAL flashlights.

Some departments don't want officers hitting suspects with their Mag lights, so metal flashlights have been banned. They figure your baton is there for that reason.... yet your flashlight is what is most likely to be in your hand when a fight breaks out. :shrug:

This is why my old department issues the Pelican 7060. LED, Rechargeable and plastic. :ironic: